Talk:Aristophanes

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List of non-extant plays from Douglas MacDowell's "Aristophanes and Athens: An Introduction to the Plays" Oxford 1995.

Let me get this straight: Aristophanes' play "The Birds" is about two guys trying to form a Utopia; and Hitchcock's movie "The Birds" features Melanie Griffith's mother getting almost pecked to death by birds. So if both of these things had actually come to pass, we could've been living in Utopia *AND* not have a Melanie Griffith? :D

Ha. Ha ha. Ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha. Not.

On a more serious note, why is there no information about the man? JPO

-Mostly because we don't have any concrete information to go on. thomaschina03

Contents 1 what did he say 2 this needs a new image 3 Aristophanes and Plato 4 "Can't live with them" saying 5 "Standard Edition" 6 Aristophanes the Asteroid: Dramatist from Space! 7 The sketch 8 Kock-numbers are now outdated and should not be used. 9 Removal of false anecdote 10 Death year

[edit] what did he say

did he say "give me where to stand, and i will move the earth","there is only one good knowledge,and one evil ignorance","in all things of nature,there is something of the marvelous","you have all the characters of a popular politician: a horrible voice, bad breeding and a vulgar manner",or "democracy,which is a charming form of government, full of variety and disorder..."? Campolongo48 (talk) 23:27, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] this needs a new image

Okay - looks like we need to find a new Aristophanes image, and I don't see anything on wiki commons. It'd be best if we had the current image or another old bust like this, if someone can provide a public domain one. Failing that, there is this 2-d image: http://www.crystalinks.com/aristophanes.jpg - I don't know the source though, who created it and is it sufficiently old?

[edit] Aristophanes and Plato

I strongly question whether the author of this article has ever read The Symposium. Aristophanes is portrayed as an absolutely incontinent and intemperant fool. His "humorous" account of the origin of love is bitter sarcasm from Plato who could only be pointing out and attacking the rampant hedonism of Aristophanes. If this is considered reconciliation then Palto must really have hated his friends. Plato never forgives Aristophanes and frequently will make statements that imply he blames no one else more for Socrates' death.

If the article is flawed please go ahead and fix it. Don't just complain. ;-) --Michalis Famelis (talk) 09:50, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "Can't live with them" saying

I removed the following:

The well-known saying "can't live with them, can't live without them" comes from one of Aristophanes' plays. Aristophanes' words in Lysistrata (411 B.C.), line 1038 as translated by Dudley Fitts was: "These impossible women! How they do get around us! / The poet was right: can't live with them, or without them!"

The claim is dubious on a number of levels: the well-known saying is an English saying, which suggests that if Lysistrata is where it comes from, then it probably comes from Fitts' translation, not Aristophanes. The quote that is given also implies that the saying isn't originally Aristophanes' but an unnamed poet. The Sommerstein translation also implies that the saying (in Greek) was already well-known before Aristophanes: "...Still, the saying's true - / We can't live with you, we can't live without you!" (Lines 1038-1039). If other editors object, I think this claim at least needs a source. Schi 02:11, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "Standard Edition"

How is a standard edition determined? My university did not consider any one translation authoritative, and I think that listing a standard edition clutters up the article and may be misleading. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by AprilEns (talk • contribs) 14:57, October 21, 2006 (UTC).

Currently the only "standard edition" mentioned is of the fragments of Aristophanes' lost plays—in Greek. There is no question that this is the only standard edition, this is uncontroversial scholarly common knowledge. Wareh 16:46, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Aristophanes the Asteroid: Dramatist from Space!

What's the point of a link to an article about an asteroid? The average person viewing this page is here on the topics of famous Greeks or dramatists in general and is unlikely to find the small asteroid stub of any interest, even if it is named for Aristophanes. I do not believe it has any place in the "See Also" section of this article, but I'll let someone else decide whether to keep it or leave it. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.235.177.74 (talk • contribs) 08:58, December 2, 2006 (UTC).

[edit] The sketch

Now, I think the picture is a good one and I think pictures generally enhance an article and I support keeping it, but it is highly inaccurate and based on the equally inaccurate Roman sculptures of Aristophanes. In his various plays he makes references to the fact that he was a short, plump and bald man. While he may exaggerate some things for comic effect, it is commonly accepted that the Roman busts are not representative of how Artisophanes looked Gegen 09:47, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Kock-numbers are now outdated and should not be used.

Um... what? Plenty of non-specialists will read this article; an unexplained comment like the above is not helpful. 81.153.107.160 02:33, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

Time can never be 'outdated'... METALFREAK04 (talk) 10:29, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Removal of false anecdote

I have removed the section referring to Aristophanes' judging of a poetry contest. That was the other, 2nd century BC Aristophanes. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.71.41.6 (talk) 03:13, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Death year

First line says he died in ca. 386 BC, although he is categorised under "[[Category:388 BC deaths]]". Could someone change one or the other? Jared Preston (talk) 09:45, 27 May 2008 (UTC)