Talk:Szabla

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Contents 1 Szabla = saber? 2 Captions to translate 3 Etymology 4 Image

[edit] Szabla = saber?

"It had a curved blade and was carried in a scabbard."

Well, just like every other sabre. What is the point of this article? Little information is added to the general subject. The Cosssacks had their own form of sabre, as had the Mamluks, the Turks, and so forth. What makes the Polish one so special that it needs its own entry?

This is Wiki. If sb has enough info on non-Polish sabres to create an article about it, more power to them. As I know there are books, articles and webpages dedicated to Polish sabre - the szabla - I feel there is enough info to warrant a separate entry in Wiki. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus ^Talk 09:40, 16 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Sorry, but I think your reply misses the point. There are generalities in this article already covered under the Sabre entry , in addition to the ones mentioned e.g. a cavalry melee weapon; and also an outright error -- which indeed took its name from a German word for "hacking" or "cutting". That German word should be "schlachten", which means "to slaughter". I doubt it has any etymological connection to Szlachcic - and if, it would hardly be a flattering one for the Polish nobles. Finally, the illustration shows a medieval sword, which does not fit the subject. This is Wiki -- well yes it is, but articles should be of interest and value to the general public, should they not?

Dear anon. First, as it looks like you are interested in this subject and wiki, please register, it will ease our talk (and give you more tools for editing purposes). I took the liberty of formatting your replies (merging tiny paras) so it looks more like normal wiki talk, I hope you don't mind. Now, to answer your questions. This article is a stub, and a poor one at that - I will grant you this. It needs expantion, and possibly a correction of erros you mention. I admit I have no read about the etymology of the word, and there was a similar discussion on Talk:Szlachta#The_Etymology which eventually ended with removal of German-origin etymology from main. Now the best thing I'd agree would be to copy all info from there to sabre - which is also a stub, as you can see - and expand the sabre article with info from all related subarticles, until it is no longer a stub. Feel free to do so (Wikipedia:Be bold), but as I said earlier I'd strongly advice you to register first, before making major edits - it will help both you and us. However I'd recommend leaving this stub (szabla) as it is, in hope that sooner or later somebody (maybe me, when I have some time) will expand this with more info (for example, from Polish wikipedia - see pl:szabla)). Finally, the pic is a sword, and thus not entirely correct, but it is better then no pic - at least it gives the brief names of the general melee weapon parts. I'd much prefer for somebody to translate the szabla-specific pic from Polish wiki. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus ^Talk 19:00, 16 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Frankly speaking, I would generally support either a move to some less Polish-specific title (Polish sabre, prerhaps?), or simply to merge it with the article on sabre. As a matter of fact, though the Polish (and Cossack, since it was the same type of sabre) sabre had some peculiarities and was an important step in the evolution of cold steel arms, it was nothing but just that: a step in the evolution of the sabre. As for now I'll simply expand this pretty little article and leave the decision to others.

As to other questions, "the German word" from which the szlachta derived its name is not schlachten but geschlecht (in mediaeval meaning of the word, from Old High German gislahti meaning more or less genre or kin). Which is quite a different thing. Halibutt 23:09, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

It is not just a step in the evolution of the saber; it's also the symbol of the Polish noble class. By the above logic, the article on Katana should be merged into the article on Chinese swords, because they're nothing but a development, or "a step in the evolution," of Chinese cavalry swords. Except that they were also the symbol of the Japanese warrior class and had, and have, a major place in Japanese culture. Though I wouldn't say szabla are quite that significant to the Poles, they're certainly more than a type of saber. Nagakura shin8 06:51, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Captions to translate

There are nice pics (like this) at Polish wiki version of this article, but my melee-weapnons military terminology is not good for theri translation :( Help needed. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus ^Talk 21:08, 5 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Etymology

Shouldnt etymology ultimatelly derive from the Hungarian szablya? (pronounced /sabja/) After all, Hungarian szablya can easily be derrived from Hungarian szab-;szabni (to cut). The same is listed on the article saber Druworos 15:27, 17 February 2006 (UTC)

Considering that szabla came from the Balkans, it is likely - but a reference would be nice.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus ^Talk 15:41, 17 February 2006 (UTC)

It is plainly stated in the article saber, in the first few lines. Though I have no idea where they got *their* references. Druworos 16:21, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Image

I am quite puzzled by the image. This is a French Navy officer sabre of the beginning of the 19th Century. It is plainly said on the description of the image, and I really wonder how one could say things like "Late 17th century szabla". I am removing the image. Rama 11:13, 20 February 2006 (UTC)