Talk:Alexander Cartwright

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Start This article has been rated as Start-Class on the project's quality scale. [FAQ]

I would like to see the documentation for the following two statements: "There, Cartwright established the first baseball league composed of teams he created from throughout the Hawaiian islands. His Hawaiian leagues became a model for the modern American and National Leagues of today." I'm writing the biography of AJ Cartwright and have never found this to be a fact in over five years of research.


[edit] WikiProject:Baseball

I've added this to the Baseball WikiProject. I've labled as "Start" class because, while there's information here, it's fairly unsourced and there are some legitimate concerns with the accuracy (see above comments). I've labeled it as "High" importance because, as this man is "another" purported inventor of modern baseball, we want to make sure that it, as a basis for a lot of baseball to come after him, is accurately represented. -Sliver7 14:01, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

  • The questions of accuracy possibly stem from the long-standing efforts to turn Alex Cartwright into the "real Abner Doubleday". Wahkeenah 17:57, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
  • My questions of accuracy have to do with wanting to see actual documentation of Cartwright's involvement with baseball leagues in Hawaii for the biography I am writing on his life. Through my years of research, I have not found any documentation that he involved himself with baseball in a formal way while he lived in Hawaii. Most of the information is passed down through oral history and of his playing of the game on occasion in Honolulu for pleasure with sons and grandchildren. Seeing things in writing, especially in a format such as Wikipedia, that have no documentation to back it up is like reciting the Doubleday Myth all over again. I think if you look through files at the State Archives in Honolulu you will see that Lorrin Thurston (who overthrew the monarchy) actually started a baseball league in Hawaii. His baseball scrapbook can be viewed at the archives.BaseballGirl
    • Maybe I should have said the "Johnny Appleseed" of baseball. Legends come from basic facts, with "what if" embellishments added, that somehow also evolve into "facts". Wahkeenah 12:01, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Baseball vs. Vintage Base Ball

The opening paragraph says:

Alexander Joy Cartwright (April 17, 1820 – July 12, 1892) was officially credited by the United States Congress on June 3, 1953, with inventing the modern game of base ball. Cartwright was a bookseller in Manhattan, and a volunteer fireman. Cartwright founded the Knickerbocker Baseball Club (after the Knickerbocker Fire Engine Company) in 1842. [<ref> tags redacted]

Firstly, given the context of "base ball", shouldn't the "base ball" wikilink be piped to Vintage Base Ball and not the article pertaining to the modern version? It is talking about the Knickerbocker Rules, invented in 1847, after all. Given that baseball as we know it wasn't even invented until 1890 or so … Micahbrwn 04:38, 24 September 2007 (UTC)