Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Dark Brotherhood (2nd nomination)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Delete; no consensus about where to merge. If anyone wants to merge it later, request a copy from me :) --Haemo (talk) 02:55, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Dark Brotherhood

Dark Brotherhood (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs) – (View log)

This article asserts no notability through reliable sources, and as such is just an in-universe repetition of plot elements from the Elder Scrolls games. As Wikipedia is not a gameguide, and this is all duplicative, this can be safely deleted. Judgesurreal777 (talk) 16:10, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

Besides, this article was previously deleted and is no more notable now than it was then. Judgesurreal777 (talk) 16:11, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

• Delete fails WP:FICTION. RMHED (talk) 18:04, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
• Delete Either delete it or the article arguably should be merged with either the Morrowind and/or Oblivion entries. Peter1968 (talk) 19:45, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
• Merge The problem is that there are other articles on fictional factions in the Morrowind/Oblivion universe, which are also considered for deletion. My suggestion is to either keep, source and cleanup the article (there are similar articles on fictional factions from the Star Wars, Stark Trek, etc. universe) or merge all faction articles in a strongly reduced form into one article called "Factions of Morrowind/Tamriel", for example. I've set up a page in my userspace where I'll work on the merged content today, you can find it here. mensch • t 11:21, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

While your at it, please look for references and development material, such as where did the developers of the game come up with these things? That is crucial to the articles long term survival. Judgesurreal777 16:38, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

• Keep Compared to some of the articles that enjoy life on Wikipedia, this one is fairly notable. I admit there might be a need to cleanup the article or make it clear that this is fiction but nothing that warrants the deletion of a fairly long, detailed article. Merging doesn't appear to be an option since the oblivion article is full and doesn't need anymore fat to reduce it's quality. Another possible option would be to create a large page for all of Oblivion's factions but unless someone is willing to do so I think this article should stay. There are worse offenders of notability such as the hundreds of pages devoted to Star Wars Extended Universe, a lot of messy articles like that all over this site. I don't consider this article terrible and it contributes to the reader's knowledge of the subject matter. TostitosAreGross (talk) 01:04, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

But why would we keep this article because its less terrible than other articles? Judgesurreal777 (talk) 01:07, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

No, I'm saying this isn't near bottom barrel(worthy of deletion) in terms of articles. It basically has one massive flaw, no references, which I admit is a problem, even though this information is on the level. This article shouldn't be deleted, it should be fixed, we shouldn't just quit on it. TostitosAreGross (talk) 01:14, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Unless it has references somewhere, I'm afriad it is a fatal flaw. The contention is that it doesn't have references now, it is that there aren't any references in existence, at least not in the form needed. Judgesurreal777 (talk) 03:27, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Actually that was what I was getting at. Imperial-library.com is an excellent source of information, as in everything in the article could be sourced. Anybody with the time and skill could throw in a couple sources, the lazy choice would be to delete this article, the wise choice would be to add sources, and maybe make the article less in-universe.TostitosAreGross (talk) 20:55, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Please read WP:FICTION, because those references you mention are not the ones needed to establish notability. Judgesurreal777 (talk) 21:09, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

• Merge as recommended by mensch. Ursasapien (talk) 07:45, 5 December 2007 (UTC)
• Delete - per nom. Gtstricky (talk) 16:33, 7 December 2007 (UTC)
• Note: Notification of this discussion has been added to the talk page for WikiProject The Elder Scrolls. --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 00:56, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.