Talk:Voseo
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[edit] Tratarse de tú y vos
In Vargas Llosa's Conversation at La Catedral, it is used (once) "tratarse de tú y vos" to indicate familiarity between boss and servant. Internet gives back a few more examples. Now, in Argentina I've never heard it. Is it common in Peru or elsewhere? If true, it might be interesting to mention it here. Ejrrjs | What? 09:06, 22 October 2005 (UTC)
Well, perhaps it has been used in Argentina:
- nada más que porque estábamos en el extranjero, ya se imaginaba que debíamos de tratarnos de tú y vos.
- Lucio V. Mansilla: Horror al vacío.
[edit] Differences among countries
This needs more research, but it should be noted that among the distinctions between countries, some countries use both. My understanding is that in some parts of the Spanish-speaking world, vos is condescending rather than familiar, whereas in other countries this is obviously not the case.
[edit] Você (Portuguese) vs Usted (Spanish)
European Portuguese "você" and Spanish "usted" are not semantically equivalent. The deferential form of 2nd person address, both in Brazil and in Portugal, is actually "o senhor/a senhora" rather than "você". "Você" is normally used in Portugal to address someone who is socially equal, but whom you don't know very well. Unlike Spanish "usted", I believe "você" would not be used for example to address the president of the Portuguese republic or any other public authority. Besides, I think the comparison with Brazilian Portuguese is inadequate in the sense that, unlike "vos" in Spanish, "você" is a standard Portuguese pronoun which simply happens to have acquired a different semantic value in Brazil replacing informal "tu" (see the T-V distinction article for further information on Portuguese and Brazilian usage). 161.24.19.82 17:00, 17 April 2006 (UTC)
[edit] No Sources
There are no sources on this page to support entries. Elhombre72 10:33, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
- There are now. —Pablo D. Flores (Talk) 11:55, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] El Laberinto del Fauno
In the current movie El Laberinto del Fauno, set in Spain in 1944, a faun addresses someone with various laudatory titles (altesa and whatnot) and with the pronoun vos. Is this a throwback to the medieval use of vos as a formal pronoun? If so, is that common in fairy tales in Spain? Maybe that should be mentioned in the article.
—RuakhTALK 06:06, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Vuestra Merced/Usted
I'm wondering where someone picked up the source that indicates that "Vuestra merced" slowly, over time, morphed into "Usted". I am certain that "Usted" evolved from the Arabic title "Ustadh" (unfortunately the computer I'm working on leaves me unable to render this in Arabic), as a result of Moorish rule. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Leftwing Pinko (talk • contribs) 01:31, 5 February 2007 (UTC).
- Whatever source was used, the Diccionario Usual (Usable Dictionary) of the Real Academía Española (Spanish Royal Academy) agrees with it: see the etymologies it gives for usted and vusted. (Well, it doesn't say whether it happened quickly or slowly; but it agrees that vuestra merced → vusted → usted, at least.) —RuakhTALK 04:14, 5 February 2007 (UTC)
