Talk:Unreal Engine

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[edit] Ubisoft/Wii?

What's the source for the suggestion that a version of UE3 will be produced for Wii games? I marked it as "citation needed", but I'm very very skeptical that it's true.

I think that it was in an issue of gameinformer. I'm not sure exactly, I'll try and check. Supposedly, after working with the engine on 2.5 (Red Steel), Ubisoft wanted to be able to use 3 on the Wii.

[edit] This statement has no citation and is incorrect

"The third generation Unreal Engine was designed specifically for DirectX 9/10 PCs and next-generation consoles (currently the Xbox 360 and Playstation 3)."

firstly, the ps3 is not a direct x next gen console... its openGL based. secondly please cite where somebody says this engine was designed specifically for direct X pc's?


[edit] Duke Nukem Forever

Holy vaporware, Batman. I doubt this "game" will ever release. Unless there's some solid citations to suggest that it may release using any version of the Unreal Engine, then we'll keep that in the article, otherwise.. buh bai Duke. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 00:26, 15 September 2006 (UTC)

Oh, undoubtedly one of the many unreleased versions of DNF used the unreal engine, before they decided to rewrite it yeat again. I'd remove. Nysin 00:33, 15 September 2006 (UTC)
I think my grandkids will gave grandkids before DNF releases. :-p Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 00:37, 15 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] User:3d engineer reversion again

Yet again, more reversions from this guy bringing apparent original research into the article. Reverted back to last entry. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 02:32, 15 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Brothers In Arms

The new game just added is an example of the unsourced accretion that I want to stop from occurring before it gets any traction. However, I suspect that nearly no one wandering by to contribute a game will think of doing adding a citation, and instant-reverts seem harsh and probably unproductive, so long as one's not dealing with the 3d engineer/etc group. Thus, I intend to attach a {{fact}} tag to it, and if not responded to, remove it within a few days. Nysin 14:52, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

Agreed. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 16:19, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
I'm looking at the BiA forums and there's discussion about UnrealEd and troubleshooting/how-to's. UEd only works for Unreal Engine games. Other than that, there's nothing else to say what the original BiA runs on. Added: Found some reviews that mention that BiA runs on UE2. [1] [2]
I do see a lot of citable notes that say BiA3 will be running on UE3. [3] [4] [5] to link a few... Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 16:29, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
Both BiA2 citations look good, though I'd be wary of adding not-yet-released games (BiA3, I guess?) regardless of whether their engines have been announced. Nysin 16:53, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
Normally I would be as well, but there's dozens of gaming news articles mentioning that the game will be on UE3. I didn't get any details, but I think some mentioned it was an official announcement. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 16:57, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Move back to Unreal Engine

I wanted to try and move the article back to Unreal Engine, but couldn't because of the existing redirect. I'm concerned that reverting the move might alter any changes to the article. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 20:41, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

From the Move Log:

09:19, August 2, 2006 Unico master 15 (Talk | contribs) moved Talk:UnrealEngine to Talk:Unreal Engine Technology (revert) 09:19, August 2, 2006 Unico master 15 (Talk | contribs) moved UnrealEngine to Unreal Engine Technology (revert)

Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 20:47, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

Oh, hang on, I'll move it. —Bunchofgrapes (talk) 21:20, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
Done. If you could fix the swarm of double redirects that created (see [6]), that would be appreciated. —Bunchofgrapes (talk) 21:22, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
Looks like the double-redirects are fixed now. :) Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 21:52, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
I went through a few just now, and came across [7]. That should probably just be deleted. Any page which links to UE1.5 (which seems to very dubiously exist) deserves to get its wikilink broken. Nysin 21:53, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
Nah, I doubt that anyone would use it, except perhaps Unico master 15 and 3d engineer, but just in case... fixed the double redirect. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 22:01, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Unconfirmed games queue

[8]

Hm. This one's probably not UE1, but it doesn't hint at a version number in that Gamespot article. Nysin 07:30, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
From the screenshots I saw on the GS article, I'd say UE 2.0. UE 1 would have a blockier look and more primitive lights. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 09:00, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
Your perceptions of relative blockiness between UE1 and UE2.x can't really act as a reliable source here, however. Nysin 01:33, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
Ping? Nysin 17:56, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
Pong! Been busy lately with other things. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 19:30, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
Okay, I'm not really comfortable with this in any specific version category sans unspecified (per comments on your perceptions not being a RS). Your opinion? Nysin 00:03, 1 November 2006 (UTC)
The game is using Unreal 2.x because Unreal 1 and 3 were not ported to the original Xbox by Secret Level. - RobertHeadley
Cite for those engine versions not being ported? If you can provide that (and link from the article) I have no problem with this. Nysin 03:47, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

[9]

See comment about HP. Nysin 07:31, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
[10] From the system requirements and the statement that it was the "state of the art" Unreal Engine, I'd say UE 2.5. The system req's match that of UT2004, a known 2.5 release. (and which predates this game's release) Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 09:04, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
Yeah, that's really kind of a fragile matching method for my taste. Nysin 23:57, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

[11][12]

Using a forum post seems dubious, and the first link only talks about "next generation" - take to be UE2? Nysin 07:35, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
Yeah, next-gen + 2003 date is UE 2.0 Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 09:09, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
Well, but eventually "next-gen" becomes UE3.x. Not by 2003, granted, but again, this is precisely the sort of OR that'd be unfortunate to add. Nysin 15:11, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

The GoPostal.com link will accomodate P2:AW as well.

[13]

[14]

I get redirected to a blank page with the URL [15]. Nysin 00:00, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

[16]

[17]

[18]

[19]

[20]

I must be missing something. The only mention of "Unreal" I can find is

The Direct Action developers can be solidly beaten at this Unreal engine mod by any 9-year-old with a SpongeBob mouse.

in a user comment. Is there something more solid here? Nysin 00:03, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

[21]

The game was a major flop for GrooveGames, which is why the review at GameSpot was so... ineloquently written. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 20:27, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Found an interesting source of info

UE history article on BeyondUnreal. [22] And another one at TeamXBox. [23]

The BU article only talks about UE1, but it mentions a number of released titles on UE1, as well as some info about the engine itself. The TeamXBox article talks about all the versions up to UE3. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 17:40, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

Very nice. Nysin 01:31, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] From addition to the Unreal Engine 3 section

Red Steel confirmed to use UE3 [24] Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 03:07, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

Yup, added. Nysin 07:13, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

red steel is Unreal 2.5 not 3 the link to gamespot goes to EA not UbiSoft. stop posting a link to EA it's UBI and Unreal 2.5 end of story. http://www.wiichat.com/nintendo-wii-gaming/2814-red-steel-new-screenshots-info.html The associate producer of Red Steel Jean-Baptiste Duval, said in an interview with Australian video game magazine Hyper that the game runs on a modified Unreal Engine 2.5. He said that much of the Ubisoft staff had worked on the engine and knew its strengths and weakness.

unreal 2.5 not 3.0.

[edit] Anonymous editors please note

The neutral point of view is a requirement. Edits that express opinions cannot be considered NPOV and may be reverted. Also, original research is not permitted in articles and will be reverted on sight. If you cannot cite reliable sources to back up your edits, then it cannot be included in the article. All the information that is in the current version is sourced and cited and should not be removed. If you have information to add, make sure that it has a reliable source before adding it to the article. Thanks. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 19:38, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] UE2 and UE3 Features

UE2 Features and UE3 Features should be added to the article, I think. :D Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 15:43, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Oh yeah, and UE1 Features as well. :o Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 15:44, 23 September 2006 (UTC)
[25] and [26] are trivially (directly linked from the first page) accessible from [27], whic is listed. The UE1 link I don't think is though, so probably should be added. Nysin 15:58, 23 September 2006 (UTC)
While true, it would add to the article's content and might raise the quality a fair bit. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 16:03, 23 September 2006 (UTC)
I'd at least include some details about UnrealKismet (Visual UScript?) and compare it to standard UScript coding. Details about UEd (in its various forms) would also lend some flavour to the article as a whole. It might make the difference between being a Start class and being a GA class article. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 02:37, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
(kicking back indent) I noticed in the UE2 features page, Epic tauts that the UE2 engine supports up to 64 players, yet I know that UT2kx has a hard coded limit of 32 players. Strange. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 02:53, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
Added UE1, UE2 and UE3 pages, since I agree it helps somewhat. I'd be amenable to adding information about UnrealKismet and/or UScript (and, actually, organising the existing engine information differently, since it's just sort of a list of lists at the moment, many of the entries of which are the same or quite similar). Nysin 17:00, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
Agreed. I think we could also expand features of the various engines, and compare/contrast the evolution of the UE's capabilities. This article has the potential to be a GA or even FA if it's done right. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 20:38, 30 September 2006 (UTC)
Said expansion and comparison sounds good. From its current state, even GA seems a bit ambitious, but worth aiming for. Nysin 15:04, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Some things that may be worth mentioning in the article

"The biggest strength of the Unreal technology, relative to third-party and homegrown tools, is that it provides a complete solution that has stood the tough test of real-world game development. While there are certainly some quality third-party game components on the market, such as QSound, Motivate!, and Caviar, they all provide only a small part of the overall 3D game-development equation. The saying "God is in the details" is very applicable to game engine development: a cool rendering algorithm can only be exploited if it integrates seamlessly into an engine's collision, visibility, networking, AI, and file management subsystems. All of Unreal's components have been designed together; they provide a consistent programming interface; and they fully interoperate."

"As a technology developed in conjunction with a leading-edge, high-detail game, the tradeoffs that Unreal makes on detail versus realism are fundamentally sound and taylored to real-world constraints. For example, some people may criticise Unreal's cyllindrical actor collision system as being low-tech compared to an IK-based system. However, this decision was made with an accute awareness of all the ramifications it had on the overall product: cyllindrical collision makes AI, player control programming, and network predication much simpler, and it keeps performance up. A collision system designed in isolation could easily be more advanced than Unreal's, and it would probably cause countless headaches when making it work with the rest of the codebase and making it run at a decent frame rate on 1998-1999 PC's."

From the UE1 features page. I think that the article needs to mention the fact that some components were simplified to maintain performance, such as the collision detection system. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 14:10, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Indeed. Well, at some point the actual engine descriptions apparently got emptied out (I missed where, but I don't mourn them particularly - they weren't very good), so whatever it should say it most likely doesn't, in general. Nysin 15:05, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
I'll start adding in engine features and trade-offs, but it's going to be very "basic." I won't claim to be the greatest writer around. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 18:14, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Unreal Engine 4

The statement by Mark Rein stating that UE 4 has been in development over the past 2 years contradicts what was stated by Tim Sweeny at GDC. Sweeny stated that UE 3 is intended to be maintained until ~2010, and they are not planning to being work on UE 4 tech until 2008 at the earliest. I'm not really sure if a source can be acquired for this information, though.

Also, in that same statement it claims that Sweeny is the "lead programmer" while his current title is listed as "technical director" in the article specifically about him. I'll go ahead and make that minor change, and see if I can dig up any source on the timeline for UE4 that is legally sourcable. - Sanjay12 07:37, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] UE2 and the Gamecube?

I removed the reference that the engine works on the Gamecube, as I looked over their technology website and it made no references to a Gamecube version:

"Fully optimized for and supported on Windows and Xbox. Optimized seek-free DVD-based loading support for Xbox. Fully functioning source code available for PlayStation2. Fully functioning source code available for 64-bit Windows, MacOS X, Linux 32-bit and 64-bit."

Sanjay12 08:15, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Good enough. I don't think Nintendo's GameCube will ever see the Unreal Engine in any form anyway unless something major changes at Nintendo. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 19:56, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
Sorry for the late reply, but do XIII, the Splinter Cell and Ghost Recon games on GameCube not use the Unreal 2 Engine? Nova Prime 06:23, 3 December 2006 (UTC)
Yes, you are correct.. --Illyria05-- 21:14, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Split of the game list

The game list is getting pretty large, and it will only get larger as someone adds all the UE3 games to the list. I'd suggest splitting it off. It will also off-load any discussions about the verifiability of whether or not a game uses Unreal to that talk page, as opposed to this one which is farily large.

Speaking of that, does anyone know how to archive the talk page? It's really a pain to navigate it, and several of the discussions at the top are pretty old at this point. Sanjay12 10:01, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Archived much of the older discussions. Link to the archive is at the top of the page. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 19:57, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
I'd be fine (indifferent really) with splitting off the games list, though I'm not sure it's become unmanageably large yet. Nysin 06:58, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
Eventually it will, however. It may even qualify as a Category, rather than a list article. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 18:43, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
Well, but as a category it won't be able to have citations, or? As a list-article with the citations it does now, it sounds fine. Nysin 23:53, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
It wouldn't likely survive an AFD vote. As new games are released using UE, the list will quickly become unmanageable. Articles for most of the games will already be created, and the UE reference can be added on each article page. New games can be quickly sorted in a category, making categorization more toward an ideal. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 00:28, 1 November 2006 (UTC)
In which case it'd make sense to start devolving the citations on those games to the articles themselves (some probably have them, but I haven't noticed that most game articles which list an engine justify that claim). A bit unfortunate, since it's easier to track a single article than dozens, but if the lists here will probably become categories, I'm not sure I see the viable alternative. Nysin 09:29, 1 November 2006 (UTC)
(kicking back indent) Many of the games are redlinks at this time. Categorization would work to an extent, but the redlinked games should stick around in the UE article. That way it's somewhat maintainable. If a game gets an article here, migrate its entry from article to category. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 20:35, 1 November 2006 (UTC)


Yes, I also believe the game list should be a new article, perhaps even category, so I favor the latter (category), but a list article could still work. Perhaps I could go creating articles for some of the red links... --Illyria05-- 19:23, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
Whether as a list or a category, I think it should be split off as well. There's more list than article at the moment. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 01:38, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
I'm amenable to a solution which manages to keep the references on the games actually being whatever UE version they claim around; that's still my primary concern. If that's dealt with, I'm (still, as much as I was a month ago) amenable to this. Nysin 07:34, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
I support splitting the list off and putting a link to it from the article. --Muna 12:30, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Can someone check this GamaSutra ref?

I did a search for info on Sweeney stating that UE3 was to be sustainable to 2010, and I'm wondering if this article at GamaSutra is applicable. My workplace proxy blocks their site, for obvious reasons. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 19:29, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Nope, that doesn't make a reference to that statement. --Sanjay12 19:53, 29 October 2006 (UTC)
OK. It was the only thing that offered any citable evidence of the statement. If there is a video of the GDC that could be referenced, it'll go a long way to providing a good citation. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 18:57, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Reverted User:3d engineer's recent changes.

One more time... THERE IS NO UNREAL ENGINE 1.5. The last UE1 release is 436. End of discussion. And UE2.5 ended with 3371, which released and fixed support for the Logitech keyboard (G5?) with the display on it. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 21:24, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

3371 is not being. when is the 3371? UT2004(UE2.5) final patch is a 3369 ok?

Unreal 1(UE1) = 226 Unreal Tournament(UE1.5) = 300~436 Unreal Warfare(UE2) = 500~927 Unreal Engine 2(UE2) = 1107~2227 Unreal Tournament 2004(UE2.5) = 2500~3369 Unreal Engine 3(UE3) = 3500~current version of the build 4606. (Gears of War using build 4503) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 3d engineer (talk • contribs).

What part of WP:NOR do you not understand? No original research is the start and end of this discussion. Epic does not acknowledge an Unreal Engine 1.5, nor an Unreal Warfare build. The only officially recognized versions are 1, 2, 2.X (XBox build of UE2), 2.5 and 3. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 04:35, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

UE1(Unreal 1 codebase) UE1.5(Unreal Tournament codebase) http://unreal.epicgames.com/Bugs.htm Next Patch Status There will be another Unreal 1 patch. It will contain fixes for the bugs reported. By popular demand, our focus on future Unreal 1 patches will be making bug fixes and small, incremental improvements. So, we've split off the Unreal 1 codebase from the Unreal Tournament codebase, and won't be major new features added to the Unreal 1 codebase, just fixes.

We don't have a date for the next patch, but we expect to have it in the next few weeks. The version number will be 225.

So, we've split off the Unreal 1 codebase from the Unreal Tournament codebase, and won't be major new features added to the Unreal 1 codebase, just fixes

Unreal 1 codebase is not decal system and new fast renderer, UT codebase is a vast improving

Once again, it does NOT call it Unreal Engine 1.5. It's still UE1, albeit with a new renderer. As far as Epic's official versions of the engine, there's no UE 1.5. Please cite where Epic calls it UE 1.5 before putting it into the article. Thanks. Torinir ( Ding my phone My support calls E-Support Options ) 19:05, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
Hey, Torinir, I have seen some game pages on Wikipedia that say they are using UE1.5 as their engine, should I change it to say UE1, UE1.0, or what? --Illyria05-- 21:11, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Unico Master 15's vandalism

Unico Master has contributed some error correction, but I notice that he has actually removed references. Maybe someone should do something about this? RobertHeadley 12:39, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

ok, reverted the changes. Fixing the one typo that I see Unico Master changed. RobertHeadley 12:42, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Platforms: +PSP?

Since Brother in Arms: D Day is a PSP game using Unreal Engine, shouldn't we add PSP to the list of the platforms? --83.237.202.105 22:06, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Interesting Info. Possible Add.

Tim Sweeny, the maker of ZZT, Also helped in creating the first Unreal Engine. I found that out online, Hercules meets Tim Sweeny -- Interactive Fantasies, a ZZT "company" fan base for the now abandonware/freeware of ZZT. --Nerketur 20:21, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

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