Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Butt Rock

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was Delete. Not many votes, but those who explicitly voted, voted delete. Deathphoenix 16:38, 3 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Butt Rock

It isn't an actual genre of music, it is just a derogatory phrase used to describe Glam metal, which is already mentioned in said Glam metal article - Deathrocker 07:10, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

• This afd nomination was orphaned. Listing now. —Crypticbot (operator) 15:22, 28 January 2006 (UTC)
• Deathrocker, is this a delete vote or a redirect proposal? If it's the latter, then go ahead and do it. (Please do not submit redirect proposals here in "articles for deletion" and save people time and effort.) Thanks. --Perfecto 16:21, 28 January 2006 (UTC)
• Delete as unverifiable, for the moment. Stifle 14:11, 30 January 2006 (UTC)

There is currently no Butt Rock or Glam Metal category when searching for music at any reputible record store. Deathrocker is expressing distain for the term based on personal bias. Butt Rock is a commonly used phrase in Western Culture. Many word usages are derivitives of slang (ie; Glam Metal) and have a current cultural meaning and value. If we are going to completely delete Butt Rock from Wikipedia then we must follow through with that line of thinking and delete all such references to terms not commonly recognized by the recording/music industry (including Glam Metal). Revisions to such articles where necissary (and to eliminate bias) would be a prudent course. It seams that the spirit and beauty of Wikipedia is the ability to discover truth, not to be revisionist historians. Thanks for your time (operator). --69.62.131.222 16:24, 30 January 2006 (UTC)

Also, if we are going to eliminate terms based on derogatory nature we should review Dirty Sanchez. Sincerely, --Radioflyr 16:53, 30 January 2006 (UTC)

Wow... Wikipedia seems like a great place for both of these definitions to exist. It would seem to me that some one doesn't "like" the term "Butt Rock", even though it is a commonly used term, and would seek to eliminate it. I don't like the term "middle class", but that doesn't stop it from being used and being a Wikipedia definition.

It is already included in the Glam Metal article, its not the fact that it is a derogatory phrase I have no problem at all with that, its the point that it isn't an actual genre of music as it is portrayed to be in the article, as mentioned it is written into the glam metal article (Along with other derogatory terms like "Hair metal" and "poodle rock"). - Deathrocker 05:09, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

And here's what you're not hearing me say (type); Glam Metal is metal music and Butt Rock is not a synonym for Glam Metal. People refer to many bands who are NOT metal music as Butt Rock even though many bands that ARE Butt Rock are also Glam Metal: Glam Metal has to be "metal", Butt Rock does NOT have to be metal. Nelson, Kiss, Led Zepplain and Night Ranger are just a few example s of bands that are NOT metal but ARE Butt Rock (see how creatively they avoid the term "Butt Metal""). I'm okay with merging the definition, but let's merge it with something that makes logical sense! Otherwise adapt your adendum to Glam Metal and let's move on with our lives. Moderator: I'm confident that both Deathrocker and I appreciate your time, thanks! --Radioflyr 06:02, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Then show reliable links where bands such as KISS (Who have made Glam metal albums during the 80s and early 90s anyway), Led Zepplin (Who helped bring about metal), etc are considered as "Butt rock", aswell as butt rock being an actual genre.

The bands this article pertains to; Nelson, Poison, Warrant, Winger, Slaughter, BulletBoys, Danger Kitty (Now Metal Skool; a Glam metal parody band) are all considered to be part of "Glam Metal"... metal itself is a subgenre of hard rock anyway. You seem to be taking the extreme metal bands as the blueprint of what "metal" is about, when that isn't the case. - Deathrocker 07:29, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Links: Butt Rock

http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/listmania/fullview/1NPBQ9WJHA3O3/002-5779202-8284869?%5Fencoding=UTF8

http://www.salon.com/ent/music/feature/2001/05/15/tesla/?sid=1030649

http://www.seattleweekly.com/music/0032/two-reighley.php

Classes of "Metal"

http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Studios/2786/genres2.html

- (unsigned comment by 66.60.132.218)

1st is a random user complied list on Amazon, it isn't an offical list by the site. 2nd looks like another random blog 3rd has nothing to do with any of the bands mentioned in this article. 4th is a personal geocities site.

Where are reliable links from actual music media or related sources claiming this to be an actual genre? - Deathrocker 19:34, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Metal is a subcategory of Rock, therefor Rock cannot again be a subcategory of Metal (Rock/Metal/Rock?!). KFC's are a type of fast-tfood chain however not all fast food-chains are KFC's. Nelson is NOT Metal and neither is Bachman-Turner Overdrive. I would agree with you, deathrocker, that the links above are all personal opinnion however, Butt Rock is a word defined by its usage much like Glam Metal and Dirty Sanchez. Unoffical sources act to high-lite the fact that the word is commonly used by many people to include more than just Glam Metal. We should use Wikipedia to document how a new term is actually used in the English language, not to confine people to a meaning or definition that does not represent the broad usage of the word. If sources from a recording industry are what validates a term or genre then again we must remove Glam Metal from Wikipedia. I am not arguing that this is a genre, but a term in pop culture much like Glam Metal (no record producer in their right mind would ever use either to term to sell their records). --Radioflyr 06:03, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

• Delete. Article title violates WP:NPOV. Ikkyu2 22:34, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

I don't think it should be deleted on the assertion that it isn't a valid genre. It is still a term that is used to describe some bands or types of music. Maybe a statement that it isn't a genre would be in order, but having a Wikipedia article (read accurate) is very important for the term, IMHO. --Donander 06:49, 2 February 2006 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.