Wikipedia:WikiProject Catholicism/To-do list

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This page contains discussion on how best to improve articles, lists, categories, and other items relating to this WikiProject. Please join in and help, or add items needing work to this page.

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[edit] To do

[edit] You people should really prioritize moving the "Roman Catholic Church" page to just "Catholic Church"

For the following reasons:

  1. I hate to tell to you this but Eastern Catholics, esp. Byzantine Catholics and Middle Eastern Catholics bristle at being called Roman. They are Catholics, yes, and obey the Pope (Benedict XVI), yes, but by golly they're not Roman. It's bad enough they're persecuted silently in predominantly Orthodox or non-Christian or Muslim countries, but its worse to suffer the indignity of being called Roman from fellow Catholics and ignored that they are also Catholics.
  2. I find it intellectually perverse that when you search for Catholic Church you are redirected to Roman. Everybody in the world practically knows what you refer to when you refer to the Catholic Church. Another annoying thing is that I noticed that the Catholic Church article is being defined from the point of view of Anglicans - simply absurd. An honest encyclopedic article should be rendered from the point of view of the subject first and foremost, beginning what it means according to itself, according to its own definition of itself. Only then do you branch out the multiple uses of the term as they are used by lesser known or lesser popular entities.
  3. Having been educated at a de facto communist university and a proud source of communist party members, assassins, radicals, malcontents and supporters in decades past, surrounded by atheist and socialist friends, I can proudly say that I can be a very objective editor. An atheist can spit at your God or any god for that matter and get away with it. An objective atheist editor may not believe in your religion (the opium of the masses) but he should bloody hell respect it and treat it from their point of view first and foremost.
  4. A point of view is necessary; the point of view of the religion in question — otherwise you lose context. Only after setting and writing about the subject from the subject's point of view, only then can you write the counter-point. Only science can be written about with a neutral point of view. Religion is a belief system, ergo, it is dogmatic. It is practically the antithesis of science; there can never be a NPOV - the idea is misleading, dishonest, and stupid. The humanities will always be subject to a point of view simply because it is not science.
  5. The historicity of a religion can be objective simply because it is a series of events founded on facts or at least it can be treated similarly as a science, an object of history. Where it is based on tradition, it should be noted. When no counter example can be found, the tradition should hold - in order to preserve context.
  6. I have problems with the terminology and a lot of articles related to the Catholic Church. I have looked at the official sites of the Patriarch of Constantinople, the Archbishop of Canterbury, Lutherans, Armenian Orthodox, etc. - and they call themselves that - they don't call themselves as "Catholic", they don't refer to themselves as "Catholic". You define yourself by what you call yourself, otherwise you fall prey to being defined by what others call you - you're at the receiving end of childish name calling: nigger, fat-ass, shorty, fag, homo, loser - you get the point. You should concede that as far as these religions are concerned, they or some of them profess that they are part of the "one, holy, catholic, and apostolic Church" but that is as far as they go. I have tried to ask some of my Orthodox acquaintances if they are Catholic and the reactions are pretty blunt. The same goes to the protestants. They treat the word "catholic" like the plague. In an intellectual symposium, you may discuss it in detail ad nauseam - but don't do this in an encyclopedia.
  7. These articles related to the Catholic Church should be reviewed and edited correctly. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia. It should be understood by an 8th to 12th grader. Some editors make it overly complex in terms of minutiae - which is better suited to a specialist's journal. The writing should be elegant and concise and where there is minute detail - it should be left to the footnotes for the reader to open.
  8. I found the reasons of Vaquero100 to be very logical. Very intelligently thought-out reasoning. It is only my opinion, but his inputs are worth doing. The wikipedia articles regarding the Catholic Church should be written properly since, unfortunately, wikipedia is becoming more and more as a "trustworthy" source of information to today's students.
  9. My interest in wikipedia is simply as an intellectual outlet. Maybe I should have stuck to ancient Roman religion - but hey, where's the fun? There's just something in-your-face about the Catholic Church - huh, but what do I know.

Dr mindbender 07:33, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Think before you speak. You have an issue with the Catholic Church, and you are disruptive to NPOV. The Roman Catholic Church is the largest denomination of the Catholic Church, and the differences between the Eastern Catholic Churches compared to the Roman Catholic Church are titular only. Stop your whinging, and accept that the title of the greater Catholic Church is Roman. You claim to be an objective editor, only after claiming pride on association with Communist/Socialist and Atheist friends, and that you have a source of information regarding a plethora of Left Wing issues. So what? Any decent university has access to left wing people's biographies. Even if you have access, you still need to cite sources so your statement is irrelevant. I can very well say I can go to the library and tell you all about Jamie Hunter Cartwright, for example, and therefore my word on the issue does not need citing. Nor does it make me any more of an expert on Catholicism! Oh, and just so you know, the phrase is "Opiate of the Masses". Eedo Bee 09:25, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

I see that user Eedo Bee has been blocked indefinitely. If the previous tirade is any indication of his approach to editing then I understand why. Majoreditor 23:42, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

As far as I know, the word "Roman Catholic" is not meant to imply that the followers of the religion are Roman in descent; rather it refers to the fact that the church was first legally established in Rome, and that Vatican City, the physical location of the leadership of the "Roman Catholic Church" is located within Rome. In addition, it is used to differentiate the church from other churches which identify themselves as "Catholic" (a word which means "universal", and is not inseparably bound to one religion or another). The use of the word Roman does not refer to the Roman race, and certainly not to the ancient Roman system of deities. Hey jude, don't let me down 15:36, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

  • ROMAN Does not belong as an antecedent to Catholic Church

1. You will find that the Church's own official documents never refer to the Church as the Roman Catholic Church.

2. As best as I can learn, the "Roman" antecedant was first used by Anglicans and perpetuated by Protestants in general to "localize" the See of Peter as just the "Roman church" which "papists" wrongly give allegiance -- when in fact, they claim, any other national church (the Anglican or French, for example) is allegedly equal to the Roman church.

3. I would love it if the bishops would start insisting that (a) the yellow pages list all Catholic Churches under Catholic, or at least Catholic - Latin Rite and (b) send out routine corrections to all the media when Roman Catholic is used.


The problem: it is a church without a name. The church in question calls itself 'The Church' (but there is more than one 'church' - denomination) or the 'Holy Roman Church' (which does not make clear that the Eastern Rite has separate patriarchs & overlooks the use of 'Roman Rite'). People call it the 'Catholic Church' (but other churches use this name) or the 'Roman Catholic Church' (but it is not all of the Roman Rite). It needs a distinctive name! MH au 06:37, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Future articles for consideration

A scheme of articles which could be tied to the Catholic Church main page. Months of discussion on the Catholic Church page have gone into a plan to move as much detail off of the page as possible while connecting readers to a wide variety of articles. Much of the work has been done to move excessive content off to other pages. However, there is a need to put introductory material for many articles onto the main page to give readers an idea of the scope of material available.

I applaud the current effort to evaluate where we stand in developing WP articles, and am looking forward to digging into the project myself, I am concerned though that the present plan isn't as vision oriented as I would hope. I am re-presenting in link-fashion a working list of articles that has been in discussion for several months. Some of the articles have been developed since that conversation began, many have not.

There are few topics as complex and extensive as the Catholic Church, perhaps none. What other institution could produce a 28 volume Encyclopedia about itself--twice? This list below is partial and in my view represents a rather modest horizon.

While it is great to have the 1913 Catholic Encyclopedia available online[www.newadvent.com] is has a tendency perhaps to limit our thinking by almost a century in many cases. There are many obvious articles to be developed (such as "Catholic devotions") which are the subject of hundreds--even thousands--of websites already. This is the easy work. However, there are many articles that I believe should appear here (and frankly I would love to read myself) which have not even begun to be touched and will have to be "researched" with more intensity and precision. Vatican Diplomatic Corps, for example, would be a fantastic read, could cover or at least introduce such topics as the role of the Church in the fall of the Soviet Union, the Church's influence in third world debt relief, the development of the Just War theory (in the Cold War and the War on Terror) etc. Also, it should be noted that while there are many topics the Catholic Church has in common with other Churches, such as "bishop" and "sacraments," there are perhaps many, many, many more that can be written only about the Catholic Church as it is the only institution which maintains a comprehensive body of teaching on every aspect of human endeavor.

I would hope that the articles listed below which have not yet been started, could at least begin in stub form and become part of the evaluation process. This list may stimulate your thoughts on other topics, please feel free to add topics you feel are missing.

... and whatever else may be missing...

I am looking forward to good discussions with you all on the Talk page. Vaquero100 18:04, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Article needed? Ecclesiastical base communities

So far, I see different articles on Central American topics that mention the CEB movement, but no article as such.
  • (1) Am I missing something? Is this part of a larger topic to which those mentions need to be directed?
  • (2) If not — if I'm right that the topic needs its own article — is there someone here who can do it? I last studied the topic in any depth five years ago, and then as part of Latin American anthropology. I couldn't begin to do the topic justice, yet the CEBs are a major part of Latin American, or at least Central American, 20th-century history. Lawikitejana 07:06, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
Update: I just moved this from the Talk page for the current page to this current page. If it fit better on the Talk, let me know on my Talk page and I'll move it. I really couldn't figure out the right place for it.Lawikitejana 07:13, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Overhaul Category

The Roman Catholic Church category is a total mess. I am prepared to put in significant effort to do a major reorganization. First, let's agree to a category tree structure. This is my initial proposal. Let's talk it out. Articles that don't fit nicely into subcategories will go into the overarching category. For instance, "History of monasticism" may go into "Roman Catholic Church History and Politics," since it doesn't fall neatly into any of the subcategories.MamaGeek (Talk/Contrib) 14:53, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Category Tree

  • Cateogory:Roman Catholic worship
  • Category:Roman Catholic History and Politics
  • Category:Historic events in the Catholic Church
  • Category:Catholic political organizations
  • Category:Roman Catholic heresy
  • Category:Movements against Catholicism
  • Category:Catholic Church Controversy
Why is theology and doctrine underneath Roman Catholic worship? It surely deserves to be seperate. JASpencer 19:25, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
That was exactly my thought as well. Amicuspublilius 15:00, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
Reorganisation of the category is a good idea but where do the dioceses go? MH au 07:52, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Catholic Saint Update

  • Padre Pio -- Take a look at my rewrite; I'd appreciate comments. MatthewDBA 16:15, 27 February 2006 (UTC)
I've added some more on stigmata, but there really is a whole lot more to be done here. Anyway, take a look at what I've got so far. We also need more citations, and better referencing in this article. MamaGeek  TALK  CONTRIB  17:36, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
I hope I am on the right place: here is serious problem with article Miguel Pro. But my English is to bad for reparing these article. Can somebody look at this? Cinik 11:54, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Catholic Theology

Please double check this, it has been edited by myself and others. The general article needs revising, but insofar as Catholic dogma is concerned, I find it to be adaquate at this point. Am I wrong?Amicuspublilius 03:08, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
It looks adequate to me, as far as the Catholic position goes. Anybody else? Cheyinka 08:27, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Encyclicals

There is a List of Encyclicals of Pope John Paul II, List of Encyclicals of Pope John XXIII, List of Encyclicals of Pope Paul VI, and List of Encyclicals of Pope Pius XI. Theres also a List of Encyclicals of Pope Benedict XVI but he's only written one, and it's fairly well covered.

Below are the JPII ones that need work / need to be started. Most of the ones that exist are only stubs, and all can use significant work.

[edit] Catholic People

[edit] Miscellaneous

I just created the stub - it still needs lots of work, though. MamaGeek  TALK  CONTRIB  12:55, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
Please check this as well, I restructured and placed a TO-DO in the discussion. The main point is to find a way to deal with the group of Catholic "hits" on Freemasons in a balanced manner. In any case I gave it a massive overhaul. Amicuspublilius 04:30, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
Done, but may need more.Robotforaday 18:13, 12 August 2006 (UTC)
  • Christianese - there's an interesting section about "the Roman church", presumably us. It needs work, but I'm struggling for how to reword the section. It might be interesting to give some examples within that section - Tradition vs tradition, others if someone thinks of them
I went to town on the article, since it was insidiously anti-Catholic. It is still partisan, but I'll leave Protestant sectarian POV to be rooted out by competing Protestant sectarians. For the Catholic Church, I placed Catholic addenda. Feel free to review and add/edit. Amicuspublilius 03:30, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Requests for Narration

Need any narrations?Go ahead and add any article!--Tdxiang 陈 鼎 翔 (Talk)ContributionsContributions Chat with Tdxiang on IRC! 09:36, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Catholic Encyclopedia

I think we should jump in on the effort to copy all Catholic Encyclopedia articles to Wikipedia. MamaGeek  TALK  CONTRIB  12:22, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
Not verbatim of course. It almost always contains a distinct POV and is frequently out of date. See Wikipedia:Catholic Encyclopedia topics for more guidelines about how to convert Catholic articles into Wikipedia ones. savidan(talk) (e@) 16:03, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Popes

Especially for some of the earlier Popes we have a lot of stubs and poorly organized articles. We have public domain Catholic Encyclopedia and the 1911 Britannica to be working with on these—I doubt things have changed much. savidan(talk) (e@) 00:23, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

I added WikiProject:Catholicism banners to the talk pages of all the Popes which didn't have one, which was the vast majority. Many of the articles are very poorly written; I made some changes to a few pages and will continue editing, but it's really a large task. Hey jude, don't let me down 16:04, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Catholic Church Main-Page Project

There has been a great deal of discussion on Talk:Catholic Church about re-organiaing the page. Most recently this began with a proposal by Dominick to merge the Catholic, Criticisms of the Catholic Church and Roman Catholic Church pages. There is a lot of merit in this approach and with some gradual persuasion of opponents we may eventually make progress toward having an article or two under the Catholic Church's name. I believe some real progross has been made recently on the Roman Catholic Church/Name page.

In the meantime, there is a great deal of cleaning up to do on the CC (RCC) mainpage. I have begun an initial clean up by moving excessive content to other articles and referencing them under their section headings on the CC page. In some cases I have created new articles by drawing together material from disparate locations and reorganizing it into a more coherent single article.

When we have cleared up the naming issue, which as I mentioned above is in the works, I believe that Cathlicism on WP could have its own portal as Eastern Christianity has done recently to good effect.

The topic of Catholicism as you all know is vast, perhaps meriting its own Wikipedia (as it already has its own encyclopedia in two editions) one day. Here are some topics I have thought of that could be organized an referenced on the CC page and eventually on a Catholicism portal. Many already exist under different titles or in stub form. The idea is to get them all tied into the main page for ease of reference for the user. Please feel free to add to the list or make modifications to reference articles already in existence or that you have created.

  • Sacraments (Catholic Church)
  • CC and Scripture
  • Tradition in the CC
  • Eastern Rite Catholic Churches
  • CC and pro-life issues
  • CC and Church-State relations
  • CC and Reformation theology
  • CC and diplomatic relations
  • CC and the UN
  • Vatican City
  • CC government (ecclesiology)
  • CC and the theology of priesthood
  • CC and education
  • CC and higher education
  • CC and the medical profession (industry)
  • CC and biomedical ethics
  • CC and the legal profession
  • The Catholic parish
  • The priestless Catholic parish
  • CC and the arts
  • Faith and Reason in the CC
  • CC and Catholic politicians
  • CC and Evolution
  • CC and the Sciences
  • CC and the "Anglican Use"
  • Catholic teachings on sexual morality
  • Spiritualities and prayer forms of the CC
  • CC and Vocational discernment
  • CC and business ethics
  • Government of the CC
  • The Papacy in scripture, tradition, and history
  • Early Christian Church
  • Medieval Church History
  • CC perspectives on the Reformation
  • CC and Modern History
  • Pacifism and the Just War theory in the CC
  • CC and the wars of religion
  • Historically Catholic nations
  • Saints in the CC
  • Marian doctrines of the CC
  • CC and the Evanglical Christian movements
  • Catholic apologetics
  • Liturgy in the CC
  • Catholic Church and ecumenism
  • History of Religious Life in the CC
  • RCIA in the CC
  • The Reforms of Vatican II
  • CC and Society of Pius X
  • CC and History of celibacy
  • Lay movements in the CC
  • CC and relations with other catholic churches
  • The Vatican II era in the CC(1961-1978)
  • The John Paul II era in the CC(1978-2005)
  • Mysticism and the CC
  • Canon law (Catholic Church)

User:Vaquero100

[edit] Vespers and Phos Hilaron

If someone could visit Phos Hilaron and add material on Western Catholic use of the hymn (ancient and modern), I would appreciate it. Mangoe 18:34, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Octogesima Adveniens

I'm new at this and I just created the article on Octogesima Adveniens, an Apostolic Letter by Paul VI and I would really appreciate help expanding it. I just put a skeleton up there. Thanks! JelloSheriffBob 8 January 2007

P.S. I wasn't sure if this was the appropriate place to put this request, so someone please move it if this request shouldn't be here!

[edit] John Chrysostom

Please take a look at the article on John Chrysostom and add your comments to the discussion page. This particular Doctor of the Church is taking much abuse. Majoreditor 23:36, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Preces (Opus Dei)

If there's anyone well-versed in Latin-- this article is on a prayer, but I've only been able to find a Latin version. It'd be nice to have an English translation for our readers. --Alecmconroy 01:14, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

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