Talk:The Times

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Good Job
"In the entry for The Times, for instance, you can read a cogent history from 1785 to the compact's launch, with a commendably neutral commentary and brief biographies of editors past and present." — The Times, July 20, 2004

Contents

[edit] "Newspaper of record"

Have deleted statement that it is "preserved in the British Library's newspaper library in that capacity". It has no special status amongst all the other newspapers in the library <http://www.bl.uk/collections/newspapers.html>. Devoxo 12:45, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

" It was purchased by Rupert Murdoch's News International in 1981. The Sun, being part of the same stable (having once featured a topless model on page three), the first News International Times featured a full-page Spirit of Ecstacy Rolls-Royce advertisment on page three."

Seems to be a grammatical error or something, that sentence doesn't make sense to me.

The Times is not so easily categorised as reflecting the conservative views of its proprietor, Rupert Murdoch. In its general worldview it certainly reflects his economic conservatism, but in terms of British politics it has supported Tony Blair and New Labour at the last two elections. This may be a reflection of the extent to which, under Blair, the Labour Party has drifted to the right, or it may reflect Mr Murdoch's desire always to be on the winning side. Either way it is becoming increasingly known in national political circles as being the in-house journal of New Labour.

[edit] "Tabloid"

As far as I know one can still choose to buy The Times standard broadsheet size. The 'compact' edition hasn't yet replaced it altogether.

It has, as of 1st November 2004. You might be thinking of the Sunday edition, The Sunday Times, which remains broadsheet. As far as I am concerned, the broadsheet is a sad loss. The Times is still a good paper, but has so less authority as a tabloid. From a commercial point of view, however, you can't argue with Murdoch's decision. All of the old Times correspondents are there, which means he only lost around 15,000 readers to the Telegraph. Personally I read The Times, Telegraph, Guardian and FT, and out of those, I think that the FT is the best quality with the other 3 about the same.--Mrclarke 17:02, 3 Jan 2005 (UTC)

[edit] "owned by Rupert Murdoch"

Actually, The Times is owned by Rupert Murdoch, Stan Zegel, and several (million) other shareholders. While Mr. Murdoch may own more shares than me, I own more than some others. It would be just as accurate to say it is "owned by Stan Zegel" but even more accurate to say it is "owned by News Corporation, headed by Rupert Murdoch."--StanZegel 05:10, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Somthing about the typeface would be nice.

Rich Farmbrough 14:44, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Yes--I'd like to know what typeface they are using now that they aren't using Times New Roman; I can't seem to find this information anywhere. Rdr0 21:09, 18 December 2005 (UTC)

TNR, designed by Stanley Morrison I think, was only used for a year, 1931-32, and was replaced by Europa. Not sure if this is still is being used since the newspaper turned "compact". I think these details inclusion would be comparatively trivial while the article is still at the embryonic stage, comparatively speaking. Philip Cross 21:55, 18 December 2005 (UTC)

They are using a variant called "Times Classic" which has been bespoke designed for them and not released for general sale. Haddocky 09:47, 19 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] "Quality"

I disagree that the term "quality" is appropriate without qualification in the opening sentence. ABC is not a repository of standard English, and to me the term "quality newspaper" means "a newspaper of high quality". It is certainly debatable that the Times is of high quality (personally I'd say that its quality has suffered a steep decline during Murdoch's reign and that it is a mediocre publication nowadays). In the interests of NPOV, I will therefore excise this word from the opening sentence again in a few days time unless I am convinced that this is a bad move. Lupin 15:11, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The Times is a quality newspaper in the same way that The Guardian, Financial Times and Daily Telegraph are quality newspapers. ABC are responsible for classification of newspapers - i.e. it would be appropriate to write 'The Sun is a national popular daily' or 'The Express is a national middle-market daily'. What is POV is to remove an appropriate piece of classification. Perhaps later in the article there could be a clarification. However, we have to remember that in comparison with other publications, The Times is clearly one of the highest quality publications. --Mrclarke 16:02, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)
If we are to use the word quality, it must be crystal clear that this is a piece of industry jargon and we must make reference to the ABC when doing so, to avoid this word being misconstrued. How about moving the word quality to later in the article, where we could say "According to the ABC classification, The Times is a quality newspaper" or something similar.
I also find myself unable to agree with your statment that "in comparison with other publications, The Times is clearly one of the highest quality publications". This is a subjective statement which is certainly debatable (and cannot be objectively verified). Lupin 16:17, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)
What about saying 'The Times is a British compact newspaper' at the start, and mentioning the ABC classification like you said later in the article. The word 'compact' has some upmarket implications without expressing any opinion whatsoever. (Out of interest, which newspapers do you think are higher quality than the Times? I'd agree on the FT and perhaps The Guardian but not the Telegraph / Indy and certainly not the Mail/Express/Sun/Mirror/Star) --Mrclarke 07:21, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I approve of your proposal - describing it as compact is objective. I prefer the Guardian myself and rarely read other papers (besides which I don't read them any more as I'm no longer living in the UK). So perhaps I'm not the best person to make these subjective statements -- my point was really that such (apparent) subjectivity doesn't belong in the articles anyway. Lupin 18:30, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Done. (Anyway, I must admit it was better when it was a broadsheet) --Mrclarke 16:37, 11 Apr 2005 (UTC)

[edit] List of the 100 most powerful people 2005

Wikipedia have it ??? where ?

here is just a part...


I'm fascinated. Gordon Brown is more powerful than Tony Blair, eh? And Barack Obma outweighs Vladimir Putin...

[edit] Times New Roman

On the Monotype / Linotype question, I am fairly sure that the relevant company is Linotype (whose machines could produce a whole line of type at a time - important for high speed newspaper production) but the history of the two companies is a bit intertwined and confusing.

One thing I am sure of is that The Times was instrumental in the development of the typeface and the key designer was employed directly by The Times

[edit] Times Digital Archive

Note the 'Times Digital Archive' from 1795-1985 is online and available by subscription. Many local authorities in the UK have subscribed to the archive for their public libraries and ayone in possesion of a library card can access the archive from the comfort of their own home. Jooler 11:09, 4 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Centrist, Centre-right, or Right-wing

Until the 10th September, The Times was classified as centre-right, when it was changed by Bergenhaus to centre. I think that, overall, it is centre-right, so have reverted the change. (By the way, I mistakenly pressed "save page" too early - I meant my edit-comment to be "The Times is not centrist overall - it is centre-right".) Ojcookies 04:07, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

I agree. The Times definitely is a centre-right newspaper, and I would say its editorials very much reflect this.
-- (A.szczep) 17:45, 12 September 2006 (UTC)
The Times tend to be as critical with the Conservative Party policies as with the current government under Labour. Also, the Times ::has actually openly supported the Labour party in the last general elections since 1997 - and Labour is centre-left. So I think that ::it would be more accurate to say that the Times hold a centrist position. Monsumo

[edit] continantal sports columnist

guillem balague writes for the times, i included him in th list at the bottom.


[edit] E.S. Dallas

The addition of E.S. Dallas's three years as a "special correspondent" for The Times isn't really significant in the newspaper's history. Given that the only other journalist mentioned in this section is W.H. Russell, the first dedicated war correspondent, Dallas would have to have achieved something very special to warrant a mention. I will remove the addition tomorrow unless someone can produce evidence of his historical significance. (There is scant evidence of this in the Wikipedia stub on him. He appears to be known principally for having written for The Times.) Le poulet noir 21:57, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

Actually, I agree with you and will remove the reference to E. S. Dallas. I was looking for a way to reverese link The Times with E. S. Dallas and came up with this insertion. Perhaps what is needed is a seperate article listing like Journalists of The Times? In other words, a place where we could reverse link articles about journalists indirectly with the main article of Tne Times. Aletheia 16:47, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

I was going to suggest a separate section (or, possibly, a separate entry) myself. It would be useful to find a bank of worthy names to help get it started. Any suggestions, anyone? Le poulet noir 19:24, 25 October 2006 (UTC)


[edit] ..."Come to stress Murdoch's 'neo-conservative' views"

This comment is not backed up by the cited source [1]. It claims that Murdoch interfered with the editorial line in the early days, and it claimed that the Sunday Times had a Pro-Conservative editorial line imposed upon it. The comment relates to the Sunday Times, Pro-Conservative is very different to NeoConservative, One cannot infer from the actions of Mr Murdoch in the past what his actions of the present may be. As such the comment is un-encyclopedic and reflects a POV. --Chopz 18:30, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Privatized or Subsidized?

This is a question that I was just wondering in my AP Politics class. Is The Times subsidized by the British government, after the free market reforms of Thatcher, or is it privatized? Vagrant

The Times is not, and never has been, subsidised by any government. No national or regional newspapers in Britain are subsidised by the Government. You seem to be confusing Britain with the Soviet Union and The Times with Pravda. Le poulet noir 15:30, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

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