Talk:Anti-Chinese legislation in Indonesia

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Flag Anti-Chinese legislation in Indonesia is part of WikiProject Indonesia, which aims to improve Wikipedia's coverage of Indonesia and Indonesia-related topics. If you would like to participate, visit the project page. Please do not substitute this template.
??? This article has not yet received a rating on the quality scale.
??? This article has not yet received a rating on the importance scale.
Indonesian WikiProject • Indonesian notice board • Indonesian WikiPortal

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Anti-Chinese legislation in Indonesia article.
Article policies

Contents

[edit] Repeal of these laws

It is not correct to say most or almost all of these laws have been removed. Some are still enforced.

—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 155.56.68.221 (talk • contribs) 12:38, 4 December 2006 (UTC).

which ones? please contribute --Merbabu 12:41, 4 December 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Speedy deletion proposal

While i agree the quality of this article is poor, and maybe incorrectly makes assertions about the current situation, I believe that the information is useful from a historical perspective and the problems in the artilce can be fixed. It is an important part of recent Indonesian history - even if it is currently a bit POV in its current form. Deletion would only be POV in the other direction. --Merbabu 12:31, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Deletion disagreed. These are facts and do not constitute any biased statements. 70.243.237.170 11:27, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Why is that there are numerous people who claim they know about this topic, but no-one will improve the article. It's just a list of legislation. I think I will start deleteing it. It's an article, not a list. Merbabu 11:37, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Deletion disagreed. Renaming article proposed. This list was a spin-off from Chinese Indonesian article. Another option would be to put stub tag to encourage more users fix up the article. Lack of details shall never be the grounds for Wikipedia deletion policy. 70.243.237.170 17:16, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Anomalies and Exceptions

There are exceptions on such laws and regulations banning the use of mandarin language, for example, the use of mandarin language in traditional chinese medicine prescriptions are not prohibited, since the legal proceedings related to this case has been suspended after a lobby made to the the Attorney General (Jaksa Agung) of Indonesia by INI ( Ikatan Naturopatis Indonesia )Blunardi 14:09, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Presenting A Few Bitter Facts

1. How many percent Indonesian Chinese students are allowed to enroll in Indonesia State University ? 5% ? Naah, Less than 3%.
2. How long it has been going like that ? Since the beginning and up to now.
3. How many Indonesian Chinese Politician Indonesia Goverment has, beside Kweek Kian Gie ? None

This is just a Few Facts. Evidences are everywhere and quite overwhelming as the matter of fact. I hope the title of "a few" will not be mis-interpreted as "nothing happened" for future reference.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Ip2665 (talk • contribs).

Well, please contribute if you can verify with references. No-one is pretending that this article doesn't need work. Merbabu 12:11, 24 December 2006 (UTC)
I'll answer your questions.
  1. Most of them are not even interested in enrolling to state university, focusing more on private owned universities (usually Christian Universities)instead where their own ethnicity is the majority, so they can keep to themselves rather than mingling with the natives in state-owned universities.
  2. Since the beginning of time since Chinese ethnicities were given special status above native Indonesians by the colonial Dutch, made them think themselves as an exclusive society, more refined thatn the natives. Later, the discriminatory legislations by the government made it worse, making them leaning more to decide to flock within their own community.
  3. Most of them are not interested in Indonesia's politics to start with. This partly due to discrimination from the former governments. But there are a lot of prominent figures such as:
  * Arief Budiman (Soe Hok Djin), scholar in political studies.
   * Alvin Lie, member of Parliament from PAN.
   * Harry Tjan Silalahi, former student activist in 1960s, former member of the Supreme Advisory Council, former member of the Parliament, intellectual focusing on politics and policy studies, Co-Founder of CSIS.
   * Jusuf Wanandi, former student activist in 1960s, former representative in the People’s Consultative Assembly, intellectual focusing on policy and strategic studies, Co-Founder of CSIS.
   * Kwik Kian Gie, PDIP politician, former minister in the administrations of Abdurrahman Wahid and Megawati Sukarnoputri.
   * Mari Pangestu, Minister of Trade in the era of President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono (2004 - present)
   * Oei Tjoe Tat, Old Order politician and once President Sukarno's advisor
   * Soe Hok Gie, political analyst and activist in 1960s
   * Yap Tjwan Bing, member of the Committee for the Preparation of Indonesia’s Independence (PPKI)

I believe that the problem with Chinese Indonesians-Native Indonesians problem lies within both of the parties. If the Native Indonesians can accept that the Chinese Indonesians as a part of Indonesia and not some foreigners, and Chinese Indonesians can see the Natives as equals and not some semi-human beings, they would get along fine :) Matahari Pagi 04:10, 29 September 2007 (UTC)



Someone is ignorantly pretending nothing happened to Chinese in Indonesia. I strongly advised that someone to look at the article's examples just as start and then search the Wikipedia for a lot more overwhelming references.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Ip2665 (talk • contribs).

As I said, there is no reason why you can't do this as long as the references are reliable sources. People can request information of other editors, but ultimately, it can only be up to the individual editors what articles they chose to work on. Merbabu 01:44, 26 December 2006 (UTC)


It seems that someone is disagree with this topic for some reasons. And instead of giving his/her own contributions about the grounds of his/her disagreement, this someone so far can only ask other editors contributions. Furthermore, proposes a deletion based on current condition ? A speedy one.

While facts may not be reliable but they are still sources. The quality of those sources depend on who, what, where and when they come from. There were no rape cases in Indonesia Riot 1998 if we are talking about police report is the 'Only' reliable resource, while facts and other reports from different organizations are overwhelming, just for an example. Funny thing is I just remember how Suharto will exactly handle this similar situation. Any disagreements with him is good for deletion. A speedy one (read: kidnapping). Please be more contributive yourself. Add more and be more constructive and lead other wikipedians to build the community in a more constructive ways. I strongly agree with Lack of Detail shall never be the ground for any deletions policy. Especially for a good Wikipedian policy. Ip2665 11:07, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Ip2665, who is "someone" that you keep mentioning. Why not improve the article yourself instead of berating others for not doing it. That is how wikipedia works! If you want something improved, start the improvements yourself. You don't need permission. he he Merbabu 11:26, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Tidying up

Important as the subject of this article is, I don't think it justifies a separate article for each of the discriminatory laws. I think the way ahead is for editors to track down the relevant laws and regulations and replace the redlinks with a brief summary of the relevant legislation, as I have done with the MPRS decree. Davidelit