Talk:Tefillin

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[edit] Kissing

will someone explain whether you are supposed to kiss the boxes after taking them off?

It's a custom, not a law. Jayjg (talk) 22:56, 10 May 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Picture

The fist pictures should be changed, as it appears that the retzuot are touching on the arm, pasooling it.

The photos link does not work.

[edit] Tag

I can't get the damn wikify tag to work in the section "How to put them on". Does anyone know how to fix this? ZPMMaker 11:21, 6 November 2005 (UTC)

Don't worry, I've fixed it now ZPMMaker 11:46, 6 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Rework Needed

The current page is incorrect. Tefillin *are* a form of phylacteries, they are not "called" phylacteries. The actual name is "totafos", "tefillin" was made up later. Rashbam and Ibn Ezra do not state what they are quoted to say, Rashbam says it is allegorical according to the "deep simplicity" and Ibn Ezra quotes such an opinion and *rejects* it. Tefillin are written in ashuris, not Assyrian, and so on. The current article is simply incorrect and needs heavy editting, but probably needs to be rewritten completely using its current form as only points to cover. My edits are in the history (and rejected). -- Chacham 16:32 Nov 11 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Counting Straps

I removed the part about counting the straps after putting them on. They are not law, or custom. The person who put the part back in is misunderstanding my edit. I never said you don't need the seven straps (I never edited that part), I just took out the part that says you need to count the seven straps after wrapping. -Yossiea 14:54, 16 November 2005 (UTC)

Try learning before you actually assert whether something is law/custom or not.

Shulchan Aruch, Part 1 Orach Chayim, Chapter 3: "It is customary to pass the strap through a small loop at one end of the passage and wind it seven times around the arm and three times around the middle finger" (27:8) SF2K1 18:30, 16 November 2005 (UTC)

This says nothing about counting the straps while reciting a verse from Deuteronomy, but simply says that the straps are wound 7 times. Can you respond to Yossiea's objection? Jayjg (talk) 21:46, 17 November 2005 (UTC)
Really now, think. The passage is said, and the straps are to be wound. He's claiming that there's no precedent for the straps being wound for any certain number of times. You're supposed to wind, while reciting. Right in the S"A it's saying exactly how many winds there should be while you're winding. True, this doesn't say that you should count seven, but it is implied when it says they have to be wound seven times on the arm. SF2K1 06:59, 18 November 2005 (UTC)
The article says that the straps are counted and a verse recited after the hand windings are already done. Please respond to that point exactly - what is the source for this claim? Jayjg (talk) 18:42, 21 November 2005 (UTC)
Umm if it says count after, then that's not right. It should be moved then, not removed. Like I pointed out, the Shulchan Aruch calls for 7 winds on the arm (which obviously needs to be counted while performing), but the verse is still recited once the straps have been wrapped around. SF2K1

[edit] Windings

How can you possibly do the finger winding before the arm winding?Benami

You can't... If it says that, it's a mistake. SF2K1
That's what you changed it to say! And that's what people have been objecting to this whole time, and what you have been reverting to this whole time! Jayjg (talk) 21:01, 24 November 2005 (UTC)

I changed the entry to read: "The strap that is passed through the hand-tefillin should be long enough to allow for the knot, then to wrap around the forearm 7 times, and around the hand according to family or location tradtion. A Rabbi should be consulted about the proper way the tefillin to be worn accorrding to one's herritage. "

From what I learned this Shabbos, Ashkinazi and Sephardi wrap the hand differently. The finger winding too can vary between area within these general domains.


[edit] look here for some good information:

Tefillin Beit E-l They have got some really cool movies on how Tefillin are made and lots of practical information about Tefillin.

What are the halachos for tfillin

[edit] Mezuzah and Teffilin

I added that, "Deuteronomy 6:4-9 and 11:13-21 are two passages used for Mezuzah." Ira (Eliyahu) 09/11/06 1:26pm EST

[edit] dashes

User:204.52.215.102 (IP from Rutgers University) seems to feel very strongly that "Adonai" should be written "Ad-onai" with the edit summary of "Added dashes to names of G-d in accordance with Jewish practice". Since when are wikipedia articles written in accordance with Jewish practice. And in any event puting dashes in God's name is far from universally accepted even in Judaism! Jon513 17:35, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tefillin and Magic

I believe this section of the article is supposed to have footnotes. It does not. I believe this section of the article is unverafiable unless proven otherwise.

The section was greatly expanded by user:Feivelstrauss (talk • contribs • logs • block user • block log), and I think that most of it is unsourced original research. I have reverted it to the original, but I I hope that those part of the section that were worthwhile will be added again with sources. Jon513 14:18, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
I would even go so far as deleting the whole section. Yossiea 14:21, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
It's not original research, it's from the Jewish Encyclopedia of ca. 1904 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 69.203.64.233 (talk) 01:33, 2 April 2007 (UTC).
I was referring to this edit not the original text Jon513 19:32, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Forms of wrapping for the hand

BS"D

It would be an interesting change to write the different ways that tefillin are worn on the hand and at the top of the arm. We could do a section like on the Payos Page. --Shuli 02:04, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

  • I don't think so. I think it is beyond the scope of the article to have some bullet points on how some groups wrap the hand. Yossiea 20:11, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
In addition, the facts are not 100% correct, the wording is not encyclopedic, and again, I think it detracts from the article. This is something that would be posted in a yeshiva newsletter, I don't think we need it in an encyclopedia entry. Perhaps we should put it to a vote, but in my opinion, the entry takes the entire article from a well written one to a horrible one. Yossiea (talk) 15:02, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Forms of wrapping for the hand

I prefer for the picture of Bob to remain anonymous. This is not an article about Dylan only about how Jews use tefillin. The picture of Bob is just an example of this. Benqish 16:41, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

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