User talk:213.237.21.6

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This IP address has been blocked because it is believed to be an open proxy or zombie computer. To prevent abuse, editing from these proxies is currently prohibited. For more information about open proxies and what you can do, please see the WikiProject on open proxies.

— user:catapult 13:50, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

You have been blocked for 24 hours for disruptive edits at Talk:Bogdanov Affair, particularly this edit and this legal threat. Please see Wikipedia:No personal attacks and Wikipedia:No legal threats. Please edit more constructively when you return. Bishonen | talk 01:51, 26 August 2005 (UTC)

Contents

[edit] Please edit informationally

Hi, Sophie. I note that you started editing Talk:Bogdanov Affair in all caps again as soon as the 24-hour block ended. Please don't do that, it's seen as yelling, and it does look "hysterical", as your opponents on the page say. It's very hard for an outsider to follow what you say, especially if they can't read French, as all your references are to webpages in French. Could you try to find webpages in English to refer to as evidence for your claims? I myself found an English page by YMB about the Bogdanoff affair pretty easily through Google, so it can't be impossible. Please adduce facts and evidence to your claims, so that readers have a chance to evaluate them. Your editing does look better than before the block, so I won't re-block you right now. But if I see you do more name-calling or using all caps on that page again, I'm afraid I'll have to. Best wishes, Bishonen | talk 14:16, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

The opponent calling me hysterical did so when I had not posted anythiing at all so you should read the page again, what is written in capital letter was inserted long after the texts previous to it and after it had been written, so you can see that he is asking for my banishment for no reasons at all. I have not being editing ANYTHING AT ALL on this site and you know that. YBM has been editing all my writtings on it from the beginning also those of a user called Laurence but you never noticed it and do not blame him for that WHY? does he have the right to do it or are you just YBM himself? I don't see why you are talking about people who cannot read french as all I read is written in english and the links you talk about show a webside with links in it to the same contain in english and in german. Things you will know if you had consulted them instead of attacking me. You talk about yelling I am attackt for no reason and have to be subject to punishments which I do not deserve, and that you impose on me unjustified. All the reason you evoce her do not exist. I do not have edit anyone but my own texts. I write in english My links show a place written in 3 different languages. Links shown by other also show french web site in french like fr. physic and there is links on the french site about the bogdanov affair who show web site in english, so what you are saying is rabbish, and od not constitute an excuse for expulsion but are low argumentation to show an excuse to through me out, exactly as YBM did. The links i showed are not a web site about the bogdanov but about Voyer and YBM who act as a prove that the motives of YBM in that affair are not to conduct a scientific evaluation of the theory advanced by the Bogdanov, but a social experiment about manipulation of the masses and of evidences, as it is described in the web site which links are available in my column. Another link show what Voyer and YBM did to 2 other writers, a man ans a woman, previously to that affair, and show that he used of exactly the same tool as for this one, and that he stopped doing it when he begin to take care of the Bogdanovs affair. He is insulting the writters abondantly and even show the cover of their books with the title "de la merde!" made in such a way to appear like if it was its real title. I would like you to come forword with prove that I edited somebody text 'cause I dont see any. As for your 2 texts above I do not see what is the problem with them so explain yourself. What do you mean by threat? what kind of threat? I do read on YBM column a threat to get me banished and a threat to get me ignored and a threat to deleete all my texts no matter what I write with links to wiki revert function, which is illegal by wikis rules, and a threat to get presented as a vandaliser of the site with a link to do it, even so I did not have written a word about it. What do you mean I am not talking about the subject? Where? I am firmly keeping the subject: there is no error what so ever in the Bogdanovs book and in their thesis, there is no attempt on their part at lying or at making a bluff out of science, there is people who pretend to be what they are not and pretend to detain evidences of something they barely understand, and who constantly insult the Bogdanovs and anyone who do not have the same opi8nion as they have, who insult the Bogdanovs famili, teachers, physical appearence, life, friends, constantly and in many forum of the internet. This person is YBM and his associate are: Romnulphe, Voyer, rayon-z, and Max, and their name are to be followed every time YBM appear on a site about the subject. There is plenty of links about it. The Bogdanov have already discussed and rediscussed each and every point of the list of so called errors presented by those pseudo scientist, and have proven them wrong and other scientist have intervene too to explain how it had to be understood in theoretical physic, but yBm keep using them as if Igor had never argumented against it, and even do it in a way as if it was because he couldn't argue against it, even a fiew blog after he had got an all explaination about it. It just doesn't make sens. He always provocate people by personnal attacks and then reproach them to don't stick to the subject. Thats a clear line in all his appearences on the net. A specialist in theoritical science has once demonstrate to him how it hang together and explained each of the points he had listed, but even with that who was a perfect demonstration, he answered: I don't give a shit about it, and even if you prove me wrong on all points, I will continue anyway! he says that on fr. physic, and i put the link to it here and on the french wiki about the bogdanovs. Of course, if someone has decided that no matter what they will continue to attack you, even prooven wrong, there is not much one can do. His motives are unlegetimate, and thats what has to be understood. There is no real Bogdanov affair, it started with a paper in an scientific magazin, and the person who wrote that paper retracted it 4 days later as being wrong! John Baez did work further on it but was proven wrong by his collegues, and do not agree with YBMs' way of thought. Any references to John Baez is outdated from 2 to 3 years. All recent web site with speech from him are made by YBM on his own and without the consentment of John Baez. Writing to people employers is a method YBM used against the Bogdanov in that case but also against Sophie B. and Xavier in the other affair he conducted against 2 other writers, the women had written a cooking book!!! and lost her job because of him the other was a teacher and also lost his job because of the nature of the letters that YBM sendt to his employer. I think that enough is enough and that this guy has to be stopped. He cannot continue to create misery to all kind of people just for the fun of it. It is to be noticed that Xavier went to school with this YBM, and that YBM used the internet as a revenge agianst the succes of his class maid. Quiet pathetic, don't you think? This story is an act of madness and of jalousy.

sophie--213.237.21.6 03:49, 30 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Crossposted to Talk:Bogdanov Affair: block

I'm sorry, but the purpose of the page is to let people discuss the article, and this editing style of yours is driving off everybody who was actually doing that. I'm blocking you for one week, purely so as to allow the page to be used. Do please note that you can still edit your own talk page, and you can still e-mail other users. If you're willing to edit more to the purpose, please e-mail me, and I'll consider shortening the block. Bishonen | talk 01:18, 30 August 2005 (UTC)

What exactly do you mean by that? "sorry, but the purpose of the page is to let people discuss the article, and this editing style of yours is driving off everybody who was actually doing that" What do you mean by this "editing style of yours"? Are you suggesting that I have edit anything else but my own text? Or do you mean that I musn't perform any kind of correction on my own texts? Where are your "several warnings" that you talk about in the other site and who are OBLIGATORY to all admin before bloking a user? To let people discuss of what article? what are you talking about? this site purpose is not to discuss any article, are you completely unsane? Did you read this site entirely at any time? You have absolutely no rights what so ever to shortened the texts of other people. It is absolutely none of your business and it isn't part of your job as an admi. I found you vendicativ and partial, and you do not have what it take to be an administrator of this site if of any other. So, get lost!!! You too vaguely know about the subject, you do not know essential texts made in original languages (big minus) you don't even have followed the development of the discussions on this site, you first came in a week ago, you make falsh accusations to a victim of vandalism, you deny that fact once presented with evidences of it, you reiter your error and banish that person again because of personal dislike and professionnal failure to read and interprete correctly archives contain, you consciously wrongly accuse me of having perpetrated editing functions on other people text when it is a mistake from you, you are arrogant and insulting, and you deny factual proof who incommodate you. GO TO HELL! AND THATS EVEN TOO GOOD FOR A CROOK AND CHARLATAN LIKE YOU. ask georg to join you, I am sure the profiles feet. I am done at trying to square a circle or pour a quart into a pint pot,by trying to explain basical things to you. You don't have what it take to get it and it ain't going to happen sometime soon.

Rend mig i alfabeten!

Sophie --213.237.21.6 05:22, 30 August 2005 (UTC) There is more style over me than you could ever dream to possess.Get yourself a life!

[edit] Irrelevant posts removed to User Talk

<A couple of sections here containing dialogue between me and Sophie have been moved here, as being strictly irrelevant to Bogdanov Affair. Sophie, please feel free to delete the following if you don't want it here.>

[edit] TALKING ABOUT NETIQUETTE STILL LEFT IN THE DARK

Dear Bishonen,

I think that you din't do a thorougly job, or you will know that I have been contacting Cereal@killer for more than a week, and didn't insert anything on this site before I had told him what was going on, but nothing was done, and nobody reacted´. I discovered about the "revert" fonction only early this sunday morning, and understood how all my posts were deleeted, even as I was writng them. I wrote in capital letterS for the simple and very evident reason that my different articles regarded different texts inside the site, wrotten at different time, and that the statement had to be visible, as it had became somehow outdated by the felony of YBM, and after the way YBM tried to force me into oblivion I had all rights to mark my point one way or another. As it concerned all the readers and users that YBM fooled by his tricks, I choosed to make my part easely recognisable that way also for practical reasons, to can see when deleeted and to can reinsert them easly, as Ididn't used the revert function, but undid the commited crimes mechanically. Don't forget that my statments were warnings to the other users, unless of course you conscienciously wish to forgot that. I tried last night to contact you but you had no email on your site, so you have to ask yourself why. I have been sending about 50 mails to wiki administrators and The Bureaucrate, related to this subject, in order to warn them of what was going on. Cereal killer did some research and what I advance about identity theft are HIS OWN WORDS, and the theft of identity concerned his, and not mine, which make the matter of the accusations even more serious than you first imagined. So don't mistake me.

Thought it was extremely visible in the archives that YBM was violating all wikis' rules and was the one vandalising my work, you didn't even took a look at it to control it before you bannished me, nor tried to contact me. I tried to contact you but couldn't as I was bannished...as I could read it in the window that opened when I clicked on your name... And another thing, when I opened this site, the night I got bannished, there was a line on the top of this blog telling me that I had 2 messages, and when I opened it the message was that I was banished and that the administrator who had banished me was Cereal@Killer. As I was mailing him regulary about the matter, including that night, I was very surprised of it and asked him why. He didn't knew about it and made some research, and is still doing so. Your name with another administrator was only visible several hours later, so something tricky really happened there. You ask for evidences before advancing a statment, I have and have came with them. But I don't see any proof for YBM insults, and you didn't even try to warn him or to stop him before, why? I went through a lot of channel and trouble during several hours every days, before you finally made an apparition.

What is wiki policies when a user vandalise another user and take control over a site, and report at the same time the users which texts he has vandalised as being those vandalising his?

You have none, and it can very easely occur and stay unoticed for a very long time as all can see it here. All can see that the 2 first times that YBM asked for me to be banished, insulted me, and pretend that I vandalised his stof, there was absolutely no comments, and no previous texts from me to explain his sudden suggestions. His suggestions pop up like out of the blue. And you didn't found it strange? Why? A reread will be the appropriate thing for you to do at this point.

That my tone can go some notch higher, and my words begin to cross the line, cannot be so surprising to you and others, knowing that he had, at the time I wrote them, previously deleeted my non agressiv texts 12 to 20 times, and even 7 times in the curs of the same hour, and as I didn't used the revert system, I had to rewrite and reinsert them ALL one by one... would you have stay perfectly come? or... Would you have lost your temper and knock him out? I am sure that the later is everybodys choice. Too bad it can't be done on line, or there will be much lesser of his kind trying to create trouble, unpunished.

I did nothing wrong at all. I did wiki an extremely good and generous favor, and you should thanks me instead of blaming me or teaching me some not-think-through-second-hand-morale. I defended myself and my rights for freedom of expression, by lack of anybody from the wikis' power board doing anything to hinder an informatic maniac in crossing every word I printed here. I did YOUR JOB, without the means you have, without the possibilities, with very limited tools in a very restrictiv set of rules. But I achieved it. The alone time I deleeted his posts, was after 3 days and nights he had deleeted mine, and after having send 15 emails to a chief administrator of wiki about it. I cant do for your bureaucratie blocking democratie and freedom of speach, nor can I do for your internal communications problems due to wikis global extend and size. But you can, at least partially. For exemple by saying, "sorry, Sophie, that we weren't attentive enough at the time of the crime and for having not given enough attentions to your repeated alerts, and your friendly hand, and sorry that it had to go to that length before we reacted, and sorry to have been so fast to react to the call of the crook and let you down for so long, and sorry for reacting first after you had in fact founded a solution to the problem". Will it be going too long a way to ask you to do that, or do you have your selvknowledge wisdoms book handy? Its nice to see you on the scene of the crime a week after the massacre started, but don't play hero nor moralist to me, you had yourself fooled by the criminal and helped him greatly in accomplishing his felony by banishing me without having conducted a proper investigation of the scene. A look in the archive will have shown you that my texts were bleeding, not his. You cant, at the same time, do nothing to stop him, let me fight this unfair battle on my own, and at the same time reproach me for becoming angry (Heaven forbid! I've got emotions!?!) and for writing my statments in capital letters. This isn't ethically defendable.(is there a rule against that by the way? what about using capital letters to give my statements the title "Garbage"? which must be unemotionally insulting, meaning acceptable on Bishonons weather reports scale, if I follow your listed comments above) Don't forget that he begin long before that, several days before, and please do not mix the cause with its effects, and give the guilty part a more visible sight of the consequences. Those rules are elementary in any analysis and in any honnest wish to see an evolution take place. You have confess not knowing a thing about the subject discussed in this blog. Well let me give you a short introduction: In a huge number of forums about the affair on the internet, YBM has been the motor of all attacks against the Bogdanovs, that he has kept running for no apparent reasons, and has hurted and insulted all kind of people on all of those forums for very questionnable motives.

The incident here begin with my found of the reasons laying behind all his accusations up to now, his way to turn around arguments, and his his censorship of texts in order to use them as evidences, and that I made those answer available here, revealing an aspect he had managed to keep perfectly hidden during those 2 long years of diffamations and public executions, up to now. He couldn't afford this, and thats why he went through such a big trouble and took such a great risk at exposing himself for vandalism, in order to hinder this information to hit the Internet, and the same audience that he had entertain all that time with his lies. Better being banish for a day or two from wiki than loosing his face in front of all those who had actively or sincerely followed him until now. If you have had some previous knowledge of the case and of the caracter involved, you will most certainly had been more cautious with YBM activities and his so call vandalisms alert. I would like an explaination and I would like to know why it took you so long, why I wasn't contacted when I was contacting admi on wiki, why Cereal Killer was the name who appeared as being the guy who banished me when he was a sleep at that time and unaware of the situation, and why you didn't even tryed to investigate the case out of my informations before telling me to come with evidences of identity theft. From my point of view, it is at wiki and not at me to do so, and that is what they are actively doing -from my source of information-, that I will warmly encourage you to consult with. YBM is working with informatic and has done similar stof before. Which you will also be familiar with if you had followed the case before or since it started 2 years ago. You havn't, so your ignorance of those inherents details is very understable, but you could have used of your wiki contacts to undo this lack. You choose not to do so, which place the ball into your camp, and this 2nd balls name is professional error. Don't come blame me for trying to undo the evil of another, I ain't in the mood for that, and 9 days of serial provocations have made me quiet sensible and easely edgy. Handle With Care is now all over my name.

Have a nice, righteous, and ethical day.

Sophie XAL --213.237.21.6 01:24, 29 August 2005 (UTC)

Hello, Sophie. You show some misunderstanding of the nature of the site and the function of its administrators. This is a private site, not the guardian of your freedom of expression, and to edit here is not anybody's "right". You are welcome as a contributor only on condition that you respect policies. Administrators aren't paid lawyers, they're volunteers—ordinary users with a few extra buttons—and it's not practically possible for me, and not my responsibility, to research your contacts with Cereal@Killer, or any of the other things that you recommend me to do. If you have a serious problem involving Wikipedia, I strongly recommend you to e-mail User:Jimbo Wales, the site owner. I'm here on this page only to try to help the editors to discuss the article constructively, not to take part in the discussion myself. That's why I gave my intervention the heading about "talk page etiquette", and please note that I gave some tips to YBM as well as to you (even though I can't say I see him violating civility).
Normally I warn before blocking, even several times, but in cases of outrageous edits such as this, I block immediately on becoming aware of them. This is policy.
I'm sorry about your problem with e-mailing me, but I don't understand it. My wiki e-mail function has been enabled the whole time. Please note also that you can edit your own talk page even if you're blocked, and the blocking admin will be watching it for messages.
About your experience of Cereal@Killer appearing to be the blocking admin, the only explanation I can think of is that CesarB also blocked you, a couple of minutes after I did. This would have made his name, not mine, appear as the blocking admin on the message when you tried to edit. There's some similarity, so might you have mistaken his name as Cereal@Killer?
You misread me when you say I have "confessed" to not knowing a thing about the subject. What I said above was I hadn't known of the subject before. I used Google and read a number of webpages about it, including YBM's, before responding to him here, and before blocking you. I've no intention of taking sides, though. To discuss the subject and hammer out consensus about the article is for its editors to do, not me. I intervened only to uphold policy on this page, and to try to help a talk page process that seems to be foundering. Bishonen | talk 08:24, 29 August 2005 (UTC)

I have never deleeted your messages, nor your answer to my post for the good reason that I first see it only now, 14 hours after you posted it!!! I found you freak to introduce you answer with this kind of comment and with an unverified accusation as a title, which confirm your prejudices about me, and point in the direction of an active cooperation between you and YBM. All evidences show that I have never done this kind of thing, but of course, apersonne having the mentality to perform this kind of thing herself, will found it easy to se it in others, like the tief fear of being stollen. Your inclination at seeing this on me is a sign that you are used of doing it to others. If you don't like what you are doing, stop doing it or choose another website. As for your comments on admion wiki being volonteer, it dosn't mean that they have the right to compensate it by being slack or by doing as they please, and being less serious in their endeavour than if they had a pay check. You accepted the job, volonteered for it, and accepted the conditions. Now you have to follow them, not adapt them to your own needs and psychological drives. Je n'ai jamais effacé ton message ni réponse pour la bonne réponse que je ne le vois que maintenant!! et nous sommes lundi soir 23 Heure!! Sophie --213.237.21.6 21:05, 29 August 2005 (UTC)

I do not have mix cereal killer with César B that I mailed to the 26 of august, César B name appeared with yours several hours later only. You write about YBM: "even though I can't say I see him violating civility" are you blind or just taking side? He was encouraging users to register me as vandalizing the site when I didn't have and as he was deleeting systematically all my comments. The text you refer above, was the result of several days having all my texts deleeted, after having send several mails to an administrator about it and questions about how to handle it, and after 3 hours that night trying to reinsert my texts anf having them deleeted immediatly by YBM. YBM took his chance at contacting you when he saw that text, that he probably was waiting for and had planned will happened by provocating me as he did, and you just did what he wanted you to do, the compleete wrong thing. If you were following what he had done from afar, and didn't blocked me after he had contacted you, but from your own judgement, so it proves that you have friendship with YBM, or you will have warned him or blocked him immediatly and even the days before. What you are confessing here is that you knew what he was doing you knew it was forbidden and you let him do it and continue to do it day after day, and awaited together WITH him that I became angry enough to do or say something that you could use against me to block me, as you had arranged it with YBM. The text you name is not insulting but the truth, did you tried to investigate it? In fact I was warning him about it and could have not say a word and let him take even more risks and get a big surprise later on. All show that you work with and for YBM. You handled the situation all wrong and are still doing so and you even use the same methods than he does, when you for exemple begin your answer and give it the title that accusing me of having deleeted your article when I do not have and never saw it before now. I have written my answer to your first intervention early monday morning, and corrected it the following 20 minutes, and you have been writng your answer to it as I was making changes on the content of my own text and when I saved it it created a conflict, maybe because you saved yours at the same time or because you had performed a change on the side before I had finished to correct my text. You should know about this type of conflict better than I do, and that you try to use it against me by even trompetting this lie accusation in your title, proove that you are the larbin of YBM and I ask for you to be removed as administrator of this site. You didn't answer any of my questions made in my first answer to you, and all you have been writng in that one show that you do as if I didn't have told you about YBM vandalism performed on all my texts for several days before I wrote the text that you estimate as being "too much" and block me immediately against all wiki rules about procedures, and without emiting any kind of warning against HIS attacks and behaviour anti netettiqette, that you still happily ignore, and doas if YBM did not do anything wrong, and never sayed anything insulting, and as if there is no such thing as cause and effect, but effect to be used as cause when it suits your and YBM plans. Your credibility in that affair is below zero, and it is shinning bright that your are being dishonnest about it. The worse fact is that you didn't banished me out of ignorance of the facts at hand and because you ignored what YBM had done, but knowing it perfectly, which mean that you agreed with his actions by non interventions, and by intervene when I did one thing, one time, of the same type than he had done more than 7 times the hour preceeding my banishment from the site, and many more times on the preceeding days up to then.

You are openly lying, for all to can see, and I will certainly not accept those accusations and hypocrites attitude of yours, serving the sad cause of humiliating me and trying to destabilisate me by present me as non reliable and like Pursuing to deleete your post! I strongly suggest you to remove your falsh accusation contained in your title and the first part of your intervention, and to give me excuses for exposing me when you had no evidences to sustain such agravating accusations, and could easly access data to confirm or infirm them. Have a nice time with YBM.

SOPHIE XAL --213.237.21.6 21:42, 29 August 2005 (UTC)


If you click here and then scroll down, you'll see my message, and how it's deleted through your edit. Yes, it proabably did happen through an edit conflict, and I'm sorry if I seemed to be implying you did it on purpose. If you don't follow the instructions that come up with the edit conflict message, you can under certain circumstances delete the other person's post. (If you just click "save" again, on the other hand, you'll delete your own.) I understand that the edit conflict instructions can be quite confusing, and that you're not used to them. The best way to avoid edit conflicts is to not have the edit window open for that long, especially on a frequently edited page like this. I recommend writing the actual message in a text editor, then opening the edit window and pasting it in quickly—it's the method I use.
I do make allowances for your being upset, but that doesn't mean I'll tolerate being spoken to like that. (I can understand French just fine, by the way.) Please note: if you talk that insultingly to anybody on this site again I'll block you for a week. Bishonen | talk 22:02, 29 August 2005 (UTC)

I have never insulted you nor threatened you, but you just did!!! How come you only think now about conflicting edit? You could see on my text that I had just posted it and could easely see that it had been changed, so that it was about conflicting edit. I just saved my answer, came back to the site, to see is somebody had posted something, and found nothing but my own post, before changes, then assumed it must have been a change made on a former post or a server problem, clicked on edit on my own text again, deleeted my text and insert the copy of the corrected one and saved the page. I didn't see your text anywhere in the process. So it isn't my doing nor my mistaken way of using wiki. You make accusation and you think its allright, I defend myself and proove you wrong, and you found it insulting. Do you have such a big problem at saying you are sorry, or is it me having too big expectations on other people sens of ethic? By the way you still don't have argue about your blocking of me and letting go of YBM felony. Do you agree with his methods and his abuse of wiki tools? Are you a fan of his manipulations, or are you just deliberatly blind to it all? You don't tolerate being spoken to "like that", like what? like you did to me? or being pointed that it isn't allright to just blame me for all your wrong doings and denying to adjust your truth to the reality? Ditto my friend ditto, I don't like it either but the difference between you and me is that I have been injured by your errors of judgements and still are, the difference is that I expect polite reparations, and only get your angryness and further accusations and further wrong doings, and threats, and abuse of your administrator status. You already abused of it, remember? so try to digest my writtings and to reflect on them instead of rushing to the boxes, it will do a lot of good, and we will avoid those conflicting edits, and might solve the conflict all together. I ain't a copy conform of your soul and being, you've got no problem with that I hope?

You want to banish me for a week? Be my guest, make it a year!

SOPHIE XAL --213.237.21.6 22:34, 29 August 2005 (UTC)

<End of moved text block>

[edit] Resuming

Hi, Sophie, I'm really sorry I've wound you up to such an extent, and I'm sorry I seemed to accuse you of deliberately deleting my post. I'm sure you didn't, and I never meant to suggest it. (I have said this before, but I think you may have been too upset to notice.) Replies to some points you raise follow:
"What do you mean by threat? what kind of threat?" Do you mean where I say in my first message, at the very top of this page, that you've made legal threats? Threats made on Wikipedia of legal action against other users are against Wikipedia policy. When a word is blue in the text, that means it's a link, intended for you to click on for further information. Please click on the blue links in that first message of mine, and you'll see which of your posts I'm referring to as being a legal threat, what exactly Wikipedia's policy is on legal threats and why, and several other things that may be useful to you.
"What do you mean by this "editing style of yours"? Are you suggesting that I have edit anything else but my own text? Or do you mean that I musn't perform any kind of correction on my own texts?" Not at all, none of those. I'm sorry, I do see that "editing" was unclear, thanks for giving me a chance to clear this up. I used the word as in "edit a page" = "write on a page". By "your editing style" I mean the things you write, the things you say, to and about other people. In other words: I won't have you driving off the people trying to discuss Bogdanov Affair by poisoning the atmosphere of Talk:Bogdanov Affair.
"To let people discuss of what article? what are you talking about? this site purpose is not to discuss any article, are you completely unsane?" Uh... yeah, getting there. The purpose of Talk:Bogdanov Affair is to discuss Bogdanov Affair, actually. The only purpose. If you don't believe me, I suppose that accounts for the problems you've been causing on Talk:Bogdanov Affair.
"You have absolutely no rights what so ever to shortened the texts of other people. It is absolutely none of your business and it isn't part of your job as an admin". No, it's not, and I haven't shortened any texts. This must be some misunderstanding. Bishonen | talk 20:25, 30 August 2005 (UTC)

The Bogdanov affair is the whole affair and not one article!!! You just try to found reasons to shut me up and abuse your status as admi to do so but ain't not better than YBM. You are doing exactly the same as him. Why do you remove my answer TO YOUR ARTICLE from the main frame and let the answer made by YBM and others for exemple? This is clearly discrimination. My answer is all too relevant to the affair discussed as are all my article as the last ones have to do with the crdibility of the people who have been the upmost against the Bogdanovs and have critisize their theory the most. I do not think that a DEA in informatic make a person capable to critisize the work of professionals in theorethic Physic. To do so you will have to be Stephen W Hawking and the alike. I have pointed how discusting the methods of YBM were and was able to come with tangibles prooves of it. Thats why he hurried to deleet them. But you came, afet 6 days he had done that and 6 days I tried to put it back, and...banished me!!! then after 9 days in all, you wrote your first intervention in this site and gave a warning to YBM, but.. you failled to punish him as well, and you commited the grave mistake to accuse me of having perpetrated the same kind of crime as he did, and by doing so, bagatelize the incident as being a commun little fight between 2 stupid users deleting each others column. But it isn't at all what happened. My answer to your intervention, more than being an internal dispute, had as goal to put things back where they belong, and regarded all users. They have to know that this YBM did deleeted my texts for a whole week, without any admin interventions, that you did bannished me but not him, and that you did bannished me again but not him, for personal reasons, and at the same time hinder the users to see the facts by removing them from where they belong and place them outside. You don not have answered any of my questions, and for you to know Cereal Killer is the admi of the french site about the bogdanov affair and is therefor very relevant to this case. As for your accusation of my pseudo crimes of having written in french, I wrote in french on heat after having read your answer, and translated it dtraight away in english, and the french version was no more than 10 to 15 minutes on line in the middle of the night, so do stop try to agress with lies, be more honnest with yourself, at least and say it as it is: you prefer the opinion of YBM, do not like the Bogdanov, thought you do not understand a thing about astrophysic, and you feel nothing but hatress and repulsion about me and what I stand for. i do not think that an aristrocats fan is welcome in a place like wiki who require essentially people having a great sens of honnor, democratie, equality, common sens, and who value ethic. That rules you out, as action speak louder than any words could ever do.

I do not salute you. Sophie--213.237.21.6 12:43, 31 August 2005 (UTC)

I didn't utter any threat to anybody and I have looked at this link of yours, stop making a fool of yourself by ignoring the facts. You pretend as if it was a threat but it wasn't. It cover what is actually going on, and I am in my rightd to inform a person of what his actions have result in. You do not have the right to supress this warning unless you contact me and/or give an explaination for your reason to suppress it. You failed to do any iof it. I idn't receive any messages from you not even after you had banish me, yhought your message above is dated of the 26 of august it wasn't there at that date and I am sure of it. I didn't have acces to anything that day. About the things I edit, they are of the most relevant kind to what is sayed ont this site. All pseudo subbjects are all lies as the Bogdanovs have alredy answered all those points in different places of the web, inclusiv wiki, at different times, for the past 2 years. For 13 days ago there was absolutely nothing more to discuss about, and seeing that, YBM used his ususal tactic who is to do as if they din't have answered the questions at hand, and that way, confuse the other users and make them believe that it was the case, as he has always done since 2003. Someone has to stand up and say it, someone has to put an end to this circus, and I choose to do so. I do not have followed the story from the beginning and do not know the Bogdanov but through this affair, that I begin to interest myself with since the beginning og august. Two things became clear for me as I scanned all the web on the subjects: YBM was the person doing all the staging, and YBM didn't knew what he was talking about. I also found out that no matter how many times and in how many languages and by how many specialists the answers were given to him, he will keep asking and accusing peoples, and agress them personnally and accuse them of not being edicated in that field or critisized their university or making threat at contacting their chiefs, and even insult them to push them away from the discussion platform, as this kind of people represented a real threat to his status. And of course, especially when we are talking of the scientific platform like in fr. physic or scent physic, those people, phd or professor at university were not used at being roll around with nor being talking to that way and even less at being insulted and confronted with non argumentativ methods. So they left and never show up again, leeving all free room that YBM could ever wish for to pursue his goal. But what was this goal exactly? It wasn't the truth as he kept lying and had been given all answers, and was often denying to have done certain things who were appearing very often. He was repeating himself and soon I saw a pattern emerging, from all his apparitions on the web, with falsh accusations, lies, home made stories, fantasyfull evidences, links to web sites from his own making, agression, personal attacs, insults. His goal was not at all to discuss science but to manipulate others and he managed to do so very well as he was allowed to fool so many for such a long time. T>wo years is a very long time for a little subject as this one. Then I was contacted by people who had been confronted to him, prior to this case, and had been subject to the same attacks and methods on the web. I stude it, and saw worse than I could ever imagined. It was all planed from the beginning and a part of an ideologie with filosofical pretenses on how one could manipulate other people meaning by creating a situation on line. It is what they call Post situationism, and wich is issued of Voyer. In the previous case against a teacher that he knew from school and a women writer (on cooking books!) he had just met Voyer but been found of him for a longer time, by the beginning of Bogdanovs affair he had been introduce inside the rangs of Voyer and Co, and as the affair progressed assured himself a high status in this "confrerie". That is the reason why this article I come with is of such importance. It reveal what was behind all along, what motivated the principal actors of this mascarade, and show all that they have been manipulated from the beginning and still are. There is no Bogdanov affair, it is an illusion, a part from a group of ideologs making a thinking experiment and giving life to it by means of the internet. Brillant! Unless there was casualties. And there is. Plenty of, and more than the Bogdanovs private sphere and their career. I was really aroused from the beginning when I realised what YBM was about but even more when I saw what it all was really about, I was shocked by how unpropper and unethical it all was, and what a big unjustice it was to all who were involved in it, and this also include people who have followed and defended the apparent vews of YBM not knowing what this was really about. That's why I am so very angry to see that you support him in his doing. I might have been so much deep in my research and come to know so much that I took a big part as evident and by doing so, made my editing half understandable to a novice. but nonetheless they are all relevant, and it might take some tiome for people to understand the depth of it, but it isn't by mean of suppression of the essential information that it will be possible for people to know the truth of this sordid affair. We can as well change the title of this wiki site and call it The YBM-Voyer affair about the Bogdanovs' Affair and what they made of it. Or how many they manadged to fool. Until now, YBM has used his knowledge in informatic to fool people and to create falsh identity for himself, and that include several IP adresses. So you could on one subject like this one have him several time under several names and not be able to distinguish who is whom.

I have my reasons for being angry, and if you knew what YBM has done also on the french wiki about the subject you will not be so quick at banishing me for the reasons you exposed. He has done far worse, and excell in cisors clip of sentences, taken out of context, and replaced in another one, for his good purposes. I don't see what more could be sayed on the subject, and if my article had not been removed and then been drunken in petitesse, and then get bagatalized, so I was hopping at hearing the other readers opinions and view of it and to hear what they made out of it. It is sad to see that it wasn't possible to see the truth getting it right place in wiki. The subject is talking the Bogdanovs affair, and that is what I do, I talk the Bogdanovs affair, analyse it and dismantled it. As for this YBM comments on staying on subject meaning talking science, this is not the only point here, and all questions of scientific relevans have already been answered before, also on this site, more is, that as can beseen on the YBM sites he is not at all talking og´of physic but making laugh at Bogdanovs physicall appearences, their look, their voices, their age, the age of their mentor and master of thesis, and the fact that those are dead, all in all very charming talks...

When he don't do that, he talk about the users he don't like and critisize them the like thought ´he do not have meet them, and use 99% of his time at insulting others.

You say you could speak french, so you can eassly verifiy what I say. Those talking science are newbies, like Linda or Alain who also made an apparition at WIKI french, and give lesson in physic to other users, since about 2 weeks. When those users are not too busy at chanting insults in chor with YBM. He had bannished me from his site for being not scientifical enough as I begin to say "disturbing things", and followed after me here on wiki where he tried also to hinder me to uncover the truth about him. In fact he followed me anywhere i went on the web, the forum des forums, my own subject, everywhere I was he went, in desperate attempts to stop me. And thats how people who knew him from before and knew what he was about found to me and contacted me, and send me prooves evidences of what he had done and what it was all about. So you've also got an explaination for why i got angry, why I got SO angry, why I became it so fast, because it happened simultanously with other things in the backyard that he was also doing to hinder me to reveal this information all over the web: french, and english.

He has insulted me every day on his own websites, treated me like a dog, and called me all kind of things, so I wasn't going to talk to him like the Earl of Windsor knowing that, and being joked with night after nights and morning after morning with his deleetions and revert tricks.

You knew that, so you have taken side and acted unjustly and done discrimination. Now I suppose that you know better, so the question is: What are you going to do about that? and about this all fraude?

SOPHIE XAL --213.237.21.6 14:10, 31 August 2005 (UTC)


A propos out of subject, what do you think this EE guy or EE anonymous is talking about with YBM and Catherine? The contain of his Biographie, who is on another wiki site! and has nothing to do wiht this one! So what do you do with that one? He suddendly came up with the contain of it, big edit...!!!, several times, and each time somebody added or supress something, they had to come with the whole text again and again. I believe this biographie has now been edited 5 to 6 times on the same site. So maybe you should have look after that instead. he interven first in a discussion about the scientific meaning of part of the Bogdanovs A. le big Bang, between the Bogdanovs and YBM, and like insisted about a point. Was answered and since have perverted the debate of this web site into his own website concerning the biographie of the Bogdanov, who in fact is somewhere else, so you know it:Bogdanov Affair and talk Bogdanov affair are 2 distinct thing, and the one is not about discussing the other, as you might have understood it... Maybe we have here the root of the problem: a misunderstandig of proportions!

sophieXAL --213.237.21.6 18:32, 31 August 2005 (UTC)


Ihave see your communications with YBm previously to this time, and can see that you simply obeyred him without making any controls. Even after I had warned you you just listened to him, even if all he sayed wasn't true and you could see it. I have edited my own texts and titles. For exemple, you removed fast my own scripts but not the title "garbage" that YBm had given to my articles, even knowing it was his work, and that this name also got included to the title of another user as reference to it... I had to make the changes myself, and get banished again for it??!! What exactly are your reason, give me just one. Did you pretended as if you realy thought i had deleeted your text just to answer the call of YBM? It very much look like this when I see your correspondance with him from that very date, and your quick answer giving him right immediatly. You have no excuse for being manipulated or mistaking the second time. You are a fraud. As for my signature it is the one everybody get by pressing on the signature logo, and which is invisible until the text is saved... so if I had to choose I will never do it, as I am not interested to reveal my IP adress, that some perverted soul can always abuse of. I would rather just write my name, but often do both to satisfy the paranoids and avoid their crisis. It occur that one of them also used it against me, him who do hide the most. And who happen to know very well this IP adress as I was member of one of the site he administrate, and for having checked it very often and very deeply....... It is also difficult to change it afterwards as I will be accused of editing my own text.. and get banished again. Wrll you did it anyway, because I was saving my text as you were saving yours...and didn't like it. Or just pretend to do so to give YBM who had called you again that day, a reason to get me out again. I would like you to read other script from that guy, previous ones, and see for yourself how much he has suddendly changed of attitude since... I found it very strange. he is like reborn. As for your talks about my texts being email like communications, how else did you expect me to react at the situation at hand? Shut up and do as if nothing wrong had happened? Ignore your accusations? and I do not like the mix on your site of people who give their opinion about something they do not know a thing about.

I will recommend you to contact cereal killer to get the evidences of my innocences in this case in the form of all the mails I sendt him day after day during the week prior to my first banishment and the second, where I described the things who happened, very often at the date and time as they were happening on wiki, and asked for help about it. When you pretend so much that I have vandalised the site I have the right to proove you wrong and you have the duty to search for evidences, and look both sides of the fence.

If I really wanted to vandalize the site I could have doen it from an internet café, and get free from any accusations. But all my interventions are clearly signed, ask yourself why.

For your knowledge I am not american but danish.

And about the first amendement and the freedom of speach, where would you be without it? Certainly not administrator on wiki. What Wiki?...

Sophie XAL --213.237.21.6 02:44, 1 September 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Replying

Hello, Sophie. You seem to think I've sometimes removed texts of yours from Talk:Bogdanov Affair, and sometimes shortened them. You're mistaken, I've never done either,, except for moving an irrelevant exchange between you and me (my own posts too) to this page of yours. Bishonen | talk 17:53, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

Excuse me, but is THIS your answer to all I told you and asked you above and in my mail?

Yes. I haven't received any e-mail from you. Bishonen | talk 01:46, 4 September 2005 (UTC)

Included the prooved that your reasons to banish me are caduque and in no ways conforms to the rules of wiki as it can be seen in the site about vandalism and banishment. Are you trying to fool somebody? Whom could it be?... Not you I presume. If you feel like confessing something do it on the main page.

SOPHIE XAL --213.237.21.6 01:28, 4 September 2005 (UTC)

Yes you have, try check it out before affirming.(like the rest by the way). And.. what about the rest?..aaalll the rest? Good you ain't a lawyer, you'll loose all your cases, grounded lack of evidences. sophie XAL --213.237.21.6 01:01, 5 September 2005 (UTC)

Well, the rest is your business. Since you reply with abuse no matter what I say, I prefer to only tell you what you really need to know. Here it comes: Your block will expire in about 24 hours. Please note that if you return to Talk:Bogdanov Affair and go on the way you did before, I will block you permanently. Please put only messages that are relevant (= concerned with improving Bogdanov Affair) and civil (=no personal attacks) on that page. You've had all the second chances you're going to get. Bishonen | talk 01:47, 5 September 2005 (UTC)


[edit] MY REPLY

What do you mean by "go on the way you did before, " what way??? don't you have looked at the archives yet? what are you so doing? you recognize that you did banished me only on the assumption that what YBM told you was true. Thats what I call for a confession. What do you mean by relevant? the kind you inserted about your mening being roght and YBM mening being right and anything else being irrelevant. I see. So you are an admi and you are really following the rules. But you know, this is wiki, and you have to follow wiki rules, not your own or the opinions you prefer. Its' forbidden. Personal attacks? what are you doing here but attacking me and avoiding answering my questions as you did before banishing me and because you were ashame of saying the truth. Or do you mean the kind of personal attacks involving deleeting and reverting all the site 10 to 20 times each and every night as YBM did to me for 10 days, which is forbidden by wikis law with clear procedures against it, that you didn't saw, 'cause you weren't there, (comme c'est bizarre!) that I tried to repair without using this revert science not even once, and that you banished me for, when you suddendly appeared for the first time since march 2005. Where you in vacation or training camp? You also say that !I have all the chances I was goinf to get2 and what are they? Am I missing something here? What chances? you didn't warned me nor explain me the reasons for my banishments the both times, and you still didn't explain why on earth YBM who you partially recognized did all those reverting, Not deleeting but REVERTING of the whole site, has not been inflicted any punishment at all? He took you by the noze and made you dance on his make believes, and you are still dancing my poor dear. It might be time for you to prepare your landing, not on my head as you have done until now, a bit akward but people do come in different shape and mindes, but on your feet. You will have to verificate your procedure and archives first. Sorry, you can't keep pushing it in the future, the work has to be done, and no more jelly jumping, I'll like to see some real progress here . Thanks, I am sure that your awakening will be as morose as my jail time, so don't say thanks yet.

You have been attacking me since the beginning and still don't have come with any ground nor evidences for the 2 times when you banished me from the site. Do not forget that you didn't banished YBm for using and abusing of the revert functions more than 10 times a night every single night, nor for insulted me and other people. I saw on the site that you keep warning some users but not him for doing the same. I never deleeted you text and you knew this never the less you used it as a title, just as YBM called my articles for garbage, and you banished me for reinserting the original title. I do not accept your stanilistics polizei methods nor your supra censorships tendencies. When I needed you, you where no where to be found, but responded promptly to the person who was performing crime and sabotaged the site and my articles. You did sustain his preferences and his claims that my writings were irrelevant concerning the famous article who started it all. And YES I am Angry! Angry of seeing you bathing in your selfrighteousness and crucifying any one with a different opinion than your own. Angry at seeing your pretentiousness at being oh so correct and fine when in fact you are the one throwing at my face and pissing on me. No need for specifics words to do so, as Jean Paul Sartres sayed, words are many thing, essentially what you made of them. You made me angry with them. And I rather have a straight fight than a pissing around with tronked words. Your talk is beginning to look like the USSR vocabulary, you know, a table is a chair, and my hand is a fruit you can eat, and my brain a cup from wich you can drink or speet in, and solidarity is collectiv suicide. What do you call it in english? Verb transfiguration, or playing the three monkey. I have no intention at writing anything on the site, Je suis en gréve. As long as it will remain undemocratical, I will strike, like the OPROR, like the no more! I don't see anything insulting in my texts but yours are, and in that grade! You have no juridic rights on wiki to banished me from the site, you are doing as YBM does, and openly supporting him. You are just pretending that I did something and make as much people as possible believe that I did so, and try to have me defend myself for something I didn't do. For your petty knowledge, YBM say he is a bolchevic, and I hate Bolchevic, you see I am nearer to the truth, I am a Menchevic, and I do remember. I think that you should absolutely supress all your interventions on the site as they are unecessarry, totally out of subject and quiet disturbing for anyone trying to follow through. You didn't managed to open and kill the problem, you managed to hunt away all users, and wash the site white, with only your mening and his remaining. And I promise you, from this distance you can't see the difference from his white and yours. Of course some shade of grey will be welcome, but you see, to reach that edge, I will have to poor some black in it, yes the color you hate, the one who can be seen, the one who will make a difference. You are no more but a marrionette in the hands of YBM, and of yourself, don't forget that you also choose, 'cause we wont forget either. Some people believe that you are just naïve, I think you are too much cooperative to be called naïve. You know very well that what you do is wrong, and I don't give a shit about your menaces and pretenses at denying to give me any answers because this and that. Were you maybe giving me any before you banished me? for having called me names, for accusing me of things you knew I couldn't possibly have done? You didn't answer anything at all because you do lack the answers, and banishing me was such an easy way to run away from responsabilities for free. But they keep running behind you too, thats the way with responsabilities. So watch your back, and don't try to run away from them in all eternity by banishing me for ever. You see my child, you just sayed two things who are impossible. You can't run for ever, and nobody has ever been able to avoid meeting me when I was meeting them. For ever, 'sounds bigger than the universe, did you thought about that? Hmm, thinking through, I have never been able to avoid clashing with truth either, I usually make a big splash whereever it is asked for, all get transformed, and I am never forgotten. Not that I choose so, it just happen, like the Big Bang. An irresistible force attraked me, the more you think you push, the more in fact you call. I am like Magma, you might know where it start, but you can't predict where it will stop, nor control it. You should have thought about it before. You ain't going to stop the fire by heating up the vulcano. And again, the first amendement vous dit merde!

Sophie extra XAL extra Menchevic and Cooler than Cold Fusion! --213.237.21.6 01:55, 7 September 2005 (UTC) Med venlig hilsen, from the Foundation Board

[edit] Your recent post on the Mediation Cabal page

Hello there,

I'm Nicholas Turnbull, the cabalist-in-chief at Wikipedia:Mediation Cabal, and I'm here to help you. I recently saw your very long and detailed post that you made on the mediation cabal page, and although I must admit I was unable to understand the explanation you gave there I am concerned there is a problem. If you have a dispute that you wish us to help you with, please read the instructions on the Wikipedia:Mediation Cabal page, and submit a request using the method described there (summarising the complaint to be as concise, but informative, as possible). I just wanted to let you know that we are at your service if we can help you in any way, and if you do require assistance please don't hesitate to ask. :-)

Best regards, NicholasTurnbull 05:05, 8 September 2005 (UTC) Cabalist-in-Chief, WP:TINMC