Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Chenjesu

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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was KEEP. JodyB yak, yak, yak 19:08, 28 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Chenjesu

Chenjesu (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs) – (View log)

This is a non-notable fictional race in a computer game.

I am also nominating all the pages in Category:Star Control races, of which Chenjesu is a good example, for the same reason.Yannick 03:16, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

  • Redirect to Star Control Giggy UCP 03:25, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep -- Star Control II regularly shows up on many "greatest game of all time" lists (see the page for a couple). Given the overall notability of the game, and the fact that the diversity and interest of the various races in the game is often cited as a reason for it being such a great game, I think that having pages on the individual races is not unreasonable. --FourteenDays 06:11, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep, the Star Control franchise (and particularly Star Control II) are one of the most popular games of their type from that era, references to it are common even today. Deletion of all this material is IMO completely unwarranted, could you explain what basis you have for claiming it's "non-notable"? You simply assert this without any evidence or arguments to back it up. I might consider a merge into one of those giant omnibus lists that seem to be increasingly popular these days, maybe, but I don't think it would be an improvement over separate articles and it certainly wouldn't be a deletion. Bryan Derksen 07:43, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
No single Star Control race has received significant coverage in reliable sources. This is the definition of notability in Wikipedia. I do not dispute that the game itself is notable, but the races are not.--Yannick 15:57, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Merge all to a List of Star Control races article. While I see that the notable nature of this game means such information should be covered, I don't feel the current depth of coverage is justified. JulesH 12:10, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Merge all to List of Star Control races, then consider merging that to Star Control or Star Control II. Alba 13:55, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Merge all to a list article or to the game articles. Appearances in rather prominent games mean they're significant enough to discuss in some capacity; however, they're not really prominent enough for articles of their own. Definitely notable enough for a list... somewhere. --wwwwolf (barks/growls) 19:54, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep. While I can see the validity of merging to a List of Star Control species article, turning them into redirects would be an immense disservice. As a commonly nominated "best game" with 3 installments in the series, it is certainly notable. Further, merging the data, even trimmed down, into Star Control or Star Control II would bloat the article to the point that someone who wanted to get any details on the game or the species would have to shuffle through the article forever. Considering the rather well-developed backstory of some of these species, such as the Ur Quan, separate articles for some of these species the least should be considered, even in the event of a List article being created. Tavish 18:37, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Merge all Merging was done for more famous franchises, e.g. Races of The Elder Scrolls. --Voidvector 00:35, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep as per Tavish's points Pseudo Intellectual 06:58, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep as per Tavish's points. AND if that's not enough, you can always move it to Chenjesu (star control franchise) or somesuch. cow_2001 13:38, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Merge all to a race article, if that means Keeping them for now and taking more time to do it then so be it. A lot of these articles contain excessively detailed in-universe information, a lot of the articles also have a seperate section for the ships of that race (again, excessively detailed in-universe). By the time this unsuitable material is trimmed and the prose is sharpened they should all fit just fine and everyone wins. If the major races need to keep seperate articles then great, but there's no way all of these need seperate articles.QuagmireDog 16:38, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep. From a pragmatic standpoint, the coverage works better as separate articles. I don't think that the Elder Scrolls list is applicable; the majority of the races there are simplistic elf-, beast-man or human variants with only a couple of lines to say about them. The Star Control aliens are far more - er - alien, and most are significantly more elaborate. It takes its share of space to give a race such as the Mycon a description that's of any use. As for the various kinds of Ur-Quan, I admit that those could use a trim, but as it inducted them into a collection of the most memorable antagonists in the entire history of video games, Gamespot described them with: "Even now, we are hard-pressed to find a race of adversaries as complex and three-dimensional as the Ur-quan."

    I went through race articles and, by and large, did not find their coverage needlessly detailed. There are some problems but that, as usual, is a matter for cleanup. Having ship descriptions is by no means excessive: the series is a hybrid, its strategy/adventure/diplomacy (depends on the installment) is built around ship-to-ship combat - heck, the local #1 gaming magazine reviewed the first Star Control as an excellent one-on-one battle game with a supplementary strategic campaign. It's a vital central part. Also note that literally every class of ship has its unique features, usually characteristic of and sometimes vital to the race in question. Naturally some of them can be overly long, but fixing that is an order of magnitude removed from wiping them all altogether. --Kizor 23:51, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep or merge. Probably keep. There are around 50 of these races (and articles thereof), and merging them into a single page would create pressure for shortening the description of each dramatically (otherwise the page would be really long). It would reduce the information value. Thus I think keeping them separate is better. Bisqwit 20:37, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep. I actually finally made a wikipedia account to vote on this one (so pardon my newness), as this game is a classic (that still lives on in the 'ur quan masters' version) and each race is so fleshed out and important to the gameplay that losing this information would make it almost impossible to find otherwise. And trying to explain these races to a friend (which is how I found this page) would be impossible without wikipedia short of having them spend a few hundred hours playing the game.Thephoenix5 03:35, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep, as per prior arguments. I find your referring to something as non-notable without even bothering to give an example of why you consider it so moderately insulting to the topic in question. THis would be like deciding Klingons were non-notable.HalfShadow 21:44, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
No single Star Control race has received significant coverage in reliable sources. This is the definition of notability in Wikipedia. Klingons and Star Control are notable, but the Star Control races are not.--Yannick 00:16, 28 July 2007 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.