Talk:Stolen base
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[edit] 2004 ALCS example
I fail to see the extrene significance of this stolen base such that it should be singled out and explained in detail here. Boston's comeback in the series was remarkable but it seems unlikely that one stolen base was the difference. I am removing it; discuss here before reverting. --feitclub 15:49, Jun 16, 2005 (UTC)
No argument from me. The 2004 ALCS is hardly a milestone in the history of the stolen base (though perhaps the other way around), and thus the anecdote detracts from the article's universality. It was apparently inserted on 7 May by 4.224.195.116, and subsequent revisers like me simply edited rather than remove vestigial paragraphs. I wouldn't mind seeing the Germany Schaefer anecdote go away as well, or at least be trimmed significantly. --Tisco 20:02, 17 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I removed the link to that series as well. Was wondering what it was doing here. Doctofunk 21:08, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Germany Schaefer
I added the second anecdote about Schaefer stealing 1st. Funny stories. Its too bad no one is that daring anymore. But back on topic! I'm wondering if my story, which I got from Cobb's autobiography, isn't the same story as in the first instance. Its sort of coincedental that Davey Jones was on third both times, I think. I mean, Schaefer was clearly a nut but what are the chances of Jones being on third both times? Also, would Honus Wagner be a better example of dead-ball base stealers than Clyde Milan? I'd never even heard of Milan before and Wagner stole upwards of 250 more bases in his career than Milan did. Just my opinion though. --mgm41887 18 Jun 2005
That's my suspicion about the Schaefer story also. If you want to fix it, maybe doing some research to get the story right, that would be great. A more streamlined version of that paragraph would be less objectionable. I created a stub for Milan, which may make it more clear why I mentioned him. Wagner would also be a fine example, though his single-season totals were not as high. --Tisco 15:40, 20 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Unfortunately I don't know who put in the first Schaefer story, so I really can't be sure if they're the same story, but honestly, what are the odds that Davey Jones would be the runner both times? How many times could Schaefer possibly have been in that situation? One instance of Schaefer stealing first should be enough and I got mine right out of Cobb's autobiography, so if you want to take either one out, I won't have any problem. Also, should some mention maybe be made of Scott Podsednik as an up and coming base-stealer? He's sort of reviving the art of stealing a ton of bases. I know the White Sox are mentioned as a team, but who else on the team steals bases en masse like Podsednik? --mgm41887 1:55 12 Jul 2005
I took out Germany altogether, leaving the story in general terms only. If you want to replace the particular characters from your book, I wouldn't object. I also revamped the "small ball" paragraph, not that my version needs to be final. My opinion is that it's probably best not to write too much about current players, but to wait until we have the perspective of history. --Tisco 15:47, 12 July 2005 (UTC)
I agree about both Schaefer and Podsednik. Give Podsednik a few years at least to see if he remains consistent. Schaefer is a barely known, but interesting, character in baseball history and since stealing first base has been illegal for about 85 years because of his antics, it really isn't even relevant any more. Oh, and if you are a fan of baseball from the Dead Ball era and Ty Cobb in general, his book is great, and if you don't believe his story, check Al Stump's version. It truly is a wealth of information. Mgm41887 06:20, 14 July 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Count 500
I read somewhere, but can't find it on his page (or here), that Joe Morgan was first player to HR 200 & steal 500. Can somebody confirm? Trekphiler 08:53, 26 December 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Stop, thief!
I read somewhere Eddie Cuthbert (Philadelphia Keystones) stole the first base in pro ball, in 1863. Can somebody confirm? Trekphiler 10:35, 27 December 2005 (UTC)
- Cincinnati Red Stockings were the first professional baseball team in 1869, so what you say is impossible. However, this page [1] says that it happened in 1865. I see that the Keystones were pro by 1884, but they probably weren't in 1865. --Locarno 13:54, 27 April 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Throwing behind the runner
Perhaps there could be mention of this technique whereby the baserunner is picked off by the catcher rather than the pitcher. It is one of the dangers of taking a secondary lead.
- 69.33.45.186 00:28, 27 April 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Uncontested Steal
If you read the first paragraph of the article, you would not know that the runner is not credited with a steal if it's uncontested. This requires a scorekeeper's judgment, but if the pitcher and catcher make no attempt to throw out a runner who is stealing a base, then the runner is not credited with a stolen base (SB).Mack2 03:25, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
- I don't think this is right. If a steal is uncontested but the defense would have liked to have thrown him out, it is still recorded as a stolen base. For example, perhaps the catcher grips the ball poorly and cannot throw, or perhaps there is no chance to put out the runner so he doesn't even begin a throw--these are still stolen bases. It is only when the defense clearly doesn't care (scorer's judgment) about the stealing runner that the advance is scored as defensive indifference (DI) and not as a stolen base. From the rule book 10.08: "A stolen base shall be credited to a runner whenever he advances one base unaided by a hit, a putout, an error, a force-out, a fielder’s choice, a passed ball, a wild pitch or a balk, subject to the following: (g) No stolen base shall be scored when a runner advances solely because of the defensive team’s indifference to his advance." (emphasis mine) --Locarno 14:39, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Scoring the Dropped Third Strike
Perhaps the article could say a bit more about why a dropped-third would be scored as a 4-3 putout? Skids 15:27, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
- I believe that is someone who doesn't know what they're talking about. I'm removing it. DandyDan2007 00:41, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
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- Shouldn't it be a 2-3 putout, since the catcher must throw to 1B? Job L 07:52, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
