Talk:Alison Bechdel

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Contents 1 Lesbian? 2 The wrong kind of lesbian? 3 Info on AB's partner 4 cat, books 5 Bechdel Test

[edit] Lesbian?

She's on List of famous gay, lesbian or bisexual people - but is she lesbian, bisexual, or maybe even straight? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by MyRedDice (talk • contribs) 22:55, 17 September 2003.

She is most assuredly a lesbian. Good heavens. (If you need more specific proof than, well, her entire oeuvre, check out The Indelible Alison Bechdel.) - Montrealais

The article makes no mention of her sexuality. Although she is listed in several lesbian categories, this is very unclear for a casual reader who may not be familiar with Bechdel.--ZayZayEM 07:02, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Well, it does say that she married her partner Amy Rubin. Not many guys named Amy. That said, where do you think it would be appropriate to say this explicitly? —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 15:46, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The wrong kind of lesbian?

She's an old-skool lesbian with a typical complete blindness to bisexuality (the closest any significant character has come to bisexuality is Sparrow's 180-degree switch from wholly lesbian to wholly heterosexual). This is strange, since Bechdel has embraced and addressed trans issues (which are usually a topic traditional lesbians are even less open to than bi issues). —This unsigned comment was added by Kala (talk • contribs) .

I doubt there is a wrong kind of lesbian, but anyway there were earlier bi characters (and open discussion of Mo's discomfort with them) when Naomi got a boyfriend. Also, Lois has dated a couple males (remember the geek she brought back from some demo and played croquet with.) --Jaibe 01:12, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

Naomi coming out as bisexual and starting a bi support group was treated entirely in terms of the lesbian characters' reaction, and she was written out after the revelation. Similarly, you never see Sparrow deal with any of the issues real bi women go through - she's never mentioned major bi issues, even when they're headline news in the mainstream media; her whole relationship-with-a-man story, again, was treated as a big surprise for the lesbian characters to react to; and if you didn't know the character had been written as a lesbian before, you wouldn't see anything to indicate she's anything other than heterosexual now. 76.214.161.245 15:17, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

I recommend that you read all the strips first - Skysmith 15:52, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

I have read them all, including the uncollected calendars and whatnot, and stand unreservedly by my statement. I'm hardly the first person to point this out - there's a Comics Journal review of Bechdel that singles this point out, as I recall, and the critique was not new there. I think it the D2WO4 article would benefit from some recognition of how it's dealt with various issues and how those strips were received - both the good (Susie Bright considered the mention of On Our Backs in D2WO4 a turning point that showed a significant change in the lesbian community) and the bad (the "bisexual" characters have received significant amounts of criticism within the bisexual community.) Something that says "this is good, this is bad" clearly violates NPOV, but there are plenty of published pieces that could be cited. 76.214.161.245 19:53, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Info on AB's partner

Since this bit of information has apparently become an issue, we need to answer a few questions: (1) what is it's source? For example, is it common knowledge that AB freely makes known in interviews? (2) How relevant is it to the article? (3) Do other entries list a writer's (or artist's) partner? --Galliaz 11:35, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

Since marriage history is a normal part of biography, I added Ms. Bechdel's. I was surprised that I couldn't find a wikipedia article about the San Francisco weddings to link to, incidently. At least there is a gay marriage link. --Jaibe 01:06, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

Ah. In a recent Guardian article AB says she recently lost her long-term partner. That may account for the thrashing in on this page last July. Marriage histories are often documented in Wikipedia (see Richard Dawkins) and I think the fact the two of them were married in the SF event is still an interesting bit of history. But I'm not sure how to handle this more recent bit of news. Maintaining an up-to-date relationship history seems morbid and invasive. On the other hand, she documented her marriage on her blog and credited Rubin in many of her books, and she has now publicly documented the end of the relationship. --Jaibe 20:09, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

Yes, it's certainly a delicate issue, I agree. Just for the record, I thought I'd provide a link to the 10.16.06 Guardian article. [1]--Galliaz 20:47, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

I didn't have this page on my watchlist in July, so I missed the fireworks. But I'd say that marriage history is appropriate biographical information for a Wikipedia article, and since Bechdel has mentioned it in an interview I think it would be fair to mention it in the article. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 23:27, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

This is AB's comment about relationships from the Guardian article: " 'I am quite distanced on my own life, she concedes. 'I fit the life in around the work. I don't really have a life apart from my work. I have no kids, no partner. I actually just broke up with my partner of 13 years, partly because all I do is sit in my basement, drawing.' " Just to clarify the nature and context of her statement.--Galliaz 12:27, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, I read the linked article. I think that as long as we cite things properly, it should be OK to mention this briefly. If this were a notable heterosexual cartoonist, who was saying "I have no kids, no wife. I actually just divorced my wife of 13 years, partly because all I do is sit in the basement, drawing", would we be debating whether or not to include the information? I understand the desire not to be invasive, but it's not like we'd be revealing anything AB hasn't revealed herself. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 21:13, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

actually I'd feel exactly the same way about discussing anyone's current relationship issues. Just because they were mentioned once in the press doesn't make them encyclopedia material -- I certainly have regretted things I've apparently said that I've read in the press. An encyclopedia article shouldn't be a soap opera I don't think. I agree that the Rubin relationship and marriage are significant enough to be mentioned in a bio page, but I think there should probably be a "cooling off period" around major relationship events before they get written up in any detail. I think we should leave this part of the article as it is now and come back to it in a couple years. Or maybe in the current mention of Amy Rubin replace "long-term" with "partner since 1992". But I'd rather leave out the "then partner"-type business until there is more water under the bridge.--Jaibe 20:00, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

I think that sufficient water has flowed under the bridge now, especially since Bechdel and Rubin have both posted on the DTWOF blog confirming the break-up. It's unarguably in the realm of "public information", and it would be misleading to continue to remove it. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 06:39, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] cat, books

Ha! I thought from the history / change notice someone had bio-ed Alison's cat, but no, it was fixing a category. By the way, some more obsessive fan than me should make pages for all the books besides Fun Home... --Jaibe 20:43, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Bechdel Test

Ought the "Bechdel Test" be referenced on this page? It's mentioned on the DTWOF entry, but since it bears Bechdel's name (that's how I've most often heard it termed), should it be mentioned here? I actually came to this article looking for the precise formulation of the test, and was confused not to see it mentioned. Thought for a moment I'd gotten the name wrong.89.125.85.107 (talk) 03:17, 17 November 2007 (UTC)