Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Albanian Christian Democratic Movement
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- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was keep. John254 01:20, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Albanian Christian Democratic Movement
This organisation does not pass the notability guidelines here - WP:NOTABILITY - in that it has not received significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject. I nominated the article for speedy deletion, following which it was merged/redirected to Christian Democratic Party of Albania, however this was not agreeable to the article's author. Springnuts 15:48, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Merge→Christian Democratic Party of Albania (PDK); if at a future time it can stand alone as an article, I'd support the ensuing article split. The notability of the party described by this article is (at present) fully dependent upon its relationship to the PDK and the person of Nikollë Lesi. As there is not an article for the person mentioned, I do not think it is unreasonable to address both parties in the same political party article. Party splits are (in my opinion) notable events, but often not sufficiently notable to be addressed by standalone articles; this is the case in the current context. --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 17:45, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Albania-related deletions. —User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 17:46, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Keep as an independent article; it has been common practice for quite some time now to create separate articles for newly founded parties if they are notable, which this one certainly is (as it has one MP). I think this article is in danger of falling prey to west-centrism -- noone would even *THINK* of not having an article on a party which has an MP in the UK, in Canada or in NZ, whereas parties which have an MP in Albania are apparently not considered notable enough by some people to have their own article... (I'm not accusing Ceyockey or Springnuts of being west-centric, it's just that I get an impression of double standards being employed on things like this here on Wikipedia.) —Nightstallion 18:52, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Keep per Nightstallion above. If this party really does have one MP in the Albanian parliament, then it's definitely sufficiently notable for inclusion in Wikipedia. How many articles do we have about US political parties that have never successfully held any elected positions? Very many, and this party may well be more notable than all of them. Terraxos 19:16, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Keep. This is a parliamentary party. There is nothing else need be said. --PaxEquilibrium 19:49, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Well actually there is - Notability needs to be demonstrated. Springnuts 13:31, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
- Merge. Though the article states the party has a seat, there is no source for that tidbit. The referenced source indicates the 'movement' split from the 'party', which did have a seat. That doesn't really impart much notability to the movement, for all we know it could be one or two people. Additionally, all the info for this article is also already in the "party" article. Epthorn 20:00, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Response: The source does clearly state that the party has an MP -- the MP *founded* the party, so why would you doubt it has an MP? —Nightstallion 20:23, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
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- Where is the significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject? Prove notability and the article should stay. Otherwise it should go. The MP on the other hand is I imagine notable in his or her own right, so (again if there is significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject) would be a good candidate for an article. Springnuts 13:30, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
- Excuse me, but how many independent reliable sources do you expect to cover the creation of a political party in Albania? I'm quite happy I found even one. —Nightstallion 19:38, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
- Fortunately what I want is not the point, the point is: does the topic of the conform to the guidelines in WP:N. Might I again suggest an article on the MP who would, I am certain, be notable? Regards, Springnuts 08:33, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
- I doubt that I would face any problems if I simply hunted for Albanian sources on the party and on the event and added a couple of them to the article -- that would fulfil the letter of WP:N more than it does now, but the *intent* of WP:N is obviously already fulfilled. I'm sorry, but I really find it rather ridiculous to question the notability of a parliamentary party. —Nightstallion 14:10, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
- What party? There are no reliable sources for the existence of the party. All we have is one source says that six days ago ago Nikollë Lesi said he was setting up a new party. Does it have offices, members, activists ...? Apparently this "party" consists of one man. That's not a party, or at least not yet. I have set up a short article about the very notable Nikollë Lesi - perhaps this article is best re-directed there? Springnuts 20:34, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
- I doubt that I would face any problems if I simply hunted for Albanian sources on the party and on the event and added a couple of them to the article -- that would fulfil the letter of WP:N more than it does now, but the *intent* of WP:N is obviously already fulfilled. I'm sorry, but I really find it rather ridiculous to question the notability of a parliamentary party. —Nightstallion 14:10, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
- Fortunately what I want is not the point, the point is: does the topic of the conform to the guidelines in WP:N. Might I again suggest an article on the MP who would, I am certain, be notable? Regards, Springnuts 08:33, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
- Excuse me, but how many independent reliable sources do you expect to cover the creation of a political party in Albania? I'm quite happy I found even one. —Nightstallion 19:38, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
- Where is the significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject? Prove notability and the article should stay. Otherwise it should go. The MP on the other hand is I imagine notable in his or her own right, so (again if there is significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject) would be a good candidate for an article. Springnuts 13:30, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
- Keep as per PaxEquilibrium. --Prevalis 20:38, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
- Comment (should not be construed as my changing my opinion away from 'merge') I do realize that on-line reliable sources might be difficult to come by and an argument can be made (following from the Tony Snow-related comment above) for keeping the article as a matter of countering systematic bias. --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 14:14, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
- Keep per Terraxos, PaxEquilibrium, Nightstallion. The article quotes an external reliable source. Looks like we could have some WP:BIAS creeping in here. Phil Bridger 15:24, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
