Talk:USAA/Archive10

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You have new messages (last change).
Archive This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

Contents

This proposes an acronym page for USAA

USAA is a three-letter acronym that can stand for a wide variety of terms.

  • USAA (a sail boat association), US Albacore Association headquartered in San Antonio, TX.
  • USAA (an reciprocal inter-insurance exchange), United Services Automobile Exchange headquartered in San Antonio, TX.

etc. etc.

I think \a see also at the top is more appropriate--Looper5920 20:10, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
I agree with Looper since this USAA is a more well-known company. My only question is, do we add a "See Also" at the top for companies that don't even have Wiki articles? --Brownings 20:18, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

1. Additional info - few of the millions of customers no that USAA is united services auto association. They just call it USAA. 2. USAA is the offical and legal business name. 3. USAA has been a constant, while the words have changed over the years - example: long ago it was United Services Army Association HillCountryGrump Hillcountrygrump 13:40, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

I have changed my position on this. Based on other entires like IBM it seems there should be an acronym page for USAA with a link to United Services Automobile Association... Hillcountrygrump 13:40, 28 September 2006 (UTC)


Actually, while USAA is used as a trademark, the official business name (part of which is required by Texas law) is United Services Automobile Association (A Reciprocal Interinsurance Exchange). If you are a member, you can see this on the top of the declarations page of any policy. Also, isn't USAA a four letter acronym? Grin. Swizzlez 20:35, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
A 'vandal' is trying to make a disambiguation page. I propose redirecting this page to the company's current full name, and add a disambiguation link to it. What do you think? (I don't want to do it directly since it seems to be controversial) -- lucasbfr talk 15:24, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
If Wiki has articles for another or all the other uses of USAA, then I say create the disbiguation page. Until then leave this USAA as the USAA. --Brownings 15:28, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
I agree with Brownings and Looper5920. I'd prefer a disambig line at the top; a disambig page would be okay too; but neither is needed until we have information on any of the other organizations. --Allen 15:39, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Vandalism returns

Looks like the aluminum foil hat aficionado has returned and has dropped any pretense of 'discussing' his controversial changes. Just like the roaches, as soon as Splash turns off the 'light' the sockpuppets return in what their simplistic mind(s) believes to be 'under cover.'


Don't you just love it when a loosing team constantly comes to play at your homefield? Sure, ticket sales may be far below normal box office receipts, but its always a good workout and you know it won't hurt your win record. [cracking my knuckles and stretching]


Kudos to Amcbride and Mmx1 for their rapid response skills.

- - - - - - - - - -

Hillcountrygrump 13:29, 28 September 2006 (UTC) I'm a long time USAA employee. I think you have done a fair job of describing the company.

When you have millions of customers there will be some people unhappy with you. We have made mistakes because we are a collection of humans. I've been here 25 years and do not know of an incident when we planned to cheat a customer or claimant. That doesn't mean we don't disagree with them. We often disagree with claimants and jurors about what is fair.

Some of the previous comments (that yawl removed) were baffling to me. We do have a huge building. But we have 15,000 employees in it, plus contractors. It is pretty tight in here - I have no idea where anybody got the idea that it was only 50% used. And as anybody can see we didn't shut it down when we opened the Phoenix office (circa 2000).

Subscriber Savings Account is unique - and I understand confusing to some who have to guess what is going on, but it is not some rip off scheme. I'm not an accountant or attorney but will try to explain it. Since we are a reciprocal/mutual our profits are considered to be overcharges to our customers (we call them members) who are also the owners of the company. At the end of each year if we have a "profit" we have three choices how to handle it: 1.) give it back to the members as a refund (with some contraints) 2.) pay taxes 3.) hold it in reserves (an equity account held against future claims and catastophes - a liability, essentially which reduces our taxes).

We choose to do two things with our "profit/overcharge". 1.) We hold some of it in reserves (positions us financially to weather rough years and reduces our taxes) 2.) Refund some of it back to the members (who are also our owners). But, we do the refund with a twist. We don't return all of the money to our members. We hold some of it in the Subscriber Savings Account. Here is why... We can claim it as an asset which increases our financial strength even more (did you notice our high financial ratings from all agencies?) which allows us to get the best interest rates when we use debt.

Here is a little more about SSA. Each member has an "account". When it exceeds a certain dollar amount (was $1,000 years ago, I think it is near $3,000 today) USAA sends you a refund check for the difference. Also, if you cancel your USAA auto insurance the entire amount is refunded to you. Unusual, no doubt. Sinister - I think not... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Hillcountrygrump (talk • contribs) .


Ooops - need to sign Hillcountrygrump 21:41, 10 May 2006 (UTC)


Two things about the Subscriber Savings Account. First, not all of USAA's reserves are held in SSA's. There is a portion held as "unassigned reserves" and then a portion that has been allocated to members in their SSA's.
Second, distribution from SSA's is actually a rather complicated formula, and not simply an amount over and above some other set amount. Each year (if it is financially viable to do so), a portion of the unassigned reserves and/or excess premiums (i.e., profits) of USAA is allocated to each member's Subscriber Savings Account, based both on how much is already in the SSA, and also based on how much business one has done with USAA over the past year. Then, a certain percentage of each member's Subscriber Savings Account is distributed to the member, either in the form of a premium credit, or (I believe) if the distribution is over a certain amount, a check can be issued. Lastly, there is an extra distribution made to seniors, not sure if it depends on age or the tenure of membership, but USAA distributes an extra amount to its older members. Seems fair to me, as the only way to get at ALL your SSA money at once is to either cancel all your policies for six months or die, so why not give back a little extra to older members who can enjoy the fruits of their long-time membership instead of waiting to die and pass the couple thousand in the account on to their heirs?
I know you don't have to have a certain dollar amount because I got a premium credit of something like $3 the first year I was a member and I am certain that was my SSA distribution. It can end up being a sizeable chunk of cash (couple hundred dollars or more) depending on how much one has paid in premiums and how long one has been a USAA member.
Not sure how the SSA reduces USAA's taxes, but I do know that all distributions from it are considered a return of premium paid and are not taxed to the member.Swizzlez 20:53, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Aluminum foil hat man, if you'd like to discuss your insistence on adding what is most decidedly your opinion about how USAA should be run (i.e. you want the senior leadership's salary published), I'd be happy to debate that point in the discussion forum. The Wiki entry on USAA, however, is not a place to espouse what you think is best, just what "is". For example, I think an appropriate statement could actually be something like "Because it is not a share company, USAA's leadership is not required under the law to disclose details of their compensation package," and people can infer whatever they want from that. Otherwise, I'm going to keep deleting your opinion from the Wikipedia entry on USAA no matter how many times you try to change it (and believe me, I'm more stubborn than you are crazy). Swizzlez 19:53, 8 September 2006 (UTC) Swizzlez 19:53, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

"Anyone"?

From the article:

anyone can become a member by opening a bank account, an investment account, or by seeking life insurance from USAA

From USAA.com:

Who can apply?
* Active duty officer and enlisted personnel
* National Guard and Reserve officer and enlisted personnel
* Officer candidates in commissioning programs
* Former spouses and adult children of USAA members

—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.235.238.180 (talk • contribs) 22:13, 20 May 2006.

(former employee here)
Distinction is what's legally allowed vs. what USAA markets to. The article is correct; there are specific eligibility rules for property insurance, but not most other products. In line with their mission statement ('provider of choice for the military community'), USAA primarily markets to military and dependants on usaa.com.
- 68.92.156.81 06:56, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

section removal

Hillcountrygrump 13:30, 28 September 2006 (UTC) I removed the section on litigation for the following reasons:

  1. . every major (top 10) P&C insurance company in the U.S. is the target of dozens even hundreds of law suits.
  2. . there isn't a "lawsuit" section for the other insurance companies.
  3. . there is nothing especially unique or impacting about these lawsuits.
  4. . it implies that this company has a bigger lawsuit problem than other insurance companies, and that is not correct
  5. . in fact, this company is regularly ranked in the upper echlon for customer service and loyalty —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Hillcountrygrump (talk • contribs).Hillcountrygrump 13:30, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Price increase - bias view

Every US insurance company constantly adjusts prices up and down. Likewise they constantly adjust the geographic areas where they sell insurance driven by factors like risk, building codes, rates allowed by the state, etc.

If you are going to post rate changes post all of them, and do it for all of the insurance companies. This smacks of competition...

--Hillcountrygrump 01:06, 5 August 2006 (UTC)

changed why military couldn't get insurance

It is subtle, but the reason people in the military couldn't get insurance wasn't because they took their vehicles into combat zones. It was because they were considered cavalier about life and therefore risky drivers; therefore, high risk drivers. Turns out to be the exact opposite. They were disciplined, educated, and had a dependable source of income--Hillcountrygrump 01:15, 5 August 2006 (UTC).

What exactly is germane

Hillcountrygrump, I would appreciate it if you would quit deleting entire passages of this entry without any type of editing. This goes against Wiki guidelines which I invite you to review.

Furthermore, I believe what you have been deleting is actually germane; first of all, USAA is unique when compared to pretty much every Fortune 500 company, and most definitely every major financial services company. People looking to Wikipedia to do research into a company want MORE information, not less. If they want to know what services USAA offers and an essentially detail-free synopsis of USAA's background, they can get that on the public USAA website. The entry here should be unique and detailed, not a copy of what's available elsewhere. In addition, information posted here, both on the legal structure of USAA and the identification of its competition is factually accurate and not easily found elsewhere on the web; it has been gathered both from personal experience, both as a USAA member and as a stint as a USAA employee, as well as family contacts in the financial services industry and some pretty detailed web and newspaper searches.

Even further, regarding competition, I invite you to visit any military installation and go to the commissary or exchange, and watch the credit and/or debit cards that are used to make purchases. Visit websites that cater to the military and see who is advertising. Review various chat rooms (for example, the Motley Fool's Military Fools section) and see what companies are being discussed as being useful financial service companies for members of the military. Talk to service members and see who they are using for their insurance.

All the information I've included is to the best of my knowledge accurate and is also pretty balanced. I invite any constructive edits (for example, I know I can be wordy) or formatting changes, but please stop deleting entire passages on a wholesale basis.

Swizzlez 21:40, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Add: there is no IRS jargon on the page. Read it carefully, and you'll see the details are from the Texas Insurance Code. I guess if you were writing an advertisement for USAA you would leave out anything complicated or that portrays USAA unfavorably, however, this webpage is a reference, not an ad. I happen to think USAA is fantastic but in order to maintain objectivity, I think it's best to include the good and the bad. I notcied that a section about the controversial layoffs of 2001 was also removed in the most recent edit; I think this is important as for 75 years USAA was known in San Antonio as an employer that had never laid anyone off; laying off 5% of the workforce was an abrupt (and in my opinion) necessary change, but not without controversy; it also seemed to be a pretty important turning point in company history.Swizzlez 21:48, 7 September 2006 (UTC)


From HillCountry Grump to Swizzlez

Dear Swizzlez,

FIRST - FULL OPEN DISCLOSURE - I am a USAA employee and know that I have bias. I try very hard to control it. I do this by looking at the entries for other companies as a standard. Let me know when you think my bias is getting in the way.

Second - I think that most of what you post is accurate (some speculation that needs to be removed) and brings a NPOV.

Third - If it is wrong to make large deletes, then it is also wrong to make large additions... I found it hard to "edit" many of your entries and still have them make sense. It took complete rewrites. So, like you replaced my stuff with your text, I replaced your stuff with nulls. Just because something is true does not make germane. And, germane is relative. Right? That is why I try to use entries for other companies as a standard.

1. The structural detail you added appears to be accurate, but USAA is NOT more complex than its competitors. The structure, like that of comeptitors is dramatically affected by the IRS, state insurance regulators, the SEC, the FDIC, etc. Your description here is complex and I think it makes the company look unncessarily complex, and I don't think you'll find similar complexity described at other company entries.

I agree that the USAA P&C company is unique. But, I think you should explain the texas insurance code in its own entry, not in the USAA entry.

2. I don't see references to competitors when I go to other company entries. If you want to talk about comeptitors then I suggest you do that in an entry for "The Insurance Industry" or something.

3. The ONLY reason I brought up SSA in the first place is because somebody was trying to make it sound like SSA was some kind of evil magic that we used to steal from our customers.

4. What is your source about the bank being modeled after Fort Sam Bank?

5. Concerning the layoffs. Why is it germane for a company that is consistently named among the best companies in America to work for? - Name a Fortune 500 company over 20 years old that hasn't had layoffs - Name a Fortune 200 financial services company that doesn't use outsourcing or third party resources - What is your source about the number of employees laid off? - It was a controversy in San Antonio because it was a way for the local press to make money...

Is it true that USAA had layoffs? Yep. Was it hard for a lot of people. Yep. But is it germane 5 years later? Nope.

6. I think your opening statement under the "Competition Section" is speculative. Can you support it with a source?

7. The JD Power award is almost 5 years old. Adding it is fine, but why would you delete 2006 ratings? Recent data seems more germane...

8. Under eligibility you say something about "symmetry". What is you source for that? It sounds speculative. Hillcountrygrump 13:34, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

not sure how adding large additions is wrong for an encyclopedia entry. review of numerous articles for a number of financial and non-financial services companies indicate a great deal of detail, especially a lot more than I saw when I first looked at the USAA entry. it's certainly not equivalent to deleting large swaths of accurate and relevant information.

1) the texas insurance code is relevant since the fact is that under the concept of the Association, every subscriber does insure every other subscriber. most people don't expect that when they buy insurance they are actually exchanging liability with other people, they think a corporation is gambling on whether they're going to have to pay claims on a certain person's policy or not in that particular year. thus, it is worth pointing out that a provision of the insurance code does limit liability, and I don't know of any other fortune 500 company that is owned by its members, and not shareholders or a tightly held private company.

Further, this is an encyclopedia. it is not an advertisment. it is not here to say whether USAA is better or worse than any other company; to me it seems that you fear that if people read about the structure of USAA that they won't want to do business there if it's complex. I think that if Wiki is building an encyclopedic reference source for virtually anything you can think of, the more detail the better.

2) A few company entries that mention competitors: Coca_cola, H-E-B, Google, Dell, among many others.

3) I think the SSA is worth mentioning in the article. I just wanted to point out in the discussion how it actually works. You don't need thousands of dollars in it to start getting credits or a check disbursed.

4) A USAA executive.

5) Discussion of layoffs is especially germane if the company is consistently labeled as one of the best to work for. If one thinks they are getting a great deal, they need to know of the potential for layoffs to occur. Discussion of layoffs is justified considering that up until the layoffs, USAA was known for never laying off anyone, ever [1]. Thus it is worth bringing up, perhaps with an edit to frame it in a more historical light. Why not discuss and include outsourcing, especially as it relates to layoffs? Regarding the stir in the media in San Antonio, again, USAA was always known as a place where as long as you got a job and did it well, you would keep it until you wanted to leave. That is no longer the case, for better or worse, and merits at least a brief mention, either in a historical context or as a relatively recent development in a company that has existed for well over 80 years. **Opinion Follows**: I like USAA, in fact, I think it's one of, if not the best company in the US. However, I am distanced enough from it to know it is not perfect, and in fact, things HAVE changed over the past 10 years; the culture in the past was more familial and the bottom line, while important, was not sacred. It has NOT changed to a ruthless pursuit of the bottom line at all costs, but some of the familial/esprit-de-corps characteristics, both inside the company and in it's exterior approach to members have faded, if only just a little; a major turning point in this was the restructuring of a few years back where over 1000 staff were laid off. If someone else can think of a way to include this sentiment as more fact based than opnining, I think it should be included, the only way I can think of to do that fairly now is just to mention there were layoffs.

regarding the numbers: sources: [2], [3], [4]

6) I don't have access to customer surveys or market research, but I do read a variety of publications geared toward military members. Based on experience and observation that anyone can do as outlined above, since USAA's target market are those people in military service, retirees and their families, USAA competes with other businesses seeking to serve that particular niche. For the most part, these companies, while numerous, are dwarfed by the size of USAA. Pick up any publication geared towards a military audience and you'll see ads for USAA, a variety of military credit unions, GEICO, maybe AAFMAA, First Command, etc. If you pick up a military newspaper local to a certain base, you'll see ads for the local military credit union and/or bank, probably USAA, and a few other companies that cater to the military. I don't think that's speculation, there is definitely evidence out there.

7) Yes, that JD Power award is relatively old, but does represent the culmination of years of consistently good service. The sentence about the 2006 rating was essentially lifted directly from the JD power press release and I don't think that's appropriate. The entry as it stands does say that USAA has remained at the top of the ratings since the award.

8) Symmetry: another way of stating that the policy regarding eligibility for officers was changed to match the policy regarding eligibility for NCOs. It is a fact that prior to the admittance of NCOs to USAA membership, if you were a retired officer and you had never joined USAA, you could still do so at any time. Once enlisted members were allowed to join, retired and separating officers faced the same time cutoff that retiring and separating enlisted members faced. Thus the policy for both types of military member is symmetric, i.e. equal, i.e. fair.

Obviously, like every wikipedia entry this one is a work in progress and can always use edits. However, making sweeping deletions to true and germane information regarding USAA is not helpful in the establishment of a detailed encyclopedia. I fail to see how adding large amounts of information can be seen as identical to deleting said large amounts, and refer you to Wikipedia:Etiquette, where it says "try to avoid deleting things as a matter of principle." Swizzlez 01:59, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

. . . .

From HillCountryGrump to Swizzlez

So basically you are rejecting all of my suggestions.

It looks like we may need to involve an arbitrator...

I agree that USAA being an unincorporated reciprocal interinsurance exchange is germane. It should be part of the description. I don't think it should be explained here, and I don't think the pros and cons should be discussed here. That should be discussed at the URIE entry. By the way, a URIE is not a mutual, but it is very close and there are lots of mutuals in the insurance industry including F500 companies: Northwestern Life, State Farm, MassMututal, and New York Life to name a few. If I'm ineterpreting you correctly you are saying that USAA's use of the URIE is a risk because in a huge disaster the liability is limited. I have two facts for you to consider. #1. Several insurance companies declared bankruptcy in Florida in 90's after hurricane Hugo. The few remaining insurance companies, including USAA, had to pick up the loses of those that took banktruptcy in addition to covering their own responsibilities. It was the "publicly owned" companies that dumped their customers in Florida, to take care of their stock holders elsewhere. #2. The Florida insurance regulators have one main job. Make sure that the insurance companies doing business in Florida take care of Floridans. The Florida regulators don't have the worries that you seem to be expressing about a URIE... Ditto any other state!

You describe the county mutual. Almost every insurance company in Texas uses county mutuals. In fact, USAA was one of the last to adopt the technique. I don't that is addressed about any other insurance company. Why is it germane?

USAA has lots of subsidiaries. I think there is one in each state for the P&C insurance part of the business. Ditto Life insurance. I think that is how every company in this industry is set up because there is no federal insurance charter. By explaining it in the USAA entry you make USAA seem really complex compared to the other companies in the industry and that would scare some people away from the company. Either do it for every company or don't do it for this one. I would think that consistency is a trade mark of a good encyclopedia.

Concerning edits. You mass replaced the stuff I put out there, but now you want me to edit your stuff one sentence or word at a time. That doesn't seem right...

You are saying that if something is a fact, it belongs. I disagree. I think it must be current and/or very unique to be relevant.

You say this is not advertising. I agree, but your wording makes the company seem a lot more complex than other companies and that is not accurate. Also, the style you are using for this company is not found in the rest of the encyclopedia.

I see you found some companies with competitor links. I'm not suprised since there are thousands of companies. I didn't see any in the financial services industry on your list. It seems crass to me to link people to competitors. Perhaps this is my bias. But, I'm still going to insist that you put that stuff in an industry entry.

Concerning the bank. "An executive" is not a source. I need a name or a public source or I'm calling it speculation.

Also, the symmetry statemment is your opinion. I'd say that you make a logical argument, but it is your opinion. I think you need to have an industry analyst or a public statement by a USAA executive to use it.

So, I still haven't changed your stuff because I think you are being fair. But, I also think you are really bringing aspects to the entry that (while they may be unintended) do put the company are a disadvantage. I think that consistency with other companies in the industry is the only way to make this fair. Is there any reason for us to continue the dialog. Are you willing to budge? Or, should we engage a wiki arbitrator?

Hillcountrygrump 21:49, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

. . . . . . . . . . .

No, you're not interpreting or reading correctly. Liability is limited as described in the entry. There are no worries listed in the entry. I am not a Robert Koenig sockpuppet! I'm not sure why you think this is some kind of USAA attack. A URIE is, as a matter of fact, unique and should be mentioned somewhere, if you want to move it, that's fine.

USAA does use county mutuals for high-risk drivers in Texas, and if you happen to be dropped from United Services Automobile Association for bad driving, that's where you go. It's a part of the company. Why not mention it? Do you think it's a black mark? I don't get the objection to mentioning the existence of something that is real.

I'm not out to edit every single company. THIS IS AN ENCYCLOPEDIA, not an advertisment. The entry is not designed to attract nor scare people away from USAA, but to provide facts. Go to the entry on American Airlines. It describes the company as a subsidiary of AMR, and if you link to AMR, it describes a number of other subsidiaries. I don't think people are frightened to fly on American or invest in it or otherwise do business with it because it has subsidiaries. People who are geekish enough to be searching an encyclopedia for information are looking for details, and I am providing them to the best of my knowledge. It is not my responsibility to pore over the rest of Wikipedia and make a list of all business entries that mention competition. To suggest I do so is ridiculous.

In everything I read from you, you clearly believe this site is designed to advertise; it is not. It is designed to provide information. Linking to an ENCYCLOPEDIA entry on competitors is, therefore, not an attempt to divert business away from your employer and my insurer, but to further illustrate the environment in which this business acts. You will noticed that the linked entries have hardly any information about them, probably because they are small and simple operations. USAA, however, is a Fortune 500 company deserving of a detailed reference entry. There are far more entries besides the ones I found that have links to competition, but it is not my responsibility to prove that it is against Wikipedia practice to discuss competition of a business. Find a Wikipedia guideline that says I should remove competition data, and I will.

I'm not sure which of the parts of your entries I changed, but I do remember deleting the rating sentence as it was directly lifted from the JD Power press release about the most recent survey, which is plagiarism.

Sorry, but I'm not going to budge. Again, clearly you are concerned with the ability or lack of ability of this site to direct people to USAA. That's not what it's for. Instead, it is here as a reference to provide as much relevant information as possible. The irony of it all is that I think anyone who is eligible SHOULD be doing business with USAA, but this is not the forum to advance such a point of view. If you want to provide constructive contributions, or edit style (which I would welcome), great, but if your aim is to delete everything that you don't feel portrays USAA in the best possible light, find yourself an arbitrator.

Swizzlez 23:06, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

oh, by the way, some of the entry I actually don't like but I left in due to the "contributions" of RJK and his sockpuppets. Obviously his non NPOV stuff should have been removed, but I left things in like "complex corporate structure" as a substitute for outlandish statements like "mystifying array of....". I wouldn't mind actually removing things like that, but felt it was the most I could compromise with his input since this is a collective effort. Swizzlez 23:09, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

One at a time

Swizzlez,

Overall I like what you have done. I'm a stickler for detail and facts. I'm going to start working my disagreements with you one at time.

I'm starting with the bank section. Encyclopedias stick to the facts. So, we can't use the statement about the Fort Sam Bank unless we can prove it. We have to substantiate the "fact" with a reference to a public statement from an official USAA source or we have to qualify the statement with something like "allegedly". I have trouble imagining an encyclopedia using "allegedly" in its articles... Hillcountrygrump 15:20, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

I just changed the section on target market

Swizzlez,

I made changes because you get a little wordy. I tend to be terse. We might need to compromize... I don't think I took out any substance. Hillcountrygrump 14:04, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

I read the CIO article about Steve Yates and the layoff

Swizzlez,

First, I've been at USAA for 25 years. I know that the culture has changed. I also know that no company is perfect. We got bloated and lazy (just my opinion) and had been that way for a while like 1995 to 2000. Let me say this another way - we were bloated and lazy at the expense of the membership (just my opinion).

Is it a fact that USAA had layoffs? Yes. It is also a fact that there was a handsome severance package. Some people volunteered to be cut so they could get the severance. A friend of mine was offered a demotion but opted to take the severance because they said "It would take years to save that much money."

1. This seems like a rediculous level of detail to me. 2. It was almost 5 years ago. 3. We are listed in the top 100 companies to work for in 3 spaces (at least): IT, Hispanics, and Women 4. It was 5 years ago 5. It is ancient history

Hillcountrygrump 14:04, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

No rumors allowed

1. Swizzlez, no rumors. 2. Unless you provide a source for the symmetry I'm gonna keep taking it out. Symmetry is your opinion, your impression. Just state the facts, if you have them (and they are not proprietary). I will not remove the symmetry statement if you can find a bonafide industry analyst that says it creates symmetry, or a statement by USAA saying symmetry was a desired outcome. 3. Why did you take out the top 100 places for Hispanic women? Hillcountrygrump 21:18, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Swizz I don't understand you

1. I thought you were the one that said no wholesale deletes... what do you call what you did? 2. I thought you were the one that wanted to add "interesting details"... 3. I thought you were the one that said "membership details" were missing... well here is membership demystified... 4. Oh yeah, I think it eaiser to read the way I did it...

Hillcountrygrump 18:06, 25 October 2006 (UTC)


Who is advertising Swizz?

You accuse me of advertizing - which by the way I find to be very crass.

I offered a pretty simplified explanation of what it takes to become a member (owner of the company) which is very unique, and has expiration dates that few people understand...

Yet, you have added competitor information to the wiki which I consider to be advertizing for USAA's competition. What do the competitors have to do with USAA? How did you pick the competitors you included in the entry? Are you advertising for GEICO? Do you own Berkshire stock?

Hillcountrygrump 18:33, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org../../../u/s/a/Talk%7EUSAA_Archive10_b8a1.html"