Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Gauchos Pesados

This page is an archive of the proposed deletion of the article below. Further comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete. --Tony Sidaway|Talk 05:05, 31 July 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Gauchos Pesados

Vanity page? Definitely not remarkable, 6 Google matches. On the other hand, not everything is on the net, and the article is self-contained, complete and well written. Nevertheless, I propose to delete it.--Marianocecowski 15:11, 18 May 2005 (UTC)

• Delete, Vanity of non remarcable music group. --Marianocecowski 15:11, 18 May 2005 (UTC)
• Keep ¿Non remarcable music group?. It's the group that initiated the genre that later made bands like Ráfaga become famous worldwide. The group itself is not famous, but at least you can link it from the glamorous cumbia article. This band used to have a web page, years ago when they were a little famous in their region. The legacy is the music they invented, not the band work itself. It deserved, at least, to be a link from "glamorous cumbia". Remember that some people and some places are not so computerized. I'm not related to any person of the band. Even more, I never got the chance to talk to them. I don't live near their area. On the other side, it's true that I was and I still am a fan of the band and that I like their music. But people that reads the glamorous cumbia article perhaps want to know about the creators of the genre. Another example: Nobody remembers the group Smile, but it invented the style that Queen took to become famous. So, let's see if I explained myself: I don't want to argue, and I do not want to bother anyone. But this band deserves at least a link from the article of the musical genre. It's not vanity. It's history. Thank you. User:200.73.180.22
• Keep. It's a lower-class band from a country where net access is not as widespread as US- and Euro-centric Wikipedia POV seems to consider normal; it's far less likely to be indexed by Google. It certainly achieved some notoriety in its time; I don't think its being a local phenomenon precludes listing it in Wikipedia. Taragui 07:24, Jun 7, 2005 (UTC)
• Delete. Allmusic is not aware of them and Google has limited records. As a contemporary band that has supposedly released a number of albums, one would think that there would be more than six Google hits. Google indexes what is present. Argentina has a reasonable internet presence. I suspect a hoax with little verifiable information. The "glamorous cumbria" seems suspicious too. Capitalistroadster 04:53, 14 July 2005 (UTC)
• Delete. Article does not establish that the information within is verifiable and without any allmusic.com presence or any other substantiation, I must vote delete. Gamaliel 05:06, 14 July 2005 (UTC)
• Well, they wouldn't be the first little-heard yet influential band (Pylon, New York Dolls, etc.), but unless cites showing their influence can be provided, delete. Dcarrano 05:23, July 14, 2005 (UTC)
• Delete per above royblumy 06:14, July 14, 2005 (UTC)
• Delete non notable band. Fails WP:MUSIC guidelines. JamesBurns 09:53, 14 July 2005 (UTC)

Not entirely true: 2 - Has gone on an international concert tour, or a national concert tour in a large or medium-sized country*. -Mariano 10:24, July 14, 2005 (UTC)

• Delete : Non verifiable - would reconsider if some verifiable references are added to the article. A/B 'Shipper 女 ^(talk) 12:57, 14 July 2005 (UTC)
• Keep Probably more notable than many American bands which are kept. CalJW 16:43, 14 July 2005 (UTC)

• Probably? I'd gladly vote keep if someone actually produced some evidence that this assertion was true. Gamaliel 16:48, 14 July 2005 (UTC)

• Delete this article should be deleted for non-notoriety. If, in the future, however, the band is able to pass the google test then it should be allowed to stay.
• Keep Per [[1]]. Though "large or medium sized country" is undefined, I doubt Argentina would fail to meet the criteria. siafu 22:58, 14 July 2005 (UTC)
• Comment. I have now done a Google search for this band [2]. There are no references to this band locatable from a Google search other than Wikimedia and its mirrors. This heightens my concerns about the verifiability of this band. No change of vote from delete.Capitalistroadster 23:42, 14 July 2005 (UTC)
• Delete unverifiable per above, also no presence on allmusic.com so probably fails WP:MUSIC in any case. In case of hard evidence being obtained, I'll change my vote of course. -Splash 01:15, 15 July 2005 (UTC)
• Delete. Not verifiable, so deletion is required. Quale 07:10, 17 July 2005 (UTC)
• Delete. First. Most bands and singers in here are not on allmusic.com, while all of them exist with varying degrees of sucess in the argentine cumbia scene. The fact that the site of one of the main venues of the cumbia scene in Buenos Aires lists those bands makes me think they're rather on the "sucessful" section of "varying degrees of success", so I think the "is not in allmusic.com" argument to be faulty. Second, cumbia is a very low-class musical expression in argentina, a country which has around 50% of it's population living in poverty -hence no access to internet, let alone upload some page about some lesser known band-, so I consider the "no references on google" to be faulty too in this case. On a side note, the author seems too eager to put this thing here, and links the bands article to pages that shouldn't (ie: Cumbia, see talk:Cumbia for why I consider a lesser known band of Argentine Cumbia shouldn't be on that article). I don't know the band, perhaps because I hardly know the scene, but -personally- I wouldn't even consider including this article on wikipedia. On the other hand... meta:Wiki_is_not_paper#No_size_limits turns my opinion into Keep, sadly On a last comment, to User:200.73.180.22: Nobody remembers the group Smile, but it invented the style that Queen took to become famous., Smile turned into Queen, they're not unrelated. SpiceMan 06:09, 18 July 2005 (UTC)
• Comment. I had 4.910 hits of Google, not 6. Here is the direction. http://www.google.com.ar/search?hl=es&q=gauchos+pesados&meta=

But when looking for "gauchos pesados" I had 72 hits (http://www.google.com.ar/search?hl=es&q=%22gauchos+pesados%22&meta=). Try it if you want. 72 hits is enough for a band of a genre that is not very computerized. Google standards should be lower for less computerized places. On the other hand, I think people who remember this band is computerized, because, as I said on the article, glamorous cumbia was not for lower-class people, but for upper-class (take the example of Ráfaga, the best exponent of the glamorous cumbia genre, for which I made an article too). To say glamorous cumbia is a lower-class music is like saying that The Black Eyed Peas is a lower-class music in the United States. Everyone listen to them. And the same with Eminem. And another thing: don't be fooled with the statistics, because it may be true that 50 percent of people in Argentina lives in bad conditions. That is in the ugly zone of the country. But in Buenos Aires, Santa Fe, Córdoba and all the provinces of the South, people has a lot of money. Take myself for example: I don't have more money than all the people I know, but everyone in my town (including me) has everything (internet with a high connection, flat TV, DVD with home theatre, a nice house with garden and a swimming pool; and everyone has a third grade or university degree (I'm a publicist creative) and speaks at least spanish and english (I speak portuguese and italian too). But I'm not a millionaire. It's simply that this is the status in the richer zones of Argentina. So don't pay attention to the news that shows tha bad parts of the country. We're not mixed with lower-class people. They have their own provinces and cities, and rich people or people who lives well we have our own cities and towns (in my case, a private neighbourhood). So stop talking about Argentina like it is Camerun, Rwanda or Afganistan. It's not like this. Is a country formed by immigrants from Europe. And a great country, indeed (at least half of it).

those 4.910 are all either unrelated to the band or from wikipedia or it's mirrors. The 72 figure on "gauchos pesados" are all wikipedia articles the author has created or modified to include the band (Wikipedia or it's offsprings...) That is to say: 0 reference on it besides wikipedia. SpiceMan 16:13, 27 July 2005 (UTC)

• Keep.

Observations:

1. Nobody from the Argentine users have ever heard of the band.
2. All google hits are from the Wikipedia or mirrors of it.

-Mariano 07:03, 28 July 2005 (UTC)

• DELETE Note that this ip has been used to add numerous hoaxes, vandalized pages, add entries about nonnotable soccer teams (like neighborhood teams), misleading information, etc. See Blue tiger, Rana lechuza, Vandera, and the author's talk page User_talk:200.73.180.22 therefore I have grounds to believe that this non notable band is indeed not wikipedia material.

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in an undeletion request). No further edits should be made to this page.