Talk:Agnes Scott College

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Contents

[edit] Sourcing material

Please let me know what needs to have references on here to keep in line with Wikipedia standards. There was a comment on a previous edit about providing a source when the original material wasn't even sourced. I've been to appropriate help pages, but still confused as to why "original research" was okay unsourced. Thanks. 2003graduate 02:51, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Hi, 2003graduate. I reverted your edit because it appeared you obtained your information by having the "new stats confirmed with alumnae office." Your edit comment made it sound like you were relying on original research done in person with the college, which is against Wikipedia policy. When you do get information like that from a website, your source needs to be cited within the article. If you can please go back and source your information, that would be appreciated.
So, in brief, the revert wasn't done because I doubted the accuracy of your information -- it was done because the information was not presented properly within the article, and it appeared it had also been obtained in a way not accepted on Wikipedia. Beginning 08:43, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for input. The comment was made because of the following recent changes:

  • 71.56.39.5 adds new info from agnesscott.edu
  • 2003graduate updates info in textbody, noting lack of agreement between current and previous numbers
  • 65.14.60.2 reverts to undated stats from undocumented source
  • 2003graduate changes back to info from website, which has now been confirmed with college
  • Beginning reverts to stats from undocumented source

So, ultimately, I was confused as to why you reverted the research back to an undocumented source, if sourcing is required. At any rate, new stats are now documented. Feel free to revert if you or anyone knows the source and date of the original stats. Thanks. 2003graduate 20:41, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] History

Added a link to George Washington Scott of Leon County, Florida 25px Noles1984 21:32, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

Thanks! I didn't realize he did so much. Just to clarify- your article says that he payed $112,250 to have the name changed from Decatur Female Seminary to Agnes Scott Institute. Your linked source says it was later changed to Agnes Scott College after achieving college status. In this article, you wrote that the name was changed to ASC from ASI after a donation of $122,250. Either way, we get the point that George Scott was the primary benefactor, regardless of how much was paid for this small women's college. (2003graduate)

[edit] Undergraduate Campus Life

[edit] Mascot list getting long

The alumnae office provided me with the mascot list. I thought the list was interesting, because there are a lot of archaic popular culture references. (How many of us kids know who Pogo is?) I know the list is long, so if others in wikipedia would rather it not be recorded, that's fine. I figured with each year, I'd start to put the old mascots in the discussion section, for further reading enjoyment.-2003 graduate

I think it's fine now, as long as the article isn't too long. It is of interest. Thanks for that! (PS, you can automatically make a linked and timestamped signature like mine by typing "~~~~"). Dmcdevit·t 08:06, 18 October 2005 (UTC)
I've noticed on other college pages that if a subject got too long, it was placed on a separate but linked page. Should we start doing that soon? I'm thinking about fleshing out the history section, and this process will likely make that section longer.2003graduate 03:53, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

The mascot list is no longer an issue, as it has been removed. If you can find verifiable sources, feel free to add it back, but I have had no success doing so. Note that the alumnae office is not a reliable third-party source, and thus does not meet Wikipedia's verifiability standards. Thanks. Ketsuekigata (talk) 04:44, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Phoenix

Whoever added Phoenix to the list didn't link it correctly. I'm not in touch with the college anymore, so I don't know if he/she meant Phoenix Jean Grey or Phoenix the bird.2003graduate 03:53, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Rankings

I managed to find the name of Georgia's first female Rhodes scholar and found another notable alum along the way. Also, I'm glad someone's updating Agnes Scott's rank, but rather than giving a history of its rank from 2004 on, why don't we just state what it's current rankings are? I couldn't comment on ASC's current women's college rank, so I left it out for now. -2003 graduate

We might as well just say that it was top fifty at one point, since that's notable (and they made a big deal out of it) and then give whatever the curretn rankings are. Skip all the stuff in between. Dmcdevit·t 21:46, September 4, 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Distinguished alums

Distinguished alumnae include the first woman to be ordained a minister in the Presbyterian Church (USA), a Chief Justice of the South Carolina Supreme Court...

Does anyone know their names? Even if they don't have their own articles, their identities shouldn't be a mystery to readers. Beginning 01:30, Jan 5, 2005 (UTC)

After a little searching, I was able to find the information from www.womenscolleges.org. I also added a bit on the history from the website and a campus tradition - the finals care packages - that an alumna told me about. Sayeth 02:05, Jan 5, 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Joanna Cook Moore

I didn't know Joanna Cook Moore was an alumna. I did a google search but came up with nothing. I asked some people in the administration, but they didn't know. I searched the ASC website but didn't find her name. Just curious where this info comes from, but I don't doubt its validity.2003graduate 23:00, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Unsourced Claims - Verifiability?

This article seems to be full of original research and unsourced claims. Although I am aware (through my own ) that many of these claims are true, I am concerned that they may not be verifiable through third-party sources. For this reason, I am, for the time being, removing the list of Black Cat mascots, as I could find no source that meets Wikipedia's reliability standards. Ketsuekigata (talk) 04:31, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

Where can we find a source that meets the reliability standards? This is a small college that isn't publicly known. The only other online source for this college is its own website. Do we need to make up a website and list the mascots in order for the info to become credible by Wikipedia's standards? The only source I found comes from within the college and isn't printed for the public, so I guess that makes it original research. Tell me a third party source that can be used and we'll make it up just so the info can be printed here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Pennylane2345 (talk • contribs) 22:24, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

No, of course you don't make up websites. If you can't find a source available to the public, the information doesn't belong on Wikipedia. Ketsuekigata (talk) 21:48, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

I checked out Wikipedia's page on verifiability and it says questionable material can be kept if it meets their criteria. I didn't see it not meeting the criteria.... Eh, it's up to you guys. I just don't think you're going to find an unquestionable academic source on this small topic. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Pennylane2345 (talk • contribs) 22:34, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

As far as I can tell, it doesn't say that anywhere in the verifiability page. Of course you're probably not going to find an unquestionable source on this, which is why it doesn't belong on wikipedia at all. I'm removing it again. Please do not replace it unless you find a source, or at least point to the part of the verifiability page that has the criteria you mentioned. Ketsuekigata (talk) 21:43, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Here is the info from the verifiability page. Do you guys think it's okay to put in the mascot info?: Material from self-published and questionable sources may be used as sources in articles about themselves, so long as: it is relevant to their notability; it is not contentious; it is not unduly self-serving; it does not involve claims about third parties; it does not involve claims about events not directly related to the subject; there is no reasonable doubt as to who authored it; the article is not based primarily on such sources.

Feel free to remove mascots after reading this. Thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.111.33.42 (talk) 23:46, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

I'm afraid I didn't make myself very clear before. The main reason I have a problem with the list is that it doesn't even seem to be on the ASC website. The information, therefore, seems to have come from either the list painted on a pillar in the campus center at Agnes Scott, or from some direct communication with the college. What you said about self-published sources is correct; however, a self-published source still needs to be one that is available to the general public, and original research is still inappropriate. Even if a source isn't unquestionable and academic, it needs to be verifiable. If you find any verifiable source on this, even if it's self-published, we can discuss that then. Until then, this is inappropriate for Wikipedia. Ketsuekigata (talk) 19:27, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
In that case, most if not all of the alumnae section needs to be deleted. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.111.33.42 (talk) 20:23, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
That may be the case; however, I think you could probably find sources for that (although it might take more than one). If you look into it and are unable to find reliable sources to the point where you are concerned that there may not be any, feel free to remove that information. Ketsuekigata (talk) 03:43, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

I looked at the rest of the areas that say "citation needed" and it looks like all of the quotes come indirectly from ASC's website. If I knew how to put citations in this page, I'd do it.... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Pennylane2345 (talk • contribs) 22:38, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Strategic Plan 2007

  • Recently installed (October 2007) the Strategic Plan for 2014 is an effort to improve Agnes Scott in multiple areas. I have included the link to the original document {PDF format) below, and if someone has time this information is certainly relevant enough to be added to the article, as it concerns the future of the college. If I find the time, I may attempt to write the section, but only if no one else will.

Strategic Plan PDF

  • And I don't think the above is a really good source for it, but something should probably be said about the college's efforts to become self-sustainable through recycling, energy/water conservation, etc. It is mentioned as a part of the Strategic Plan, but it doesn't seem very complete.

Menthaxpiperita (talk) 05:59, 26 February 2008 (UTC)