Talk:Survival kit

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[edit] Merge?

I think that it is VERY important that they are not merged. I like the distinction between the two and the differentiation "The focus on evacuation, rather than survival, distinguishes the bug-out bag from a survival kit." This helps people understand the purpose of different items in a kit. Bug-out kits, as in "All hell's broke loose, I have to bug out of here" are important in the case of natural disasters or civil unrest. I have BOBs packed and ready in my closet in the case of emergency that the family can grab from home and leave with. The contents of a BOB vs a SK should not influence the merging. It is the PURPOSE that matters, and something that the separation of the two entries makes clear right away. Anyway, people come here to understand, so simplicity and clarity is better. If you merge them and still call them SK and BOB, then one or the other is buried as is the different intent of each. See?

There is a distinction, but it's a one-way distinction. A bug-out bag IS a type of survuval kit, as is an auto emergency kit, or an earthquake kit, or a tornado kit, or a hurricane kit, or a bio-chemical accident/attack kit, or a Mormon's garage (see http://www.rickross.com/reference/mormon/mormon99.html AND http://www.1stconnect.com/anozira/SiteTops/storage/mormon52.htm for an explanation, if you're not familiar with that policy). The basic purpose of all of these is the same--to get the things you need to survive where and when you need them. Some elements will be common to most kits (essential medicines for example), some will be specialized (life raft, flare gun, dye markers), and some are controversial (firearms for defensive or hunting use). Every survival kit has a purpose, and this purpose will dictate what is or isn't included; even the general purpose kits you get from, say, the Red Cross have a specific purpose, which is to cover the widest range of applications for a given price point. The best way to point out both the commonalities and differences is, in my opinion, to have them all in the same place, with redirects pointing to the relevant sections for eacy entry. scot 15:05, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

Should survival kit be merged with bug-out bag? I have no strong opinion one way or the other, but it seems to me they're two different names for the same thing. KleenupKrew 23:00, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

To me they certainly could be merged. I'm unfamiliar with the term Bug-out bag (but familiar with the term Bug-out), especially to what size of bag/kit they typically refer. Once that stuff is sorted I'd be happy to support. Liberator 10:56, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

I now support this proposal, as for myself, the term 'survival kit' refers to both a household emergency survival kit, and a tramper's emergency survival kit. Upon merge, It would be good to say something such as "the terms bug-out bag and survival kit may refer to different sizes of equipment, depending on location" although reqording is almost certainly required. Liberator 12:06, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

A bug-out bag is essentially a survival kit, containing anywhere from a day's to a week's worth of supplies, food, emergency clothing and gear etc. I don't know if there is any difference beyond that, except a difference in who uses the two terms. KleenupKrew 20:41, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

I oppose this proposal. A survival kit's intended use is generally to survive in the wilderness while awaiting rescue following an accident or becoming lost. A bug-out bag has the specific purpose of assisting the bearer to relocate from a danger zone to a predetermined retreat location. These two kits share some similarities but since the intention of each is so different to the other I feel it would do each of them a disservice to merge the listings. Rather, I think survival kit should be enhanced so that it contains rationale for the inclusion of these items and details of their use. RichardArcher 03:16, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm going to go ahead and remove the merge tags. There was also a discussion on Talk:Bug-out bag that ran heavily opposed to merging the two. KleenupKrew 03:07, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Added some items to the list

A GPS was added next to compass. First aid kit was inserted in front of bandages. Added gerber_multitool behind swiss army knife. Added MRE behind canned foods. --21kev 18:17, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Merge, take two

Since 90% of the contents of the [[bug-out bag] article exists in this one as well, then either the remaining 10% needs to come over here in a merge, or the BOB content here needs to be removed. I propose a merge based on two points:

• A BOB may be the portable part of a survival kit, since there is significant overlap. Living in tornado alley, you may have a few minutes of warning to evacuate to a shelter, in which case you grab the BOB and run; or you may get NO warning and need to deal with the aftermath in place--a breakdown of infrastructure, such as loss of power, water, etc.
• With BOB and survival kit in separate articles, there is no good place to put a comparison/contrast between the two; it would lead to duplicate and potentially contradictory information in the different articles. scot 15:10, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

I found the Bug-Out Bag article linked to this by checking referring URLs to my site, a forum dedicated to survival and preparedness. One of my friends and a member on my forums linked my sample Bug-Out Bag article to the External Links area of the Bug-Out Bag entry (right under my nose no less). I think this article (and the other) are worthwhile entries to Wikipedia, but there seems to be a problem with folks not deeply and directly connected to the survival community trying to define and categorize some of these things and they should likely be merged. Survival Kits and Bug-Out Bags are essentially the same thing; a pack or other system of carrying a load of supplies and equipment to escape and evade danger. Functionally, there is little to no difference at all between the two. The difference in specific types of gear or accessories is determined by the user's environment and their plan to evacuate, not by what moniker they like to use for their 'bag'. Some folks will bug-out into the wilderness because that's all they can do in the face of impending danger or because it's what they know; others will bug-out to a secondary fixed location such as a relative or friend's house or a home in another part of the state/country. BoB's can range from a 2100ci backpack filled with water, first aid supplies, clothing and food to a 5000+ cubic inch pack filled with additional items such as shelter, fire-making materials, knives and tools and general supplies to live off of the land until the short-term emergency has subsided. Those of us in the current survival community generally make little distinction between a "survival Kit" and a "Bug-out Bag", and even offshoots of those such as "Get-Home Bags" and EDC (Every Day Carry) are all part of the total system (as in First Line, Second Line and Third Line gear). Emergency kits, 72-hour Kits/Bags, Bug-Out Bags, Survival Kits, Get-Home Bags and other such similar terms are used interchangeably, they're essentially the same things; equipment and supplies that can be taken mobile to escape, avoid or survive an emergency or disaster situation. Merging these topics makes sense as it will help to remove a distinction that few people that actually utilize these things ever truly make. --NineseveN 03:16, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

I have to make a slight point of disagreement. One situation where the terms are entirely not interchangeable is the survival kit carried on a tramper's person as a backup in the case of a lost pack/equipment. These essential sets of equipment are often much smaller than any self respecting bug-out bag, down to around 30-60ci (500-1000cc). The difference between a bug-out bad / survival kit in this case is the original intention of the kit, which although in essence the same, are very different. With that said, I'm not entirely against a merge as long as that sort of information in included in the merge. Liberator 09:37, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

But even the small survival mini-kits are often components of the larger kits and bags, to segregate them and then also blur the differences between them is like having 5 different articles on water bottles based on the size of each bottle and whether or not people normally drink juice from one or the other. I'm not proposing that the idea of the mini-survival kit be swallowed whole and dismissed, just that any differences between the two (and other terms) as far as size and contents should be either be compared in one article or that each separate article shouldn’t be so blurry around the edges. As it stands now, the Survival Kit article mentions that it can also be a bug-out bag in the ”Other Meaning” section, but then goes off to state that Bug-out Bags are put into trucks or vans loaded with hundreds of pounds of wheat and rice? I’ve met and/or spoken with easily thousands of modern survivalists, I’ve never heard of this. Perhaps the Survival kit article needs a rewrite to focus on what you’re trying to say that it is, a mini-kit with essential emergency articles that can be housed in an Alotids tin or a small pouch and is sometimes a component of a larger bug-out bags (with a link to the Bug-out Bag article). If that’s the case, then the stuff about bug-out bags needs to be removed, let the BoB article define what that one is. I could rewrite it (I basically already have as a natural course of defining discussions for my site), but again, I'm new here and I don't want to come off like what I have to say is more valid than someone else's comments just because I run a website. --NineseveN 20:56, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

I think the point that both of you make is that survival kits cover a wide continuum. Arguably, they range from something small enough to be kept in the pocket--an EpiPen or asthma inhaler is certainly a form of survival kit, and you could argue that a pocket tool is as well--up to the entirity of the Cheyenne Mountain facility. The very fact that there is a continuum means that any distinctions are going to be arbitrary and blurry, and I think that the best way to point that out would be by covering the entire spectrum in one article, and noting the general distinctions of the subvariants. scot 21:33, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

I feel they both need expansion a bob and a survival kit are two very separate things