Talk:4th Time Around
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from VfD:
An essay about a single song by Bob Dylan, which says it's Dylan's version of the song "Norweigan [sic] Wood", or maybe "Norwiegan [sic] Wood". I realize that Dylanology is still a booming business, but this song is no "Blowing in the Wind" and I wonder if it's all that notable; meanwhile, this article as it now stands contains what I'll charitably term "original research". -- Hoary 03:39, 2005 Jan 12 (UTC)
- Delete, a song that is barely notable, certainly looks like a POV original research. Megan1967 04:36, 12 Jan 2005 (UTC)
- Keep -- The article obviously needs some major cleanup but the article on Norwegian Wood (This Bird Has Flown) makes mentions that this song was a response to "Norwegian Wood". DCEdwards1966 05:33, Jan 12, 2005 (UTC)
- Delete, Norwegian Wood notes this topic. Wyss 06:08, 12 Jan 2005 (UTC)
- Keep. Added cleanup header. --Viriditas | Talk 06:59, 12 Jan 2005 (UTC)
- Trust cleanup and keep. Samaritan 10:20, 12 Jan 2005 (UTC)
- Would it be too much to compare this with Back in the U.S.S.R.? Keep. Cool Hand Luke 10:32, 12 Jan 2005 (UTC)
- Keep. --JuntungWu 13:03, 12 Jan 2005 (UTC)
- Weak Keep. Definitely needs cleanup. Perhaps the song isn't that notable, but given Dylan's notability, by extension any song he wrote is certainly of some interest. Just merging it into Norwegian Wood (This Bird Has Flown) (note: I fixed the link to bypass the redirect) would not do it justice. --RoySmith 14:47, 12 Jan 2005 (UTC)
- comment, no vote. If this was Dylanology, you'd get about four pages of detailed discussion on whether it came before, after, or simultaneously with Norwegian Wood. (There's an elaborate story involving hotel rooms and rubbish bins, I think, but I forget the details). The linkage between them is, um, canonically accepted... or however you might want to term that; not research original to the article author, anyway. Is a random Dylan song encyclopedic? Couldn't comment. What do we have for precedent? (Tending towards a week keep with a rewrite, but...) Shimgray 17:01, 12 Jan 2005 (UTC)
- Keep Of course a Dylan song is notable Philip 03:14, 13 Jan 2005 (UTC)
- keep - David Gerard 20:00, 13 Jan 2005 (UTC)
- Keep, it's a crappy article, but doesn't deserve deletion, I think. Tuf-Kat 23:58, Jan 13, 2005 (UTC)
- Serious Editing Needed, this article is just not good and is more opinion than anything. If one thing needs to go, it's the "direct message to Lennon" bit. The song is notable not only because of its relation to "Norwegian Wood" but also because there's a Byrds song with the same melody. I don't know which song, but there was a George Harrison interview in Guitar World quite a while ago where he reflects on how that melody was being passed around between several bands. Dylan also played it during the acoustic half of the 65-66 tour. The acoustic set included "Desolation Row," "Mr. Tambourine Man," "Visions of Johanna," and "Just Like A Woman" which are all very strong songs, so he apparently thinks highly of "4th Time Around."--68.49.56.238 23:11, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
As a huge Dylan-fan i've pondered over the lyrics a lot, and my interpretation is a lot different. As I see it, the narrator in the song visits a prostitute since his wife, being disabled, is unable to satisfy him sexually. (...I tried to make sense/ out of that picture of you in your wheelchair...) Upon realising that the prostitute and his wife know each other he panics for fear the wife might find out, and strangles the prostitute to death. Later he confesses to his wife, with no sign of remorse. If this interpretation is correct the title of the song would also make sense, since the story takes place during the fourth visit to the prostitute. I was just wondering if anybody else has thought the same thing about the song. JesperLærke 02:08, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
end moved discussion
[edit] boasting
Someone enjoys using the word "boasts" a lot and wrongly.
"4th Time Around" was commonly speculated to be a response to The Beatles' song "Norwegian Wood" - written by John Lennon and Paul McCartney for their 1965 album Rubber Soul - as the two tracks boast a reasonably similar melody and lyrical premise. "Norwegian Wood" was considered an artistic leap for Lennon, as it was his earliest story-song and boasted an obvious Dylan-influence.
