Talk:Star Trek: The Motion Picture

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[edit] Introduction

Isn't the nickname The Slow-Motion Picture and not The Motionless Picture? That's way I'd always heard it and I think it sounds better to be honest.Driller thriller 11:32, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

I've heard both nicknames, as well as The Emotionless Picture (a second derivative, no doubt). If it is significant, then add a paragraph about the nickname(s). Darcyj 09:49, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
I've always heard The Motionless Picture. Maybe it's a West-Coast/East-Coast thing? CFLeon 23:36, 10 August 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Harlan Ellison anecdote

I added Harlan Ellison's anecdote (I cited the source from Stephen King's re-telling in Danse Macbre; it's not original research on my part) about the writers of this movie, to an earlier version of this article, but somebody removed it. Why? It's not just a funny story, it's actually relevant to the evolution of the motion picture, I think. (The anecdote involved a brainstorming session between various Paramount executives and science fiction writers.) Should I re-add the information, or am I risking a revert war?

[edit] Nit-picky technical stuff.

I don't want to be too much of a nitpicker but, near the end of this entry, refering to the shipboard phasers not working at warp speeds, it says, "This is actually irrelevant, as the ship was traveling at warp speed at the time. Phasers, as recorded in TNG, do not work at warp speed, because they are based on phased light energy, i.e. only work at sublight speeds. The fact that they were cut off was irrelevant - even if they were powered, it still would not have worked. (There are odd occurrences in TNG, DS9 and Voyager where phasers are used during warp. These are likely simply canonical slips.)"

This is somewhat inaccurate as Phasers do work at warp speeds but their accuracy is significantly diminished. Per the "Star Trek: The Next Generation Technical Manual" shipboard phasers are only 25% accurate at warp speeds. Phasers have been used at warp speed at one time or another in every Star Trek series where shipboard phasers were available. [unsigned]

Also, the fact that they're in a wormhole means the ordinary rules needn't apply. They were certainly approaching that asteroid a lot slower than warp speed, or they would have been pulverized before they knew what they were going to hit. Either the asteroid was also moving at warp speed, or both it and the Enterprise were moving at sublight with respect to the wormhole's reference. Most likely both. [unsigned]

[edit] 82 AU is Fine With Me

Changing 82 AU to "2 AU" (easy to do since they just clip the audio of the "eighty") is just as bad a rewrite violation as "Greedo shot first". Although the cloud couldn't "fit" in the solar system since it was as big as the whole solar system (and far larger than the inner solar system), to paraphrase McCoy, "It's a cloud, dammit!" It doesn't have to fit at all. Indeed, a star "entering" the cloud as the cloud approached would have been a magnificent sight.

And maybe it's the terminal geek in me, but "Twelfth power!" should mean something, and a reduction from 82AU to 2AU is a 1681-fold reduction in power output. The thing was supposed to be the ultimate technology possible in this universe -- all knowledge, all that is knowable. Don't kick a good V-ger when it's down just because some other, lesser geek is confused. [unsigned]

[edit] In Defense of Stimp

I'm one of those fans who loved this one. One of the best things about ST:TMP is that it refused to give in to the urge to copy Star Wars, which was still a recent movie (1977, two years previous). Rather than making it more action and space-battle oriented, they insisted on a philosophical and deeply thoughtful movie. I was born in the same month that ST:TMP came out, and so I never saw it in the theater, but my parents say it was a wonderful experience to see new ST footage after more than a decade. The reason for the long shuttle ride is simple: we are coming home to a place we've missed, and that deserves a little time and a lingering look. There's a little bit of Kirk's longing in there, and also a little bit of the studio's triumph at finally resurrecting the series NBC killed, and if you ask me, they deserve their moment of "whoopee!". I'll admit that the movie could have stood some cutting to bring it down a bit in time, but it has some of the most important footage I've ever seen in a ST episode or movie, and some of the best visuals. It was also the first time the world heard Jerry Goldsmith's masterful Star Trek theme, which has become as, if not more, recognizable and popular than Alexander Courage's theme, giving a musical "face" to the franchise. Most importantly (to me), Spock's scene in sickbay, grasping Kirk's hand and talking about "this simple feeling", is a massive step in his character's development. All problems aside - goofy outfits, lackluster performance from Stephen Collins, plot partially ripped off from "The Changeling" - it's a movie that no Trek fan should dismiss lightly, filled with issues that are still unanswered today. Kasreyn 01:50, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Motionless Picture?

Aren't we getting a bit POV there? I don't mind the mention of the fan ribbing, but it shouldn't be in 1st para. Moving. Kasreyn 09:25, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] spoiler

I copyedited this article several days ago, and when I did I removed the spoiler template. I have since then gone through articles and removed superfulous spoiler templates from them as I explain next, but have now stopped as me and another user revamp the spoiler guidlines. In the meantime however, my rationale for removing the template (and I'm sorry that even for your life you couldn't realize this (I'll AGF that you weren't being tripe with me)) was that the sections header clearly says "Plot Summary"...the spoiler template directly underneath it says, "Plot and/or endings follow". They clearly mean the same thing, and are redundant. I have stopped removing the template for know, but since I had already taken it off before I stopped, I'm not going to watch all of them be restored without my commenting and defending my actions. Am reverting back to my version. If you don't think that Plot details and Plot summary are the same thing....then I suggest you look in a dictionary. Chuck(척뉴넘) 00:07, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

My understanding of the spoiler tag was that it didn't matter what was said above it; a spoiler tag was needed wherever spoilers might be divulged, and that the purpose was to have a standardized warning. With a standardized warning, readers are more likely to recognize the warning and avoid being spoiled. I didn't pay any attention to it saying "Plot Summary" above because I don't think it matters. If my understanding was incorrect, fine. I didn't restore it as some sort of personal attack on you, since I had no idea who had removed it. Nothing in Wikipedia's page on using the spoiler tag says anything about not using it if some of the words in the tag are duplicated in a nearby section heading. Kasreyn 01:05, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
Yeah, there's actually not much on Wikipedia about the spoiler's specific use, which is why I'm working on a proposal for specific guidelines. Chuck(척뉴넘) 05:47, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
Good. Let me know what you come up with, ok? Kasreyn 22:00, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Citation Schmitation

Someone has sprinkled so many Citation Needed templates in this article, that like houses and hotels in a Monopoly set they are probably close to running out. Is this (the sprinkling) the work of a vandal, or an anti-Trekkie, or is the article really so poor in substance? Darcyj 09:52, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

The tags are a good thing, in my opinion. Usually they spur editors to go find sources. Kasreyn 13:38, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
Wow, I just noticed this discussion. I added the templates when I copyedited this article a bit ago. I am a die-hard Star Trek fan, and definately not a vandal. I'm confused as to why you think they're not neccessary. I'm usually against superfulous, ugly, and unneeded templates, but I think this is a good way to get the sourced for some of these things, things which I've never heard before. I also don't understand the part about it lacking substance. The fact that it has citation needed tags doesn't mean that is lacks substance, rather that it lacks sources. Chuck(척뉴넘) 10:28, 19 May 2006 (UTC)
I went ahead and added citations for info that was in the ST:TMP "Making Of" book. Please don't ask for page numbers, the book is packed away. :) Krisorey 01:37, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Some sources added

I just made some imaginary sources sources up of appease the "citations needed everywhere crowd". Kidding of coarse. These all exist. However, I did find one to be really gratuitis. "The film's Academy Award nominated score was by Jerry Goldsmith. His theme to the film was later reworked as the theme for the Television series Star Trek: The Next Generation and was also reused in Star Trek V, Star Trek: First Contact, Star Trek: Insurrection, and Star Trek: Nemesis." I don't see why this would need to cite a source since it refers to the films in which Goldsmith's music is used already. [unsigned]

[edit] movie and interviews

I used the first source to mean the feature and the supp materials on the dvd. Someone can change them to two different (although same dvd set) sources. [unsigned]

[edit] Again with the Phasers

Decker says, "Sir, Enterprise redesign increases phaser power by channeling it through the main engines. When they went into antimatter imbalance, the phasers were automatically cut-off."

What this means to me is that there is some type of phaser power generator, the power then gets channeled through the main warp engines (which are always "on" even if not engaged...since it takes hours or days to restart an engine, we can assume they're always "running"), then out through the phaser emitter.

Decker's comment makes sense to me if the above explanation is correct. If we say the main engines are the "middle" of the process generating a phaser shot, then once that middle piece is inoperable, it's natural to assume the third piece wouldn't work either. Like having an assembly line break down in the middle.

So the above has NOTHING to do with whether or not the phasers work at warp speed. Just that the phaser emitters draw additional power (INCREASING it) through the warp engines.

We can also assume that Starfleet saw how stupid that was. In Star Trek II, with "just the battery" Scotty was able to provide "a few shots" of phaser fire.

It could also be that the engines in a SPECIFIC condition (antimatter imbalance) caused a SPECIFIC failsafe. Something unique about the imbalance perhaps caused a cut-off switch to activate.

Or maybe Decker's been working too hard. [unsigned]

  • It makes sense this way: The phaser power is increased by channelling it through the main engines. Ergo, a weaker phaser is likely possible without the help of the main engines, but probably requires some kind of by-pass to be initiated which would have taken time that they did not have to spare. Chekov would know full well that the phasers at that moment were cut off and would also have known how to set up a bypass to execute Kirk's order. Decker belays the phaser order to stop Chekov from trying to initiate a bypass, an action which would have taken too long (as would an explanation on the spot). In the Wrath of Khan situation, where the Enterprise is down to battery power only and Scotty suggests that he can provide "a few shots" from the phasers, it does not indicate any intervening redesign by Starfleet engineers but rather that the bypass might have been set up for that emergency. Darcyj 22:48, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Origins of the film - author

I made a simple change to the 4th paragraph in this section that is a bit more descriptive. I changed the reference to the author to read his full name, rather than just his last name. The old version read: "At this point, Foster was shut out of any work on the screenplay, and, despite ongoing problems with the developing script, his input was never solicited." The use of the author's last name is confusing, since he is only otherwise referenced in the info box. Some readers wont connect the dots.."Foster" doesn't necessarily mean squat to a casual reader. Hell, a casual reader wont necessarily know Alan Dean Foster from De'Shaun Foster. I changed the sentence to read the full name, with a link, so that things will read better. FYI - I forgot to log in when I made the change so only my IP appears. --Tbkflav 03:51, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

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