Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Lutheranism

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WikipediaWikiProject Lutheranism is part of WikiProject Lutheranism, an effort to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to Lutheranism on Wikipedia. This includes but is not limited to Lutheran churches, Lutheran theology and worship, and biographies of notable Lutherans. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.

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Contents 1 Welcome 2 Looks Good! 3 Do we want to flag articles with Lutheran sections? 4 Response 5 New Shortcuts 6 Separate Project? 7 Category Work 8 Assessment Issues 9 Saint of the day 10 Update 11 Awards

[edit] Welcome

The WikiProject Lutheranism is up and running. I went ahead and laid out the bare bones for a Project page, as well as some templates. I know it isn't all of the highest quality -- but it is to the best of my ability. If you see something on the Project pages that need tweaking, please jump right in. Our first tasks are (a) to add the Project banner to all relevant areticles, and (b) invite other interested editors to join up. Thanks, and I'm looking forward to some good work by this project. -- Pastordavid 20:36, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Looks Good!

Looks good, David! I'm going to spend most of the time trying to flag articles for us, just to get off to a good start. --CTSWyneken^(talk) 10:43, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Do we want to flag articles with Lutheran sections?

There are a number of articles such as: Infant baptism, Law and Gospel, etc. that have Lutheran sections. Do we want to mark them? --CTSWyneken^(talk) 10:43, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

I would say that that is a sort of case by case question. Law & Gospel, I would say definitely. Infant Bapt ... maybe, what do others think? Some of these articles are only tangentially Lutheran - others are pretty obvious. I went ahead and tagged "Law & Gospel", but I passed over a couple of other concepts in the Category:Lutheranism that I thought weren't quite as specifically Lutheran (e.g., Atonement, Total Depravity). We can always ask here if not sure. -- Pastordavid 15:29, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

Here's another question I think is of importance: do we want to flag biographies where the individual concerned is Lutheran but their significance is unrelated to the Lutheran Church. In particular, one of our GA articles is Karl Popper and, while he was certainly given a Lutheran education, he became an atheist as an adult. Is it acceptable to include him or should we remove him from the scope of the project since he is clearly not Lutheran, per se, nor is knowing his importance especially enhancing to understanding what Lutheranism is? The same question would go for Wernher von Braun, William Renquest, and a host of others. jackturner3 20:00, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

My thoughts (for what they are worth): If the person is a Lutheran, then yes - add them to Category:Lutherans and add the banner and rating. Thus, I know that Bill Renquest was a lifelong Lutheran, and a member of Redeemer (ELCA) Lutheran in Falls Church (Even taught adult Sunday School) - he belongs in that category, and with a banner (I would say mid importance - a committed Lutheran as Supreme Court justice has some importance). Karl Popper - if he became an atheist, probably not (I will go check the article), in which case he should be removed from the category as well. -- Pastordavid 20:05, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

UPDATE: removed banner, not a Lutheran ... no influence on Lutheranism. -- Pastordavid 20:12, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

As to the others ... John Calvin - not a Lutheran, but influenced Lutheran theology & history (especially as a defined in opposition). Von Braun, Euler, & Keppler were all Lutheran, and their articles clearly state so. Hilbert may have been, but the article doesn't say anything one way or the other - I haven't removed him from our list or the category yet, maybe we can get some clarification. -- Pastordavid 20:20, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Response

Wow. 9 participants in under 24 hours -- I think it is safe to say that there is a need for this wikiproject. I just checked, an we have already tagged just under 300 articles (and there are plenty left that need banners). Once we get a significant number of those done, the next step will be assessing, and of course - article improvement. If folks would be interested in doing a regular collaboration, I would be happy to organize it -- Perhaps as a kick-off we could get Lutheranism up to GA. -- Pastordavid 17:00, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] New Shortcuts

You can now get to the WikiProject Lutheranism more quickly, by typing WP:LUTHER or WP:Lutheranism into the wikipedia search field and pressing enter or go. It's always nice to get where you're going more quickly. -- Pastordavid 21:07, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Separate Project?

Sorry for the question, but there have been several complaints from some editors regarding the recent proliferation of project banners on some talk pages. Would the members of this project like to see it remain an entirely separate entity, with its own banner, or perhaps try to integrate it into the Christianity WikiProject banner, like the various task forces of Military history and other projects have done? Using that method, the articles can still be assessed for each task force, but the banner is rather smaller. Anyway, just an idea. John Carter 13:36, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Personally, I think this would function better as a seperate WikiProject. 12 primary categories, plus associated sub-categories, seems to me to be a sizable enough workload for a project - and we seem to have garner enough interested editors. As to the proliferation of banners, many of the articles (maybe as much as 1/2, I didn't keep track) that I have tagged so far had no banners at all before I added ours. Many others only had one. I don't think that we are duplicating much work that has been done by others. But that is my opinion on the matter, I am certainly open to what others think. -- Pastordavid 20:17, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

I also think it's important as there are issues which are specficially Lutheran vs. Protestant vs. Catholic. To roll each of these up into one project would not help clarify the issue with people who are coming to wiki to gather information. I do agree that merging the projects would make the management and editing of each document easier; but reductionism by itself isn't a good reason to do anything. TedTschopp 21:38, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Some articles, like Martin Luther, have a nesting feature that puts all the project banners into one. If someone is interested, they click and all of them display. --CTSWyneken^(talk) 02:12, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

The only real substantial change in making it a task force would be the consolidation of the banner, and in the name of the article page. The group would probably even keep its own assessment criteria. At least, that's the way it works with some subprojects. Also, I think that Christianity might even welcome having a bit more activity, as many/most of its articles, covering Christianity in general, hadn't evidently been tagged yet. John Carter 20:49, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

John, I don't know that we fit into the current definition of a task force: "The major distinction between a task force and a fully independent child WikiProject—and, indeed, the reason why the task force model was developed—is that the task force minimizes the bureaucratic overhead of its activities by relying on the parent project to provide as much of the procedural and technical infrastructure as possible. " We do not use the resources/infrastructure of the parent project. As to the proposal in question, see my comments on the proposal talk page -- personally I think it is a flawed proposal.

[edit] Category Work

Going through and adding banners, I have noticed that Category:Lutheranism and its sub-categories need some work. Many articles are duplicated in both a parent- and a sub-category, and some of the category division seem to need a little touching up. I have added this task to our "to-do" under helping out on the main page. -- Pastordavid 20:54, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

I'll go ahead and make that my next project. I've been a member of WP:CATP for a while, without any real dedication to it. This can reaffirm my dedication to both Wikiprojects. Fishal 03:19, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

Sounds great. I've done some re-arranging, but haven't had the time to do some real work on it. -- Pastordavid 16:11, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Assessment Issues

I have started a discussion about issues relating to assessment -- especially importance. -- Pastordavid 16:29, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Saint of the day

A proposal has been made on the talk page of the Portal:Saints for a possible daily update to at least some of the content of the portal. I think that this is a fine idea, but also think that I would want input from others as to which content to feature on which date. I have therefore set up a page for such discussion at Portal:Saints/Saint of the day for interested parties to nominate content related to individual saints they would like to see featured on the portal, and one which particular day, if one is preferred. I am here thinking particularly about possibly including individuals on the days of their feasts, if they have one. Any member of this project is more than welcome to make any nominations they see fit. Please feel free to make any specific suggestions there. John Carter 20:14, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Update

The "to do" list on the project page has been updated to reflect the fact that all articles that currently have the Lutheranism banner have been rated for class and improvement. Quite an achievement - but we all know how task-oriented and hard working German Lutherans are! Many people helped out with the task - but user:jackturner3 has especially put some time in on this one.

Now on to article improvement -- we have far too few GAs and FAs for important articles. -- Pastordavid 20:53, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

I'm currently working on improving the Seminary articles, along with Apostlemep12. He has taken LTSP & LTSG and I am taking all the rest. I have already added infoboxes to all the articles, but anyone who knows something about the institutions is welcome to help us.

jackturner3 13:45, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Awards

Many Wikiprojects give out awards for outstanding contributions. WikiProject Philosophy, for example, has the Star of Sophia. Should we start our own award here? I think that the "Indulgence" given by Ptmccain toCTSWyneken was pretty clever. Fishal 19:22, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

If you think we need/that it would be good for us to have our own award, you could always develop it and submit it as an Award Proposal and hopefully get approval. Maybe the standard Wikipedia barnstar with a Luther Rose in the center?

jackturner3 13:45, 6 April 2007 (UTC)