Talk:Arthur Conan Doyle

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Arthur Conan Doyle was a good article, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these are addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.

Delisted version: January 13, 2006


Contents

[edit] Most common word used in Sherlock Holmes stories

I just finished reading the Complete Works of Sherlock Holmes. Not sure if any one else realized this, but Doyle uses the word singular in almost every single story. --sh3rlockian 01:16, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] He was a Freemason

Sorry if this as been told before. Theres a link with famous freemasons on the grand lodge of Scotland Website. Of which Sir Athur Conan Doyle is one. More suprisingly Jim Davidsons one also. No wonder he got to host the Generation Game.81.129.191.17 15:06, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Practical jokes

There's a story somewhat popular among preachers that goes like this: Doyle was a practical joker. Once he sent the same telegram to twelve of his friends: "All is discovered. Flee at once." All twelve left the country.

Google turns up a number of such citations [1].

<>< tbc

This looks like a hoax, or urban legend to me. I recall having heard something about it before, but almost every single citation I discovered turns up in a sermon, used to illustrate the well-travelled theme of guilt. The twelve friends can also be the twelve most important men in England. sjc

The plot of one of the Holmes stories, "The 'Gloria Scott'", hinges on such a message. --RjLesch

Thanks! I made the story a link so page visitors can read it. I scanned through it and see exactly what you mean. However, the message in that context isn't a prank.

<>< tbc

There are many more citations at Google attributing the quote to Mark Twain [2].

<>< tbc


[edit] Link suggestions

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[edit] Jean Conan Doyle

Is anyone familiar with what Copyrights to the Holmes character were held by Dame Jean Conan Doyle before her death? According to one biography her brother sold off some of the copyrights and original manuscripts in an illegal sale to an American University in order to retain his french estate. I was just hoping to beef-up the Jean Conan Doyle article with more info.

Also, pherhaps we could add more information around the legal copyrights of Conan Doyle. I know that he had to sell the copyright of A Study in Scarlet in order to get it publish and recived a total of 20 pounds for the story...but by the late 1980's Jean Conan Doyle could still axe certain Holmes publications and complained to the producers of Star Trek The Next Generation when Brent Spiner played Sherlock Holmes in a holodeck episode.

User:Dowew

In article 7 of his will Arthur Conan Doyle wrote: "My executors shall deal as they think best with copyrights, plays, cinema rights, or unpublished MSS, it being my wish that the advice and cooperation of A.S. Watt of 10 Norfolk Street be always obtained. The yearly income on the capital sums derived from such sources shall always be divided as already stated-one half to my wife, one half divided among three younger children."

(You can view jpgs of Doyle's will as well as the transcribed version here: http://www.foolscap-quill.com/sherlockholmes5.html )

This is a really bad way to devise (give by will) your literary property. The result was that the copyrights remained in the Doyle estate without a neutral party to oversee them.

Doyle designated his wife Jean and his eldest son Denis as executors. However, Doyle's children (especially Adrian, who is referred to as "Malcolm" in the will) and their surviving spouses and heirs have feuded over the copyrights for almost 70 years.

I don't believe this is matter that Wikipedia should get into the middle of.

DarleneCypserEsq 19:58, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] 1929 ban

Quote from the article:His work on this topic was one of the reasons that one of his short story collections, The Adventures of Sherlock Holmes, was banned in the Soviet Union in 1929 under the pretense of occultism.

Well, I have a book, published in the Soviet Union in Russian in 1978 (300,000 copies), which contains this collection. I can provide more precise data about that edition if someone desire.

Therefore, even if this ban was, it was cancelled later. I'll add this into the article now. By the way, if someone will find non-wiki information about that ban, please, add a link into the article or here, because, for example, I didn't hear about that ban at all. Cmapm 19:20, 9 May 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Father

"Richard Doyle's hopeless alcoholism is evident in all of the Holmes stories." "But, Doyle never once mentions alcohol in his stories." "That is why it is evident."

[edit] Against Koch and his proxies

The NEJM this week[3] gives a fascinating account how ACD traveled to Berlin to learn about Robert Koch's "treatment" for tuberculosis. He unmasked it as a speculative and probably irrelevant finding, and was vindicated in doing so. Perhaps this should be mentioned here. JFW | T@lk 23:45, 11 December 2005 (UTC)

Yes, that was a fascinating article. I heard the suggestion somewhere that the method of Sherlock Holmes was the method of medical diagnostics that Holmes learned in medical school from one of his teachers in particular. Anyway, here are my notes of that NEJM article:
NEJM, 8 Dec 2005, 353(23):2426, Perspective: Medical History: The Medical Detectives, Howard Markel. Arthur Conan Doyle was a medical journalist, and broke a story on the limitations of Robert Koch's treatment for tuberculosis. Koch announced a "remedy for tuberculosis," on 6 Aug 1890, at the 10th International Medical Congress, Berlin. This was "Koch's lymph," a glycerin extract of tuberculosis germs. It was reported 13 Nov 1890 Deutsche Medizinische Wochenscrift, 15 Nov 1890 BMJ, 16 Nov 1890 New York Times. Koch never claimed that he discovered a "cure," but that his "remedy destroyed the tissue in which the tuberculosis germs had settled, so that the entire diseased area would simply be sloughed off and then expelled through coughing." Conan Doyle, who had published A Study in Scarlet in 1887, read the translation of Koch's paper in BMJ, which announced that Ernst von Bergmann would demonstrate the tuberculosis remedy at the University of Berlin later that week. [Conan Doyle's wife, Louise Hawkins, had TB.] Conan Doyle immediately boarded a train for London, got an assignment to write about it from the Review of Reviews, and arrived in Berlin 16 Nov. But tickets to von Bergmann's clinical demonstration were "simply not to be had and neither money nor interest could procure them." Conan Doyle went to Koch's home, but the butler told Conan Doyle that Koch was unavailable. On 17 Nov, Conan Doyle went to the medical auditorium, "but neither bribes nor his clumsy attempts at slipping by the ticket taker" secured him entry. Conan Doyle threw himself in front of von Bergmann and said, "I have come a thousand miles. May I not come in?" Bergman glared through his pince-nez and replied, to laughs and jeers, "Perhaps you would like to take my place? That is the only one vacant!" Henry J. Hartz, TB specialist from Detroit, was appaled by von Bergmann's bad behavior, and agreed to share his notes. Next morning, Hartz escorted Conan Doyle into von Bergmann's clinical wards to examine the patients treated by Koch's lymph. After analyzing the data, Conan Doyle concluded, "The whole thing was experimental and premature," as he wrote in the London Daily Telegraph of 20 Nov 1890, and in the Review of Reviews. Koch's lymph left germs "deep in the invaded country," and its real value was as an aid to diagnosis. In 1891, Koch admitted this.Nbauman 10:06, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Selected Bibliography?

Any particular reason why we only have a selected bibliography here? Other authors have complete bibliographies...

[edit] Delisted Good Article

This article is no longer a "good article" because it does not have any references. joturner 03:58, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Arthur's father: Richard or Charles?

Wikipedia currently lists illustrator Richard Doyle as Arthur Conan Doyle's father. However, in Victorian Fairy Painting, published by the Royal Academy of Arts, London in 1997, Victorianists Pamela White Trimpe (p 58) and Jeremy Maas (p 17) list Richard's brother Charles as Arthur's father. Richard and Charles were born in London, which is where Richard also died. Charles, on the other hand, moved to Edinburgh. Both brothers were celebrated illustrators, but Charles less so, partly because he was institutionalized for alcoholism and epilepsy in the 1870s and remained "in and out of institutions" for the rest of his life (Trimpe 58). According to Trimpe, the work of Charles Doyle only resurfaced in the 1920s under the curation of his son, Arthur Conan Doyle.

Charles Altemont Doyle was Conan Doyle's father. I've corrected this Daibhid C 20:09, 14 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Portsmouth F.C.

This article says that Arthur Conan Doyle "helped form Portsmouth Football Club, playing as the club's first goalkeeper and occasionally as a right back between 1884 and 1890." Portsmouth F.C. calls that assertion "a common myth": "While Conan Doyle did play for an amateur side, Portsmouth AFC, that flourished from 1882 to 1894, the first goalkeeper of the professional era was Matt Reilly who previously played for the successful Royal Artillery team." Which of these is true? Aecis Appleknocker Flophouse 18:18, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Apparently the latter: that he played for the amateur club Portsmouth AFC, but not for its successor, the professional Portsmouth FC. There's a book on the subject reviewed here (Sherlock Holmes Was a Pompey Keeper by Kevin Smith). Tearlach 08:35, 19 May 2006 (UTC)
I also followed up on this some on the web; while a few sites mentioned Doyle playing as goalkeeper, none gave any sort of verifiable material supporting the supposition. On the Portsmouth F.C. official website, there is no mention whatsoever of Doyle in either the History or Trivia sections — which would be a surprising omission had he actually been on the team in any capacity. As such, I corrected the statement. Tijuana Brass¡Épa! 00:04, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] photographic memory

I've heard that Doyle had a photographic memory, going so far as to insert false weather accounts in his stories (e.g. since he had memorized the Farmer's Almanac, he would incorrectly state the weather of a given day in his works as a joke to himself). Can anyone verify this? - IstvanWolf 07:23, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Doyle as advocate of justice

I believe the following to be incorrect:

"Doyle was also a fervent advocate of justice, and personally investigated two closed cases, which led to two imprisoned men being released. "

I understand that the suspect in the first case, George Edalji, had already been released before Sir Doyle began investigations?

[edit] What's with

the vandalism ?

Undoubtedly the work of Professor Moriarty. I believe something's afoot! Gzuckier 20:29, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Bio?

Why is this biographical part titled "Love Life"? Do I miss something here?

[edit] External links

Some external links were posted from User talk:72.138.243.62.

I deleted them, and received a very nice, detailed and professional followup from User talk:Arnold Villeneuve.

Comments, anyone? -- Jim Douglas (talk) (contribs) 06:07, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

I have no idea what the links were supposed to give, as they only generate gibberish in my Mac browsers (both Safari and Firefox). I would say the links do not belong here until they have a format which is accessible to everyone. If they contain information that is not already on the page, add that information to the page, and leave the links as references. Mlewan 06:40, 15 October 2006 (UTC)
I just tried it in Firefox on my Windows box and also on Firefox & Safari on my PowerBook G4. I see a tree view on the left side, with different chunks of text displayed based on where I click. I have no idea what to make of it. I've invited Arnold Villeneuve to explain it either here or on Talk:Winston Churchill. -- Jim Douglas (talk) (contribs) 07:00, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] In popular culture

I've just done some fiddling with:

and proposed a similar one for Thomas Edison and was thinking it might be worth getting the ball rolling for Arthur Conan Doyle in popular culture. Off the top of my head there is Arthur & George, Necronauts, FairyTale: A True Story and Photographing Fairies. Anymore? (Emperor 19:30, 24 October 2006 (UTC))

He also appears in The Searchers. (Emperor 20:00, 10 May 2007 (UTC))

[edit] Cricket infobox

I've removed the cricket infobox. While the info in it is accurate, it gives the page the appearance of vandalism, and falsely implies that the man was mostly known as a cricketer. I've added the cricket stats as an external link, which is where I think they belong. --Trevor Burnham 03:45, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Doyle or Conan Doyle?

I had always assumed the correct form was eg 'Conan Doyle was a Scot' rather than 'Doyle was a Scot', but from the evidence of this article - and other subsidiary pages (eg Professor Challenger) - this doesn't seem to be the case. Are there any Conan Doyleans (or Doyleans) out there that can shed any light on this? I think we should be consistent and use either one form or the other.Ericoides 21:57, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

I think so too. His surname was Conan Doyle, wasn't it? All the category sorting is wrong too. Stephen Turner (Talk) 17:59, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
In fact, we had a strange mixture of "Doyle" and "Conan Doyle". I've changed them all to "Conan Doyle" now. Stephen Turner (Talk) 21:13, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Did Arthur Conan Doyle invent helmets for modern warfare

I recall hearing somewhere that Conan Doyle suggested that soldiers returned to wearing steel helmets as he'd noticed that most gunshot wounds were to the head. Could a Doyle expert confirm or deny this?

TIA!

Apepper 17:39, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

I have read in the front cover of one of his books that he not only suggested the helmet for the British Army (see above), but suggested the parachute for the RAF, and introduced skiing to Switzerland. Not including fingerprinting and the "fact" that the French police used Sherlock as an instruction manual for its force early in the 20th Century. Is any of this true?

Myaddiction 10:37, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Strand Magazine

Slightly surprised no-one's mentioned the importance of Strand Magazine in all this. When did this magazine print his serialised stories? Davidbod 21:09, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

According to the jacket of "The Original Illustrated 'Strand' Sherlock Holmes The Complete Facsimile Edition" [ISBN 1-85326-932-8], The Strand started in 1891, four years after Holmes first appeared in "A Study In Scarlet" (1887) and just after "The Sign Of Four" (1890) was published. There were 24 stories in The Strand between 1891 and 1893, then nothing until "The Hound Of THe Baskervilles" was issued in 15 parts during 1901 and 1902. 13 stories were published between 1903 and 1904 as well. Not until 1908 did more stories appear. "Reminiscences of Sherlock Holmes" was a six story publication between 1908 and 1913, followed by the two part "Valley Of Fear" (with seven episodes per part) through 1914-1915. "His Last Bow", subtitled "The War Service of Sherlock Holmes" was in 1917. It was not until "The Case-Book Of Serlock Holmes" appeared in 1921, that readers of the Strand heard from him again, and the Case-Book ran through 12 parts, finally finishing in 1927. Myaddiction 13:40, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The Hound of the Baskervilles

There is much wrong with this article, most of which has been covered above, but one major omission is that of "the Hound of the Baskervilles" which was published after Holmes' death, but before "The Empty House". Admittedly, it was set before the Reichenbach Falls, but "The Hound" is an extremely important novel.

210.10.173.201 03:20, 23 February 2007 (UTC)


I was surprised to find no mention of the controversary over whether Doyle stole the Hound of the Baskervilles from Fletcher Robinson and later murdered him. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article567525.ece I saw a show saying they were going to exhume Robinson's body in 2006 and test to see if any traces of the poison laudanum. Does anyone know if this was ever done and what the results were?

[edit] Where are the drugs?

I wonder why there's only any accounts of Doyle's clean living in this article? It is an omission that borders on deception.Stephen Kinch 08:44, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] External links clean up

I have had a wander thought the external links section. Most are fine, the following have some problems (as noted) have been moved here, they should not reappear without discussion.

  • www.biographyshelf.com -- Links to avoid #4
  • 221bbakerstreet.info -- Links to avoid #1
  • www.classic-literature.co.uk/--Links to avoid #5
  • www.sherlock-holmes.es --In Spanish, (does not meet exception criteria specified in: Wikipedia:External links#Foreign-language links)
  • www.sherlock-holmes.co.uk --Links to avoid #3, #4
  • www.nevasport.com Conan Doyle, ski pioneer--In Spanish, (does not meet exception criteria.)--DO11.10 23:08, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Title

The article is called "Arthur conan doyle", but the first words are sir arthur conan doyle. Surely the name of the article should be changed? --Will James 07:12, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

No; the convention is to use the unadorned name for the title - otherwise, how about Margaret_Thatcher, or Winston_Churchill? Wikipedia:Naming_conventions_(people) notes:article names preferably don't add qualifiers (such as "King", "Saint", "Dr.", "(person)", "(ship)"), except when this is the simplest and most NPOV way to deal with disambiguation. --Stephen Burnett 08:49, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Date contradiction

On this article, the hound of the baskervilles was said to be published in 1902, but in the article "The return of sherlock holmes" they say the hound was published in 1901. This contradiction could quite possibly undermine the wikipedia website and bring an end to the world as we know it. --Will James 07:19, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Another earth-shattering note :-
I have a copy of [Adventures...] which contains editions of "The Man with the Twisted Lip" as well as "The Speckled Band". Are these MSS one and the same, or differing versions from those individually listed in the "selected" biography? MonstaPro 13:42, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Conan Doyle in Project Gutenberg

There has been no note made of many of Holmes' adventures being listed in Project Gutenberg's database. As copyright issues have been raised (from Conan Doyle's children, see above), should a link be made? MonstaPro 13:48, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Years don't make any sense

If Conan Doyle set up a practice in 1882 and then began writing stories he would have been well over 20. Either his first literary experience was before setting up a practice or it wasn't before he was 20

I've edited the paras concerning his student years and early medical practice. --Stephen Burnett 07:21, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Bad writing

"After the death of his wife Louisa in 1906, and the deaths of his son Kingsley, his brother, his two brothers-in-law, and his two nephews in World War I, Conan Doyle sank into depression. He found solace supporting Spiritualism and its alleged scientific proof of existence beyond the grave."

These deaths must be at least 8 years apart, and yet its being presented as one event that turned ACD to depression and spiritualism. Sheriff Bernard 20:44, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Conan Doyle or Doyle?

(Copied from User talk:Carcharoth)

...you added a DEFAULTSORT to Arthur Conan Doyle. Unfortunately, there was (a) already an existing DEFAULTSORT and (b) your DEFAULTSORT was incorrect. He should be sorted under "Conan Doyle, Arthur", not "Doyle, Arthur Conan". Carcharoth 23:12, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Carcharoth. I'm sorry that I didn't notice there was an existing DEFAULTSORT for Doyle, and I'm always happy to be corrected, but would you mind explaining your view that "Doyle, Arthur Conan" is incorrect? His surname was Doyle. Conan was a given name and was not used by his father Charles Doyle or his son Kingsley Doyle. The Oxford Dictionary of National Biography lists him under 'D' as ‘Doyle, Sir Arthur Ignatius Conan (1859–1930)’. Regards, Xn4 23:54, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
I was going by the article, which says "Conan was originally a given name, but Doyle used it as part of his surname in his later years", and also refers to him as "Conan Doyle" throughout. Your point about the DNB is a good one. I'm not sure what to do here. It has also been discussed at Talk:Arthur Conan Doyle#Doyle or Conan Doyle?. I'll copy all this over to the talk page for discussion. Thanks for pointing this out. Carcharoth 00:08, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

(end copied section)

Can anyone here shed light on this? Carcharoth 00:10, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

I had another thought and looked him up at www.1901censusonline.com (the 1901 UK census). He appears in that as Arthur C. Doyle, aged 41, born Edingborough [sic] Scotland, of Forest Row, East Sussex, Physician. Xn4 01:59, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Yeah, you will find that sort of thing because he changed his surname during his lifetime from "Doyle" to "Conan Doyle", though I would be happier if that sentence in the article was referenced and we knew whether it was a formal change or an informal change on his part. The question is, do we index by "Doyle" (his birth surname) or by "Conan Doyle" (his adopted surname)? Carcharoth 09:31, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Lots of sources say he adopted Conan (a middle name) as part of his surname in his "later years", but I've been unable to track down the details. One source did disagree though: "Born on May 22, 1859, to Mary and Charles Altamont Doyle, Conan Doyle was one of 10 children, seven of whom would survive into adulthood (and two of whom were given the compound surname Conan Doyle in honor of a paternal uncle)."[4] Unfortunately, it is not clear whether Arthur Conan Doyle was one of these two children, though it is implied. Carcharoth 11:46, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

And one of the paternal uncles was Richard Doyle (illustrator), also known as "Dickie Doyle". There are some hits for "Richard Conan Doyle", but not many. The other paternal uncles, also artists, were "Charles Doyle" and "James Doyle". Carcharoth 11:53, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

I've tightened up the linking between Conan Doyle and the articles on his father (Charles Altamont Doyle) and uncle (Richard Doyle). No article on his grandfather though, see John Doyle if anyone wants to write a stub. Carcharoth 12:05, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Whether it was a formal or informal change of name, it is essentially no different from referencing Eric Blair under his preferred professional name of George Orwell. He wanted his surname to be "Conan Doyle". -- JackofOz 13:08, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

There seems to be a working theory here that Doyle changed his surname from Doyle to Conan Doyle, but is there any evidence of that?
One problem which strikes me is that it is fairly easy in the UK to change your surname, and it was even easier a hundred years ago, but names given in Christian baptism remain as Christian names. It wasn't unusual for baby Jenks to be baptized Hugo Heckmondwike, after his rich uncle Hugo Heckmondwike, of Heckmondwike Hall, who had no children. In the fullness of time, there was a chance at least that Uncle Hugo would leave his estates to young Hugo Heckmondwike Jenks, probably on condition that he adopted the name and arms of Heckmondwike. But when he did, young Hugo didn't become Hugo Heckmondwike, he became Hugo Heckmondwike Heckmondwike.
So if Doyle did formally change his surname, it is surprising that he is nowhere referred to as Arthur Ignatius Conan Conan Doyle! Xn4 13:43, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
I agree we should index him under 'C'. For those looking under 'D', he is listed at Doyle, and Conan Doyle redirects here, so we have to hope that those looking at lists under 'D' will find Doyle and get here that way. I'm tempted to categorise the redirect Arthur C. Doyle under 'D' to help people navigate here if they end up looking under 'D'. It would also be nice to know more about the change, but the above was all I could find. Carcharoth 13:45, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Arthur Ignatius Conan Doyle was born on May 22, 1859 ... From his great-uncle Michael Conan, a distinguished journalist, Arthur and his elder sister, Annette, received the compound surname of Conan Doyle.
Teller of Tales: The Life of Arthur Conan Doyle, Daniel Stashower, Penguin Books, 2000
--Stephen Burnett 14:23, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Perfect! Do you want to put that in the article, or shall I? :-) Carcharoth 14:31, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Done. Carcharoth 14:41, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Daniel Stashower seems to have it wrong, except that the origin of 'Conan' in a great-uncle called Michael Conan may be correct. Some biographical articles say that the name Conan was given to Doyle as a Christian name, while others say he added it himself later in life. But only one of those alternatives can be correct, and for some reason the Wikipedia article treats the first as authoritative. In any event, if the name was a given name in 1859, it was not then part of a compound surname (one not shared by his parents), as Stashower claims, so the Wikipedia article contradicts itself in quoting his claim as a fact... When ACD gave his answers for the 1901 census he stated his surname as Doyle, and almost all standard reference books (from the Dictionary of National Biography to the Oxford Dictionary of Quotations) index him under D for Doyle. I wonder what evidence there is from original sources that Doyle ever looked on 'Conan' as part of his surname? Xn4 00:07, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Heh. I thought that all sounded a bit too perfect. Looks like there is confusion among the sources. We should document that as far as we are able, but not get too bogged down (there may be no definitive answer). Anyone want to try and communicate all this in the article? Carcharoth 02:16, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Well, I've added something that will at least make people think and not assume one or the other is correct. Please correct or expand if you can. Carcharoth 02:26, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

  • Most sources are vague, but this one is more definitive: "...at the age of seventeen, Arthur Doyle, (as he was called, before adding his middle name "Conan" to his surname), was..." Carcharoth 02:32, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Again from Stashower: Another change at Bush Villas could be found on the brass nameplate outside, which now read "A. Conan Doyle M.D". And Stashower quotes in full the title of the thesis which earned him the MD, giving the author's name as A. Conan Doyle, MB, CM. This was just after his wedding to his first wife Louisa, in 1885, when Conan Doyle was 26. I've edited the note in the article to reflect this.

I would say myself that the use of "Conan" rather than the second initial "C", in these two very formal contexts, is strong evidence that he regarded "Conan" as part of his surname from quite early on, and before he had made any great reputation as a writer. It certainly seems to make the statement that he adopted it in later life difficult to sustain. I do however acknowledge that this does make his census response very puzzling. Also, the Oxford Companion to English Literature has him under Doyle, with a re-direction under "Conan Doyle". The situation is of course made all the more uncertain by the fact that he never used the hyphenated form - ie "Conan-Doyle" - which used to be a common convention when two family names were combined. --Stephen Burnett 07:46, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

For some censuses, the names are spelt/arranged the way the census taker took them or interpreted them. Not sure if this was the case for the 1901 census or not. United Kingdom Census 1901 doesn't help. Maybe look him up in the other censuses as well? Carcharoth 09:37, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Good idea, if they are available. Of course, we are used to the idea of a census conducted using forms filled in by the individuals themselves - but as you point out, it warn't necessarily so :) --Stephen Burnett 10:27, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
It's a more interesting question than it looks. No end of people play around with their names, but not so many do it in the public eye without some formality. Doyle was a clever fellow, and it seems to me unlikely that he would just have tried to convert an existing Christian name into a surname as an act of will, which strictly speaking is a legal nonsense. I don't see why the thing couldn't be bottomed. How did ACD's children Adrian Conan Doyle (born 1910) and Jean Conan Doyle (born 1912) come by the name 'Conan' - as a given name, or because their father's surname was stated to the Registrar as 'Conan Doyle'? What did his passport in the 1920s and his death certificate in 1930 give as his surname? Xn4 03:28, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
I hadn't thought to look at his children's names! (There are three other children to look at, two of which are from his first marriage.) We index (using category pipe sorting) Adrian under "Doyle", and Jean under "Conan Doyle". I take it we can be sure that "Conan Doyle" was actually their surname? What about their children? Oh, and I never realised his daughter was so distinguished! Carcharoth 09:31, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
"I take it we can be sure that "Conan Doyle" was actually their surname?" - Carcharoth
This is not quite the starting point I had in mind! Xn4 01:04, 17 July 2007 (UTC)

For what it's worth, I posed this question in a forum that is frequented by several people very knowledgable about ACD. I didn't ask for permission to quote the responses I received, but they can be found here and here. Deor 15:34, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

Damn, I forgot that one has to be a member of that group to view the messages. Anyhow, the upshot was that Dame Jean considers her surname to be "Conan Doyle" and confirms that her father also considered it to be his surname. Deor 12:33, 17 July 2007 (UTC)
Hmm. No wonder my application to join that All Hallows forum is still pending (I'd cancel it now if I could). "Dame Jane considers..."? Our article on her says she died in 1997, so that should be "considered", unless this is a rather special All Hallows type of forum... Did I just feel a shiver go down my spine? :-) Anyway, thanks for confirming the surname business. Did anyone come up with a firm date for the earliest point at which he was using it as a surname? Carcharoth 02:58, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

I don't want to get embroiled in the debate over whether Conan was originally part of ACD's surname or not, but the way the article reads now it seems to imply that there is doubt about whether "Conan" (as a given name or a surname) was in honor of Michael Conan. I think that it is pretty well documented--for instance, in a letter written at age 12 he mentions changing the "A. Doyle" credited on a school playbill to "A. C. Doyle" to "gratify" Uncle Conan. Does a rewording seem in order? Edgbeatles (talk) 17:38, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] proposed new external link

I'd like to add a link like:

to the External Links:Works section. This links to a list of Conan Doyle works that you can download to read on a cell phone. I have read quite a few from this site and got a lot of value out being able to read the PD texts away from the PC.

The texts are Public Domain in the US, just like Project Gutenberg, they are packaged with the reader and available under a creative commons licence (share if (attribution, non-commercial, no derivative) ). The site is non-commercial without registration, subscription, or advertising. The texts as packaged together with the reader as a java program that runs on cell phones, this is a way for people to access the authors work that adds to the range in the existing external links (hopefully translating to more reading going on).

I checked WP:EL and the link seems appropriate:

  • What should be linked: '...should link to a site hosting a copy of the work if none of the "Links normally to be avoided" criteria apply.'
  • Links normally to be avoided: it seems only #8 might apply; 'Direct links to documents that require external applications (such as Flash or Java) to view the relevant content...'. The site lets you download java programs that only run on a J2ME environment, this means most/all current cell phones. So although they are limited to being read on a phone they do add an access method to all the others in the existing External Links, in the same way that LibriVox adds a format but requires an mp3 player.

Filomath 23:59, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Missing book

This doesn't seem to be in Doyle's bibliography - should it be? Neil ム 10:20, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] WikiProject class rating

This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 08:26, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] A few important Suggestions

This article has a lot of information all categorized under one section. I think there is both enough information, and enough extraneous materials and links that this could become a good article if not a featured article without adding much.

My little to-do list: -Expand intro slightly -Summarize life into more of a timeline so that the section can be divided into more detailed areas. -Categorize important aspects of his life:

*Writing
*Spiritualism
*Politics
*Medicine
*Knighthood

I plan on doing this myself when I have the time. Angrynight (talk) 13:57, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

This sounds like a very good idea, though I'm unsure of the order. Now, did I miss it or (apart from the "Sir" in the opening) is there no mention of his knighthood at all? Seems like quite an oversight to me. -R. fiend (talk) 19:41, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Scottish

Seeing as his parents weren't Scottish and he spent much of his life elsewhere in Britain should he not just be described as a British author? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Flimflamflum (talk • contribs) 23:39, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

Unless Wikipedia has a policy that nationality is defined by place of birth, I agree. I see that the lead section has been changed, but the article is still in lots of "Scottish..." categories. Adding other categories in addition would be an option, but Doyle is in so many categories that would make the list overwhelming. Moving to "British..." categories seems to be the best option. EALacey (talk) 18:29, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Semi-protection

Requested semi-protection of this article due to continued vandalism by user(s) with IP adresses. Michel Doortmont (talk) 20:23, 28 April 2008 (UTC)