Talk:Yannis Makriyannis

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Contents 1 Good Article Review 2 Failed GA 3 GA 4 Spelling

[edit] Good Article Review

This article is under review for Good Article status. Unfortunatly, it does not yet meet the criteria. However, it is not a million miles away, so I have put it on a 7 day hold rather than failed it outright. If after 7 days the following changes have not been made, it may fail.

Anyone interested in getting this article to GA status should check out the good article criteria and try to ensure that this conforms.

Well written: The article is at times clunky and badly written. "Ioannis Triantafyllou, as was his proper name, better known as Ioannis Makrygiannis..." - this is not English syntax, the order of this sentence in Early Life needs to be changed around. "he probably joined the Filiki Etaireia in 1820. - explain jargon briefly rather than just wikilinking to it. All that is needed is something like "he probably joined Filiki Etaireia, the anti-Ottoman secret society, in 1820". "informing local members of the Filiki Etaireia of the state of Roumeli." - informing them of what?

Factually accurate and verifiable: More references are needed, even if you end up with Memoirs referenced 100 times - that's better than making unsupported assertions.

Broad in its coverage: Passed

Has Neutral Point of View: In the head section: "This work [Memoirs] is an invaluable source of historical, linguistic and cultural knowledge about the period" This is not neutral. Don't call it invaluable. In fact, just delete that passage and go straight to the Nobel laureate calling it great.

Stable: Passed

Pictures: Passed

So, sort those things out. Those examples are not the only ones, they are just examples. You need to go through this article paying particular attention to how well it is written, verifiablity and NPOV. It shouldn't take more than 7 days. Thanks for all your good work so far, and keep it up! Chrisfow 23:13, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Failed GA

None of the changes suggested by review have been made, and the seven day hold has run out. Chrisfow 20:25, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] GA

Well written: Passable.

Factually accurate and verifiable: Passed

Broad in its coverage: Passed

Has Neutral Point of View: Passed

Stable: Passed

Pictures: Passed

A good article, has some spelling mistakes and I think it needs to have a wider range of sources but it is good enough to pass. Kyriakos 03:57, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

I ran it through a spellchecker, there was one mistake in total, which has been promptly fixed. The rest is British usage, which I've tried to use consistently. I agree on the wider range of sources, but I'm thoroughly unable to provide them. Druworos 11:25, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Spelling

The article is currently under the name "Ioannis Makrygiannis". It seemed to me that Makriyannis was the more common spelling in English, so I checked using Google. In order to restrict the search to General Makriyannis (excluding other people of that name), I used the search ["General X" OR (memoirs X)]. This gives I think a fair and representative sample (with a few false positives).

	Google	Google Books	Google Scholar
Makriyannis	172 (50%)	51 (68%)	28 (64%)
Makriyiannis	61 (18%)	16 (21%)	6 (14%)
Makrygiannis	89 (26%)	3 (4%)	2 (5%)
Makrygiannes	20 (6%)	5 (7%)	8 (18%)

(table updated with Makriyiannis --Macrakis 20:45, 4 April 2007 (UTC))

As you can see, the spelling Makriyannis is almost twice as common as Makrygiannis on the Web at large, and about fifteen times more common on Books and Scholar, which are more reliable. I did a similar check for Yannis/Ioannis/Giannis/John, and there the data are sparser, but the Web prefers Ioannis by a bit, while books and scholar prefer Yannis by quite a lot. Given that Yannis is also more consistent, it seems that the correct title should be Yannis Makriyannis. If I hear no objections, I will move it there. --Macrakis 22:22, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

I had given this issue a lot of thought when first creating the article. I had opted for the current spelling since it is a more appropriate transliteration of the Greek name. I do agree, however, that what you propose is more commonly used. I also agree that if we are to move it to Makriyannis, Yannis should also be used, for consistency. I would not, in general, object to the move you propose. I would just like to request that if you do go ahead with it, make sure you fix all the redirects as well, since I have put in quite a few to cover the possible alternate spellings one might have used (pretty much every alternate spelling that came to mind ;) ) Also, you may want to go through the article and change the name to Makriyannis wherever it appears, again, for consistency. Note, however, that if you do do that, I think there should be a reference to the fact that while Makriyannis is used as the more common form, Makrygiannis is a more proper transliteration. Druworos 13:27, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your considered response. Certainly Makrygiannis (or Makrygiannēs or even Makryghiannis) is a more accurate transliteration, but WP policy uses the most common English form; we have Crete, not Kriti or Krētē. And we include the actual Greek spelling in the heading, so transliteration is redundant (though of course it should stay in the heading since it is in actual English-language use, unlike say Stauros Niarkhos).

I will of course clean up any double-redirects and the spelling within the article if we go through with the move. --Macrakis 16:17, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

So long as it stays in the heading, I'm fine with the move. Druworos 12:45, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

I just surveyed another spelling, Makriyiannis (just added to the table above), which is more common than some of the others, but still several times less common than Makriyannis, so I went ahead with the move. Am now cleaning up. --Macrakis 20:45, 4 April 2007 (UTC)