Talk:Arbusto Energy

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1 Comment
2 Date of Arbusto-Bath document?
3 Price of Oil at time of sale
4 Bush v. Shrub
5 Question About the Word Currently As Used In The Following Sentence:

[edit] Comment

Wasn't a brother of Osama bin Laden one of the company's investors? Salem bin Laden I believe it was. MichaelD 00:43, 24 Jun 2004 (UTC)

"At the time that Bath made an investment of $50,000 he was representing Salem bin Laden's interests in Texas. When Salem Bin Laden died in 1988, his interest in Arbusto (along with other Bin Laden Group assets) passed to Khalid bin Mahfouz."

To answer the first poster and add to it, no and the above paragraph makes a logic and factual leap that is in error. Bath represented a Bin Laden but claims (and has income tax documents to back the claim... which have been reviewed by Time magazine) he invested his own money in Arbusto.

"The name Arbusto is Spanish for "shrub", but the Bush family interpret it as "bush"."

Arbusto and bush are of cognate etymology and mean the same thing (shrub is just a synonym of bush, too), so GWB is correct here (for once!). - MPF 23:25, 27 Oct 2004 (UTC)

I know this isn't scientific but I don't have access to any paper Spanish->English dictionaries around here. Google language translator here: http://www.google.com/language_tools?hl=en and the AltaVisto translator available here: http://world.altavista.com/tr both translate "Arbusto" to "shrub". Anyway I'm happy with the page as it stands. AlistairMcMillan 20:34, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)

My Spanish-English dictionary gives both, hardly surprising as 'shrub' and 'bush' both mean the same. - MPF 21:23, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Date of Arbusto-Bath document?

Here is a transcription of the arbusto-bath money document - does anyone know the year it covers? Various wikipedia articles reference it without providing a date.

                           SCHEDULE 4
STOCK    DESCRIPTION                     COST    PRESENT       INCOME 
SHARES                                           MARKET VALUE  LAST 
    120  Continental Airlines        $  1,000    $  2,100      $ -
    160  Browning Ferris                1,800       6,920        12.
      6  Northeast Airlines CV Deb      6,000       5,100       360.
    675  Alaska Airlines                2,500      10,800       240.
  15000  Eastern Jet Aviation          30,000      20,000        -
    100  JB & A Aircraft, Inc                     250,000    96,000.
                                                             (Divide
     16  Consolidated Fibres, Inc         160         160
    100  Southwest Airport Services, Inc   -      250,000        -
         (Wholly Owned)
    100  Southwest Airlease, Inc           -          -          -

180,000  Charter Bancshares            180,000    402,000     2,600.
                                                 --------    ---------
                                                  947,080    99,212.50
         OIL & GAS
         ----------
  5%     Bush Energy Oil & Gas          50,000     25,000     7,000.
           Partnership
         Royalty Under Gas Well,                    7,850     4,700.
           Desoto Parish, LA
  3.75%  Roden & Associates             75,000    100,000       -
                                                ---------   ----------
                                                1,079,930   110,912.50
                                                =========   ==========

This shows Alaska Airlines valued at $16 and paying dividends totalling 0.355 per share in the year (though maybe the last column isn't a year?). Similarly Continental Airlines was valued at $17.5 with no dividends.

Yahoo Finance only shows historical share prices for Continental back to 1993 July ($28.50), and prices for Alaska Airlines back to 1983 January ($11.35). -Wikibob | Talk 22:12, 2005 Mar 4 (UTC)

[edit] Price of Oil at time of sale

Someone (24.211.205.127) added this line:

With this in mind, one must also consider that this was near the all-time peak of oil prices of $80-90/bbl, inflation adjusted. People were surely in a speculative mood, not imagining the price drop in the following 10 years.

But according to the data they linked, the price of Oil was actually in a dip, at $22.60 in Jun 1990. And apart fro, the spike due to the first gulf war a few months later, the price of oil seems relativly stable for the next eight years. MickWest 18:07, 17 July 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Bush v. Shrub

Understand:

The words "bush" and "shrub" are synonyms in English.
The Spanish word "arbusto" is the equivalent of the English words "bush" and "shrub". Either word is a suitable translation.
Bush is the last name of George W. Bush, principal partner in Arbusto Energy.
"Shrub" is a fairly common pejorative nickname for George W. Bush.

Keeping the above facts in mind, how can it be anything but an egregious violation of NPOV to translate the word "arbusto" as "shrub" rather than "bush"? Clearly, the name was chosen because it is the Spanish word for Bush, the last name of one of the company's principal partner. TacoDeposit 21:10, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

I completely agree and am rather surprised that this has even been a matter of question or debate recently gaillimh^{Conas tá tú?} 11:44, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

It only became a pejorative nickname for him after it was correctly pointed out by a newspaper columnist that Arbusto translates accurately to "shrub" and not "bush", so this is poor logic. You are obviously correct that they are synonyms, but any Spanish speaker or Spanish dictionary will tell you that "shrub" is the correct tranlation. -- Why was the correct translation removed from the article?

Hmm, in response to this, I haven't heard that "bush" wasn't a valid translation, but I have heard from Spanish speakers that both terms are plausible translations , and that "Arbusto Energy" has an unintendedly self-deprecating ring to it (like so many loosely translated product names that end up sonding different than they were intended). Online dictionaries list both terms, anyway. Whiskey Pete 02:06, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Okay. For the sake of accuracy I'd rather see the most accurate translation used, and not an alternate "plausible" translation simply because it makes a politician somebody favors look better, but I don't really care enough to keep arguing. I was just looking for accuracy.

I agree that the debate is rather pointless; if a word has two roughly similar, and in your words, "equally suitable" translations in English, then it would seem most helpful, encyclopedic and NPOV to just put down both (I never said that arbust translates to shrub "rather than" bush, btw), and let the able and alert Wikipedia reader decide what significance this may have. --Whiskey Pete, 02:48 4 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Question About the Word Currently As Used In The Following Sentence:

"Another investor was Ghaith R. Pharaon, a partner of Bakhsh's, who would later be involved in the Bank of Credit and Commerce International scandal, and is currently the target of an international dragnet."

The word "currently" in the quoted section needs to be clarified. When was the article written? Are there plans to delete this sentence when the investigation is concluded? When did the investigation start, and when did it end. If I come across the answers in my research then I will happily fill in the blanks. Meanwhile, maybe somebody already knows and will be willing to fill in the blanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by IPanurge (talk • contribs) 13:48, 9 October 2007 (UTC)