Talk:The Victors
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[edit] Parody
Response to Pentawing: Restored parody. It's traditional, all right, and part of the school's history. This was being sung in the dorms (East Quad, West Quad) 1979-84; confirmed by alums as having ben sung in the 50s. And I have two degrees from Michigan, thanks. Adamdavis
- Do you have a source for that? Otherwise, it will/might be considered vandalism (which the UM and associated articles have experienced, especially at the hands of Ohio State and Michigan State supporters). Hence, I have decided to move the passage here until some sort of reference can be found.
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- A parody of the lyrics exist since the 1950s. It had been sung in UM residence halls, such as East Quad and West Quad, from 1979 to 1984.
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- Traditional Parody
- Hail! to the victims valiant
- Hail! to the conquered heroes
- Hail! Hail! to Michigan
- the doormats of the west
- Traditional Parody
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- I think you're being a bit overprotective of the alma mater here; it's an encyclopedia article, and parodies of a school song that were part of the school lore would seem to me to be appropriate. Perhaps it should have a header "folklore", as many sections for colleges and universities do? Like most folklore, it left few documentary traces (for example, it would be very hard to establish that "progressive" parties were part of the dorm culture at Michigan in the 70s and 80s, though they assuredly were). But rather than engage in an edit-war, I'll let others decide if they think a parody properly belongs as part of the article, as parodies are included in the article on "Battle Hymn of the Republic" Adamdavis 03:29, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
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- With your suggesting to place the parody under "folklore," maybe it will work. However, the wording has to reflect that (in order to prevent the idea that the parody, if added, is vandalism). Also, it would probably be a good idea to explain why such lyrics were sung, when someone outside UM believes that most, if not all, people from UM are rabid partisans (personally, I never heard the parody lyrics on campus). PentawingTalk 04:18, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
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- I think you're being a bit overprotective of the alma mater here; it's an encyclopedia article, and parodies of a school song that were part of the school lore would seem to me to be appropriate. Perhaps it should have a header "folklore", as many sections for colleges and universities do? Like most folklore, it left few documentary traces (for example, it would be very hard to establish that "progressive" parties were part of the dorm culture at Michigan in the 70s and 80s, though they assuredly were). But rather than engage in an edit-war, I'll let others decide if they think a parody properly belongs as part of the article, as parodies are included in the article on "Battle Hymn of the Republic" Adamdavis 03:29, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
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- In the meantime, I have also moved the following passage as I am unable to prove it at this time.
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- The Victors is also the only fight song in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame.
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[edit] Tune
The melody of the fight song is very similar to the trio section from The Spirit of Liberty March. (not Hail to the Spirit of Liberty by Sousa) This march appears on the Karussells of Europe recording. At one point, the University of Michigan article had a note that it was George (Geo) Rosey's and was copyrighted earlier in 1898. However, I can find no corroborating data, including searching the Library of Congress.
[edit] Champions of the West
These states constituted the former Northwest Territory: Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Michigan, Wisconsin, and Minnesota. Is not somewhat probable that -- "Champions of the NorthWest" simply wouldn't scan, and was shortened by the songwriter to "West"? 66.65.76.15 21:25, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
- No. The Big Ten Conference was long unofficially known as the "Western Conference." Funnyhat 02:50, 17 November 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Sousa Claim
I am wondering about the claim that sousa stated The Victors was the greatest college fight song. I have seen this in numerous places stating that he said this about On Wisconsin. A google search shows pretty much 50/50 either way. Is the quote provided in any context in the prowler or is just the standard "Sousa said it was the best" remark that I see everywhere? If the latter is the case, it should probably be removed from the article. --Dbackes 16:11, 20 March 2007 (UTC)
