Template talk:Zimbabwean elections

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[edit] Layout

Although I understand why the box was enlarged to separate colonial- and independence-era elections, it does make the box overly large and complicated.

No it doesn't. Fys. “Ta fys aym”. 19:10, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Plus I would argue that the logic is not consistent. If you want to separate Rhodesian and Zimbabwean elections based on the fact there "was no such country as Zimbabwe before 1980", then surely you would also have to create seperate boxes for Southern Rhodesia, Southern Rhodesia as part of the Federation of Rhodesia and Nyasaland, Rhodesia, Zimbabwe Rhodesia and Zimbabwe. This would end up ridiculously large, and was the reason the flags were included in the template as a shorter way of showing the country's status at the time of the elections.

That's bollocks on so many levels. Firstly, Southern Rhodesia retained responsibility for elections throughout Federation and its dominion government remained exactly as before (only with a few less responsibilities). So there's a clear continuity there. The Debates of the Legislative Assembly of Southern Rhodesia/Rhodesia/Zimbabwe Rhodesia are all consecutively numbered up from 1 to vol. 101 in 1979, while those of the Parliament of Zimbabwe start again at volume 1, showing a clear discontinuity: in other words, Southern Rhodesia/Rhodesia/Zimbabwe Rhodesia is one continuous run, but Zimbabwe is not. Finally, when I created the template I included flags, so it's for me to say what the reason for them was. Fys. “Ta fys aym”. 19:10, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

I included all the elections under the name Zimbabwe, as although the name has changed, the country is the same territorial terms. I don't think it would be appropriate to split templates based on name changes (would Sri Lankan/Ceylon elections have to be separated?) or colonial status. Perhaps a more subtle marker (asterixes or the flags) is better.

I don't give a toss about Sri Lanka. It's Rhodesia and Zimbabwe under discussion. Frankly I'd take you more seriously if you could answer these three questions correctly:

1) In the provisional determination of boundaries by the Delimitation Commission of 1969, how many Coloured voters were there in Willowvale constituency?

2) Who was Registrar-General of Elections at the 1985 election?

3) What was the date of birth of James Done, Independent candidate for Salisbury Central in 1954, and how many votes did he get? Fys. “Ta fys aym”. 19:10, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Anyway, please respond before reverting and perhaps another compromise solution can be found. Number 57 10:57, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

PS. Although referendums has somehow found its way into common usage as the plural of referendum, the correct term is indeed referenda (as it is a latin word, it has a latin plural as is the situation with words like cactus (cacti) and datum (data)).

That's bollocks as well. See Referendum. Fys. “Ta fys aym”. 19:10, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Ridiculous changes

I will revert anyone who suggests that there was a Zimbabwean election in 1899. Ridiculous, absolutely stupid. Anyone who says it is manifestly bonkers. Fys. “Ta fys aym”. 19:03, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Compromise

This template already has a compromise to show former incarnations of the country (the flags), which is not needed on any other. Why can't you accept this? Number 57 19:15, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

The flags are those of Rhodesia and not Zimbabwe. Getting the two confused is plainly stupid. Ian Smith was not Prime Minister of Zimbabwe and Robert Mugabe is not President of Rhodesia. You try telling either of them that and you'd get a pretty curt response, I can tell you. Fys. “Ta fys aym”. 19:18, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

PS - you obviously couldn't answer the questions. The reason why Rhodesia/Zimbabwe has the best coverage on Wikipedia about its electoral history is that I have written it, not you. So go away until you contribute constructively. Fys. “Ta fys aym”. 19:20, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

Going by your history on Wikipedia, you obviously have a problem interacting with other people constructively.

As if that makes your case. Pathetic. I'm completely unmoved. Fys. “Ta fys aym”. 19:29, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

Just because you have written or created an article does not give you the right to prevent anyone changing the format of it.

It does show your destructive tendencies and ignorance about the subject in sharp relief though, which is why I mention it. Fys. “Ta fys aym”. 19:29, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

Certainly bragging about how many articles you have written on politics in Zimbabwe does not. If you have descended to this level, I can point out that I have created around 120 election templates and standardised several more.

OK, I write about elections, you write templates. Well done. Next you'll be arguing that you ought to be PM because you've washed the windows at 10 Downing Street. Fys. “Ta fys aym”. 19:29, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

Anyway, the new edit is not an improvement.

Well bollocks to you then. Fys. “Ta fys aym”. 19:29, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps a mediator can help solve this issue. Number 57 19:24, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

If it takes a mediator to tell you you're in the wrong, then take it there, I don't see why I should participate. Rhodesia is still not the same as Zimbabwe and nothing you can do will make it so. Fys. “Ta fys aym”. 19:29, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

Are you suggesting I know nothing about the politics and history of Zimbabwe or Rhodesia? I am not the ignoramus you seem to think I am. I don't understand what your problem associating Rhodesia and Zimbabwe is. They are patently the same entity, albeit under a different name and political system. I also suggest you stop the abusive language before you are banned again. Number 57 19:41, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

You couldn't answer my questions above. Rhodesia and Zimbabwe are patently not the same entity. They may have the same boundaries, but that is not the same thing – you even acknowledge "different political system". Different political systems shouldn't be equated, should they? And if your entire argument is summed up by "Yah boo sucks you've been banned" then perhaps you should reflect on how weak it is. You haven't presented a single good reason, nor made a single positive contribution in this area. Go away and leave the work of productive contributors alone. Fys. “Ta fys aym”. 19:53, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

So the Republic of South Africa did not exist before 1994? No Poland before 1990? The argument of a country's existence being based on its political system is very poor. How many Nigerias have there been if this is the rationale? As for not answering your questions above, no I couldn't but in the grand scheme of things, they are minute details. You probably know only because you have access to a text with the answers. Just because my knowledge is not that in depth does not mean that I am not able to contribute. Indeed, if only a person with perfect knowledge of a subject was allowed to be involved in it, we wouldn't have got much further than throwing spears and grunting. The Zimbabwean elections articles are not yours alone, and if you insist on believing so, then it will not end in your favour. Number 57 20:00, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

Your 'standardization' of templates has not the blessing of any degree of consensus. It's simply your preference which you're trying to claim as policy. I said absolutely nothing about South Africa (which merely changed the franchise in 1994) nor Poland (which ceased to be Communist in 1989, not 1990). Would you put the Palestinian Legislative Council in the same template as the Israeli Knesset, pray tell? I will listen to people like Bob Scarlett on this but not to you. Fys. “Ta fys aym”. 20:25, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

I think the argument of legal continuity and succession of states is still valid in this context. We have the elections for the different German states in a single template. We have the elections for Myanmar in the same template, which fundamentally changed its political system and its name. I do not claim that your way of seeing it is wrong, but I'd prefer to arrive at some common point which we then could employ in all templates of countries with similarily complicated historical issues. —Nightstallion (?) 10:33, 3 February 2007 (UTC)