Talk:3d Armored Cavalry Regiment (United States)

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[edit] 3d versus 3rd

Just so no one tries to rename this article again: "3d" is not a typo. The U.S. Army uses "3d" instead of "3rd". (Atfyfe 20:42, 15 June 2006 (UTC))

[edit] Civil War service

When an article about the 3rd U.S. Cavalry Regiment is created, this page should be removed from Category:Union Army regiments and cross-referenced to those articles. Twisted86 06:52, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Corrections and Removal

I corrected several scattered instances of "3rd," "third cavalry," and the like to the standard "3d Cavalry;" as well as "[the] regiment" to "Regiment."

In the section about CPT David Rozelle, I removed this statement: "One of the contributing factors that caused this was that Capt. Rozelle had failed to line the bottom of his Humvee with sand bags. This was to supposed to help prevent the blast from entering the vehicle. Has he followed this order, the injury might not have been that substantial." In addition to the poor writing, this section is uninformed speculation. First, there is no reliable source cited for the existence of an order regarding sand bags (because there was no such order) and second, a sand bag-lined floor would not have mitigated the effects of an anti-tank mine explosion on the occupants of a Humvee.63.160.173.6 17:25, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

I agree 63.160.173.6, I think the statement is out-of-line. I don't know how CPT Rozelle's Troop ran, but in my unit the idea that sandbags ought to be put at the bottom of our Humvees was not a command but more of a rumor that soldiers didn't know what exactly to make of. Plus the sandbags could only be fitted to a very small portion of the bottom of the Humvee. -- Atfyfe () 04:23, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Squadron sub-sections

I standardized the initial format for the squadron sub-sections in the "Origins" section to make them all look the same. I filled in most of the unit "nicknames" from memory, but I've forgotten some, namely HHT, 4th Squadron and HHT, Support Squadron. Also, the Howitzer Batteries for 2d and 3d Squadrons are "Lion" and "Regulator," but I'm not sure which one was which. I haven't been able to find a source for these at the official unit site, Globalsecurity.org, military.com, or anywhere else, so somebody with a better memory than me will have to fill those in.

Also, the Longknife Squadron unit history could use a little cleaning up, and the last paragraph of the Muleskinner Squadron section (regarding OIF III) is of questionable notability. Mike f 16:51, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

HHT SPT is Bullwhip - fixed that. I also cleaned up some of the Muleskinner history for OIF3, but I don't know enough about 4/3 to touch that. My suggestion would be to check the "Mounted Rifleman" magazine (posted obscurely on the ft carson website) for better info and history. Also, I noticed that at some point DarthBinky took out "At present, the 3d Armored Cavalry Regiment is the only heavy armored cavalry regiment left in the Army," in the header, stating that the 11th and 2nd still exist. Well, yes, they exist, but they are light cavalry regiments, not heavy, as in, our 3ACR's Abrams will roll right over your 2ACR Bradley. Sorry, Binky, I'm putting it back. -Rich-cat the Pad God 207.135.154.248 00:28, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

What do we do about Troop names that have changed over time? When I was in C Troop 89-91, it was "Cyclone" Troop, not "Crazyhorse," and we had cyclones painted on the frontal slope portion of the turret of the tanks (don't remember about the Bradleys tho). 71.38.51.145 03:31, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

forgot to login, previous question is mine Aramis1250 03:33, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Organisation and History

I've been trying to track down the changes in unit size, organisation, and equipment over the years. Obviously, there's the shift from horses to tanks, but info on the US Army's armoured cavalry regiments is a bit thin. For instance, a lot of detail about the current unit, less on earlier times. Some of this just needs linking to the correct article, I'm sure, but a couple of references suggest that not all the periodic reorganisations of units were applied to all the ACRs. I get the feeling that it needs an insider to explain it all to the rest of us. Zhochaka 14:35, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Steve-o.JPG

Image:Steve-o.JPG is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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BetacommandBot 11:43, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was Move. (While I personally disagree that we have to respect "official name" in every nitpicking aspect, especially like this one). Duja► 14:16, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Shouldn't be too controversial ... the unit's official designation is "3d", NOT "3rd", so the article should be named accordingly (see WP:MILHIST#Military_units_and_formations). Also see http://www.hood.army.mil/3d_acr/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mike f (talk • contribs) 17:55, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

However, all of the text uses 3rd, and 3rd gets double the number of Google hits, so it is obviously thought to be correct by someone... Conrad.Irwin 22:12, 16 September 2007 (UTC)
The text of this article uses "3rd" because the same person who moved the article changed all instances of "3d" to "3rd" at the same time. I don't know why the Google hits are they way they are, but I would refer to the unit's official site again: http://www.hood.army.mil/3d_acr/ as well as a few official documents that use "3d": http://www.hood.army.mil/3d_ACR/content/history/unitawards/valorous_unit_award3.pdf ; http://www.hood.army.mil/3d_ACR/content/history/unitawards/valorous_unit_award.pdf ; http://www.hood.army.mil/3d_ACR/content/history/unitawards/valorous_unit_award2.pdf not to mention the unit's official history: http://www.hood.army.mil/3d_ACR/content/history/regimental_history.html . So, just because "someone" thinks "3rd" is correct does not make it so. Mike f 22:49, 16 September 2007 (UTC)
The problem is "helpful" people who come along every so often and switch everything from 3d to 3rd. I never corrected it only because I saw that this was probably both a re-occurring and systemic problem with all the units that should be "3d" instead of "3rd" (for example: 3rd Infantry Division (United States)). What we really need is a wide-ranging and permanent solution to keep “3d” safe from careless editors on all the entries it appears. - Atfyfe 23:46, 16 September 2007 (UTC) - Atfyfe 23:46, 16 September 2007 (UTC)
Conrad.Irwin, it isn't correct it is just an easy mistake to make. If I asked any of the civilians in the coffee shop I'm in right now to write down the name "Third Infantry Division" I am sure they will all write down "3rd Infantry Division". This is wrong, but there is no reason they would know better. - Atfyfe 23:50, 16 September 2007 (UTC)
With the 3rd/3d Infantry Division, it's a little more debatable because the unit's official website uses "3rd" most often, with a few scattered uses of "3d" here and there. While that may or may not be "officially" correct according to the unit's MTOE or other such documents (I've noticed that the Army generally uses the all-capital form "2D" and "3D" on such documents), that appears to be the way the unit commonly refers to itself. With the 3d ACR, the unit invariably refers to itself specifically as "3d" -- not "3rd," not "3D," not "3RD," not "3ACR," or any other variation -- for reasons related to the unit's history. I'm sure if one looked hard enough, they could dig up an official document with "3rd ACR" on it, but that's a rare exception (usually a typo by an uninformed individual), not the rule. Mike f 00:10, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
  • I propose keeping the "3rd" designation as it is more usual and obvious. See other military unit names, as they are all designated as "3rd", not "3d". In my opinion, "3d" designation seems like an typing error to the most of the readers. --Eurocopter tigre 18:29, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
Again, according to WP:MILHIST#UNITNAME "The name should generally be the official name used by the armed forces to which the unit belongs..." Whether most of the readers think it's a typo or not doesn't matter; "3d" is the designation used by the U.S. Army -- "the armed forces to which the unit belongs." Mike f 19:32, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
If WP:MILHIST regulations say that, I have nothing to complain anymore. --Eurocopter tigre 19:37, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

[edit] Unit structure

I added a graphic of the 3d Armored Cavalry Regiments structure. However this is the old structure, which will change with the ongoing Transformation of the United States Army. The new structure will be the standardized Heavy armored brigade structure, but as I did not find any information today about which units will survive the transformation, I created a graphic with todays structure. As soon as someone knows what the new structure will be (especially what will happen with the 4th Squadron), let me know and I will update the graphic. --noclador 19:12, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Image

This image should fit in somewhere in this article. --rxnd (talk) 13:51, 26 March 2008 (UTC)