User talk:Almondwine

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[edit] Welcome Headline

I'm keeping this here so I have it in a handy reference location!

Almondwine 08:25, 17 July 2006 (UTC)


Welcome!
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--WillMak050389 17:34, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Virginia not a state

Can you explain how Virginia is not a state and, if it isn't, how it manages to have the votes of its two senators and eight representatives recognized in Congress year after year after year, and under what legal theory laws that apply only to states and to the District of Columbia, such as the Child Left Behind Act, are enforced against Virginia? —Largo Plazo 05:12, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

You seem to have an idea that one word can mean only one thing and can't ever mean anything else in any context. Regardless of what "state" might mean in other contexts, or what it might have meant before the founding of the U.S., these entities are all rightfully called "states" in the context of their association with the United States of America because that's the term that the Constitution uses to identify them.

You gave Puerto Rico as an example of an entity that could become the 51st star on the flag no matter what it calls itself. That's the point: it does call itself "Commonwealth of Puerto Rico", but it lacks voting representation in Congress and doesn't have a star on the flag because it isn't a state in the Federal sense. Virginia has both, precisely because it is accorded the status of "state" as the term is used in the context of the United States government. —Largo Plazo 06:10, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

Virginia's own constitution takes it for granted that Virginia is a state.

  • Article I, Section 13: " That a well regulated militia, composed of the body of the people, trained to arms, is the proper, natural, and safe defense of a free state, therefore, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed; that standing armies, in time of peace, should be avoided as dangerous to liberty; and that in all cases the military should be under strict subordination to, and governed by, the civil power."
  • Article V, Section 2: "... the State Board of Elections ...".
  • Article VII, Section 10: "The General Assembly shall not authorize any such debt ... for capital projects for school purposes and sold to the Literary Fund, the Virginia Supplemental Retirement System, or other State agency prescribed by law ...".
  • Article VIII, Section 2, Standards of quality; State and local support of public schools.
  • Article VIII, Section 8: "Such proceeds shall be paid into the state treasury and shall be distributed by law for the purpose of promoting law enforcement."
  • Article VIII, Section 10, State appropriations prohibited to schools or institutions of learning not owned or exclusively controlled by the State or some subdivision thereof; exceptions to rule.: "No appropriation of public funds shall be made to any school or institution of learning not owned or exclusively controlled by the State or some political subdivision thereof ...".
  • Article VIII, Section 11: "The General Assembly may also provide for a State agency or authority to assist in borrowing money ...".
  • Article IX, Section 1, State Corporation Commission: "There shall be a permanent commission which shall be known as the State Corporation Commission ...".
  • Article X, Section 1: " The General Assembly may define and classify taxable subjects. Except as to classes of property herein expressly segregated for either State or local taxation, the General Assembly may segregate the several classes of property so as to specify and determine upon what subjects State taxes, and upon what subjects local taxes, may be levied."

Etc. —Largo Plazo 12:44, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

OK, you've confirmed what I suspected: you're the kind of person who fixes on a single definition of a word, generally the first one it ever had, or the narrow way it's used in one arbitrary context, and then insist that the word only ever, for the rest of eternity has that fixed, narrow sense, and that any other use of the word isn't real. In your case, "state" is a word from political theory, and it can only ever be strictly used in that single sense. By the same logic, your father's brother technically isn't your uncle, because "uncle" originally meant your mother's brother, because it comes from the Latin "avunculus" that has that meaning, while the Latin word for father's brother is "patruus". Never mind that in modern English usage, "uncle" covers both senses: in linguistic theory, only your mother's brother can be your uncle. Or we don't really ever calculate anything, because the word "calculate" comes from Latin "calcula", "pebble", and the word only properly refers to reckoning assisted by the use of pebbles, which no one does these days. Or an electric guitar isn't a guitar because a guitar is an instrument that produces sounds from the resonance produced within its body by the vibration of the strings on the outside, and that's not how the sound of an "electric guitar" is produced. —Largo Plazo 15:22, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

"that's what definitions are, my good man. you should treat them with respect."

I do. And I know that a word can have many of them.

" in my field (which happens to be international relations, so i know a good deal about this business) the word "state" means something very specific, "

...and in discussions of political theory, where there is a need to differentiate finely between different types of political entities, I agree. But the word "state" isn't being used in that sense. It's being used in another sense that's recognized by both the United States Constitution and the Constitution of Virginia for the purpose at hand. It's defined officially and by custom. A word can't be any more defined than that.

"and it has to or else we'd become confused and have long arguments about what a state is when such an argument would not happen if our ideas were clear at the outset."

There won't be any argument because outside of the narrow field of political theory everyone in the world understands that the United States of America is the name of a nation and that it consists of 50 states in the sense that that word is used in the context of the USA.

"wikipedia, and in fact most things, have little patience for careless usage of words and such careless usage usually causes more confusion than clarification."

It isn't any more careless than is calling your father's brother your uncle.

"your point on flexibility of language and its evolution is well taken, but it is hardly relevant. official documents still refer to virginia as a commonwealth, jim webb still calls himself the junior senator from the commonwealth of virginia, "

Yes, the official full name of Virginia is "Commonwealth of Virginia". I know. I'm making no argument that it's wrong to say so, or to call Virginia a "commonwealth". Yet a document as official as Virginia's constitution also calls it a state, numerous times.

"and and nobody here in Charlottesville calls it the state of virginia"

Lots of people don't call cars "automobiles" but that doesn't mean it's a mistake to call a car an automobile.

"we may no longer restrict uncle to our maternal uncles, just like we may no longer restrict state to national-level governments. but when we are being specific, as is the case on wikipedia, then we must use language according to its specific and not impressionistic meanings"

So in a Wikipedia article on "Family", it would be wrong to refer to a father's brother as an uncle? Which is it, we have to be specific on Wikipedia, or we can be impressionistic?
For purposes of discussing a political entity's role in the framework of the United States, "state" does have a specific meaning that happens not to be the one you use in discussing the more general realm of political theory. Likewise, "state" has a specific meaning in science: the state of an object or system is the totality of its condition at a given instant. Since a political state is always changing, it must be a mistake to call it a "state", right? —Largo Plazo 15:55, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The bigger Arlington reversion

In the midst of our discussion on "state" versus "commonwealth", I'd overlooked something that I now just noticed: on January 26, you reverted the entire article to its state 13 days earlier, eliminating a large number of revisions that had been made by different people throughout: "Revert to revision 100384555 dated 2007-01-13 05:06:53 by Largoplazo using popups)." Fortunately, someone else noticed ("12:38, 28 January 2007 Thesmothete (Talk | contribs) (reverting unexplained reversion by Almondwine on Jan 26, that eliminated a lot of useful corrective edits. Next step will be to try to replace some additional edits.)") and restored everything that had been lost. —Largo Plazo 12:23, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

Was a mistake, thanks for the heads up. Almondwine 15:36, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] WP Christianity

Hi, I saw your name on the WikiProject Christianity Membership page.

I've made some changes to the WP Christianity main project page, added several sup-project pages, created a few task forces section, and proposed several more possible changes so that we can really start making some serious progress on the project. Please stop by and see my comments on the project talk page here and consider joining a task force or helping out with improving and contributing to our sub-projects. Thanks for your time! Nswinton 13:34, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] June 2007 Wikiproject Christianity Article

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[edit] Parrots

Ah its good to see the important articles being developed - cheers SatuSuro 05:31, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] WikiProject Christianity Newsletter

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[edit] WikiProject Christianity Newsletter

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