Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Echelon (warez)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Keep (non-admin closure) — Caknuck 22:12, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Echelon (warez)

Echelon (warez) (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs) – (View log)

Non-notable, most of content is nonsense about something other than what the page is supposedly about. Jeff 16:08, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

• Delete Dubious claims at best, and the only thing remotely close to a reliable source is a single mention in a list of similar groups in a DOJ press release. Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 16:41, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
• Weak Keep - Somewhat notable for their "warez skills" Corpx 16:47, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
• Keep back when Dreamcast was new, Echelon was very popular. Almost every game was cracked by them. Second of all, I'm pretty damned sure there is a "list of warez groups" article around here somewhere, I saw it a few days ago. These guys are one of the most well known, if not THE most well known, Sega Dreamcast crackers. At least merge their info into the warez groups list. --sumnjim ^{talk with me·changes} 20:30, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
• Keep - This group gained a lot of press attention during the DoJ raids in 2004, and were rather notorious before that time. Antelan ^talk 21:31, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
• Comment. It might be worth considering whether precedent was set by Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/DEViANCE (2nd nomination), where we deleted a much better-known group. Heather 21:48, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

These may not be satisfactory, but there are sources which discuss this (although they do not focus on Echelon, hence my comment that these may not be satisfactory): USA Today, the DoJ, and MSNBC via the AP Wire. Antelan ^talk 21:59, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

• I'd also recommend reading the first nomination for Deviance. the 2nd one had barely any input, most likely from people who don't know anything about them. They were throwing around guidelines for deletion anyways. Read the first nomination, where there is alot more discussion, and mostly keep votes. To say that these guys are not notable is silly. Search Deviance + warez in google. many many hits. --sumnjim ^{talk with me·changes} 16:41, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Internet-related deletions. -- John Vandenberg 07:35, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ~~~~ Ƙɽɨɱρᶓȶ 01:26, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

• Weak Keep, but seems very much POV. Clean it up. --Dennis The Tiger (Rawr and stuff) 01:34, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
• Delete. The only reliable sources mention the article subject in passing. I don't think the number of search engine hits is relevant in this case. Kevin 01:49, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
• Keep Echelon was the target of a major DOJ investigation due to their prominence in the warez industry. The group is infamous and notable, especially in the global circle of piracy. The sources provided above go to show this. --74.73.16.230 03:03, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
• Keep per Sumnjim and 74.73.16.230. Also noteworthy is that Echelon was one of the main reasons the Dreamcast failed commercially. --Darkstar 10:42, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
• Merge with List of warez groups - a paragraph is all that is required here. Not sure about the link to cracked torrent d/loads either... does this violate WP:COPY? EyeSerene^TALK 18:16, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.