User talk:ScottDavis/Archive 9

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Talk archives for User:ScottDavis (current talk page)
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ASX 200 Companies

Hi there. I have noticed you are one of the editors of S&P/ASX 200. Its amazes me that a lot of those companies don't have articles! I just started a stub on Worleyparsons Limited, which is worth over $4b! So over the next few months, I'll be writing a few articles about some of these companies, and improving some, with a view to every ASX200 company at least having a stub to their name within the next couple of months.

If you'd like to help/know anyone else interested/would like to make a suggestion, feel free.

Have a nice day. THE KING 05:18, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

I've also thought it a problem. The archives of WP:AWNB will also show others have thought so too. Just that none of us have gotten around to researching to write the articles yet. I might have created one or two, and have fixed, improved or expanded a number of others. I've done a few improvements to your stub, and added some redirects, but know nothing at all about the company itself. I moved it to the naming convention's preferred name, which picked up some more links to it, too. You might like to add it to WP:NAA and see if anyone else wants to help too. --Scott Davis ^Talk 09:52, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

Yorkshire/North Yorkshire

I saw your comment in the discussion at Scarborough and thought you might find an explanation useful. Central government has taken decisions about the naming of places (for administrative purposes) which are resisted by the local people. North Yorkshire is officially correct, but local people feel affinity to Yorkshire as a whole. Also, the boundaries of London have been changed, and this has caused revert wars in a number of articles. I see you disambiguate links - I'd be happy to help any time with British geographical queries. CarolGray 10:02, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks Carol. There were a fair few wrong links to Scarborough (and may still be more) which is why I support moving the article away and putting the disambig page at the plain name. Appending a state name to the article name works well for all (except for a few well-known exceptions) Australian cities and towns. A few people keep arguing about that standard for the US (at Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (settlements)) and Canadian towns, and Canada had that standard and appears to be trying to move away from it for some cities.

The debate about North Yorkshire or Yorkshire as the suffix for the Scarborough article appears much simpler and more harmonious than the discussion that led to Bath, Somerset in December and Cork (city) not long before as there was no agreement on a geographic qualifier for Cork. From here it seems that "Yorkshire" is fairly well-defined and the boundaries haven't moved. It has been divided into smaller parts, but the division only happened once, and stayed that way. Bath appears to have swapped from Somerset to Avon to BANES, but remains in the ceremonial county of Somerset. Did I get it about right? --Scott Davis ^Talk 11:59, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

Yes, that's right.

Where an Australian/Canadian/American city is named after a relatively small and unimportant British town, putting a disambiguation page at the plain name is the most impartial solution. Other examples include Rochester, Wilmington, Stamford, Windsor and Perth.

Appending a county name works well most of the time for disambiguating British places, but some common village names occur more than once in a county. When I look at Sutton (disambiguation) I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

Don't be put off by my user page - this is where I keep track of what I wish I had time to do! CarolGray 13:28, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

There seem to be a fair few Australian places (in articles named Town, State) that have a dab link from an article at Town or Town (disambiguation). I (and I suspect you) would like to move most of these to unique names like Town, County and put the dab page in the place, but there seem to be a lot of people who believe "the first one should be the primary topic". It's a big job to move place articles and fix the links, as they tend to have lots of links. --Scott Davis ^Talk 13:44, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

ASX 200 Companies

If you'd like to help/know anyone else interested/would like to make a suggestion, feel free.

Have a nice day. THE KING 05:18, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

Major Party Leader tables on NSW election page

Hi , I was hoping you might be able to offer your opinion for the MPL issue on this page or this page. Cheers. Timeshift 16:32, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

Yorkshire/North Yorkshire

Yes, that's right.

Don't be put off by my user page - this is where I keep track of what I wish I had time to do! CarolGray 13:28, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

Coordinates

I was using Google Earth, I have wondered how accurate it is considering that water bodies and roads rarely correspond to the satellite images. Determining the centre of towns I'm not too familiar with is largely guesswork. The dm coordinates seem too far off for even Google Earth's inaccuracies, on the other hand the pre-supplied dms coordinates for protected areas are usually centred nicely. - Diceman 15:08, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

Leyland Brothers

I'm back, and have been on-wiki today, but I'm a little busy for the beginning of next week. I'll take a visit tomorrow though while I'm in the city to see what the local library holds. There's some images of Leyland Bros World here but no licence information, and I can't really make much sense of what type of website it is anyway. -- Longhair\^talk 11:37, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

Predab concerns

Thank you, Scott, for your extensive write-up. I can't help but notice, however, that the majority of the reasons you presented deal with the convenience of the editors. As an editor who extensively works with a disambiguation scheme that's exactly opposite of the one you describe, I assure you that none of the "inconveniences" you listed is a major concern. The problem, as I see it anyway, is not with the fact that "your" system is wrong and "mine" is right (or vice versa)—both can be used quite effectively when applied in a consistent manner—it is with the fact that both systems are basically incompatible while being used within the same frame (the whole of Wikipedia). Seeing that pre-disambiguation is avoided in the majority of other areas, it seems only natural to convert to the system that does away with pre-disambiguation altogether. If the majority turned out to be the other way around, you'd be seeing me vouching for using pre-disambiguation in all cases.

This is not to convince you to change your point of view or anything; I am just trying to explain my position. The bottom line is that I don't care what system we use, but I do want to see one system, or at least one with minor variations. As Wikipedia grows, the more standardization we can introduce, the better it is for all, readers and editors alike.—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 17:57, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

I guess we share the same long term dream, except I would prefer to standardize things the way the majority of things are already standardized (which is without using pre-disambiguation). Having to move less articles is better than having to move more articles, wouldn't you agree? Especially considering that the number of articles to be moved may well run into thousands. Even if it were only the question of optimal distribution of resources (editors' time and servers' capacities), it would alone have been sufficient to make an informed decision.

As for which way it's easier for editors to edit, that can be a subject of many more theoretical debates. Truth is, we have no evidence either way. You say pre-disambiguating, when done properly, is easier on editors. I say that I had no problems with unique titles and disambiguating only when necessary (again, when this is done properly). None of us can support these statements with cold hard evidence, except that both of us can demonstrate lack of problems. One thing seems logical, though—having cities in a few countries named one way and cities in most of the rest of countries named the other way has a great potential for confusion and disruption, as well as increased training costs. Would you care to comment on my proposal here?—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 23:14, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

Scarborough (again)

I'm debating the use of the phrase "Most other places named "Scarborough" are named after this one." I feel that this really isn't needed, whether it's fact or not. Scarborough ← is the link if you wanted to take a look. <3 bunny 22:51, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

I put the line in to attempt to satisfy an objection at what is now Talk:Scarborough, North Yorkshire#Requested_move. I don't care if the text is changed or removed, but I think it's helpful to identify somehow that Scarborough, North Yorkshire is most likely the one meant if there was absolutely no context provided, rather than having to scan starting from Scarborough, Western Australia and working down the list. (The Australian ones should be alphabetical and are not at present). --Scott Davis ^Talk 03:19, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

Hey, I made a change, see if you think its any better. Scarborough. <3 bunny 01:47, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

I'm still happy with that - thanks. --Scott Davis ^Talk 04:11, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

Time

No problem really I really like finding eccentric time zones like this but I am short of finding good refs from my usual sources... thats all - thanks for the headsup Satu Suro 02:07, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

Road transport in Australia

Nice work on kicking the much-needed overview article off the ground. I have some points I mentioned on the talk page, but I do want to say, well done for putting something together.

Time & work politics is against me at the moment so I won't be able to weigh in as much as I would like. Good work so far!Ga rr ie 00:18, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

List AfD's

Hi, I notice you have listed / are involved in AfD for a few Australia-related lists lately... Do you think there shouldn't be any list of... articles or are you just throwing up ones which imply they should be current but aren't being maintained? Would you have a problem with List of Premiers of New South Wales - which would be able to summarise service information such as when they were premier, electorate they represented, party information, something that can't be done with Category:Premiers of New South Wales?

Just trying to work out if you have a vision / long term goal, or you've just been nominating bad articles. Ga rr ie 00:06, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Can you please reply to my concerns at the AfD on former politicians, and can you please stop nominating these articles for deletion? They can be turned into a comprehensive list and expanded into a potential Featured List. I agree that we don't need three articles on this, but we should have one of them that has all Parliamentarians with their electorate and dates served, and any ministerial responsibilities added. To delete these articles is going to make more work of any potential list created for this purpose, and it will not just be a duplicate of the categories. Please consider stuff before you make mass nominations. JROBBO 00:33, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Garrie - I have no problem at all with "good" lists - well-defined criteria, useful additional information, reasonable chance of maintenance. In fact I monitor and maintain several, such as S&P/ASX 200. I have a problem with lists that claim to be complete but aren't and likely never can be, that have vague criteria (spam magnets), or that claim to be lists of Wikipedia articles/people with Wikipedia articles. The premiers are presently listed in Premiers of New South Wales#List of Premiers of New South Wales.

Thanks, I just picked premiers as an example of a list that could easily be complete and I don't intend to create that article.

I agree, any List of XXXX article must have well defined inclusion criteria. A list article which has fallen into a poorly maintained state needs maintenance, not deletion. The list of australians is unmanagable and should be broken into smaller lists with more specific inclusion criteria.Ga rr ie 05:18, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

JROBBO - "Mass deletions" is extreme - I have nominated 2 for AFD, one of which was split out of the other by DXRAW. I also nominated those and another for {{prod}} a few weeks before, after discussion on the Australian noticeboard, and have voted delete on one that someone else nominated without prior discussion to me. List of Australians is a lost cause as a subject in my opinion. I will happily allow you or others to create a valuable List of Australian politicians article, but I do not believe that the current article is any more helpful starting point than a blank page would be. --Scott Davis ^Talk 01:16, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Sorry, that was pretty rude of me - I was just a bit annoyed, but it's not really your fault. I'm happy to change my vote on both of them pending the creation of a "List of Australian politicians" with a category of lists (or a disambig page) leading to everyone who has or does serve in an Australian parliament. It might take a while and I'm working on other stuff atm so it's not my priority, but would you be happy to support that? JROBBO 06:36, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Looks like we crossed messages. :-) JROBBO 06:37, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

BTW, I'm with you on the "List of Australians" - that is something that can't be replicated in a Wikipedia list; I'm all for its deletion. JROBBO 06:38, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Not to worry - I don't have the skill, resource or inclination to fix it, and had failed to trigger that desire in the people who could. I found the existing articles to be an embarrassment, and was well aware that it could be a contentious nomination. If it gets people to think about the content, then the AFD process has worked - look at smoko! In this specific case, it needs someone to make it complete and maintainable first. Once the list is complete, it is possible for more people to work on adding dates/parties/electorates/style and layout. Neither "notable" nor "has a Wikipedia article" are suitable NPOV criteria for inclusion in a list. "Was a member of the X parliament" or "Won a Y award" are. --Scott Davis ^Talk 06:55, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

MATS

I haven't completed it because all my sources and information had to be handwritten and photocopied from old reports and papers from the State Library (including the MATS report itself, which is absolutely mind-boggling). I intend to finish it in time, but it's just a very hard subject to get information on without going to such a place and taking the time. michael ^talk 13:26, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

I will get a friend to make a map of the freeways in the next few days, and then I'll merge my draft into WikiSpace. As for 'Elizabeth then along the Torrens', it's worded badly, but the route is actually correct! (I'll correct the wording.) It followed the Torrens Gorge, then quickly diverted north just before Modbury, and then made its way to Elizabeth. If you've got Google Earth, it's easy to see where it would have divulged from the O-Bahn route and continued as what McIntyre Road is today. michael ^talk 13:50, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Aborignes

Sorry, I feel silly now. thanks Vicki R 13:09, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

ACOTF

Here, you do deserve a cookie at least!

Hey there, I just want to pass on a thanks for the work you do getting back to ppl who participate in the ACOTF process - I am sure it helps increase the numbers contributing while the article is the ACOTF. Here's hoping Road Transport can be improved as much as Smoko was during its AfD, or Mulesing was during it's ACOTF.Ga rr ie 20:38, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Hey, if I thought you were doing that good a job it would have been a barnstar ;) Ga rr ie 21:46, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Some of the dirt highways are in fact the best route between the most significant centres of population. So I don't really think that they are named "ironically" - it's just that even though they are the highway between centres, they attract that little traffic that there is no economic need to seal the route.

Look to the origins of the word "highway" not to what it commonly implies.Ga rr ie 01:01, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Cobb Highway is not fully sealed.Ga rr ie 01:05, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

wikitravel

I just noticed a link on the strahan article - I'd be tempted to revert - do you have any idea of whether such links are considered ok or not? Satu Suro 13:56, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

The {{wikitravel}} template has been around for a fair while, so I presume it's OK. I've added it a few times to articles where I've deleted a lot of tourist-oriented content form Wikipedia if the place also has a Wikitravel page. Wikitravel is not run by the same organisation, but does have a free licence which makes it an acceptable target for external links. In fact you could join the end of the recent conversation at Template talk:Wikitravel if you have an opinion, either generally or specifically about its use on Strahan, Tasmania. --Scott Davis ^Talk 14:13, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for that. Satu Suro 14:35, 16 February 2007 (UTC) Then just in Queenstown (which you just fixed) - I'll hold my breath a little longer to see if it creeps into more unlikely west coast articles - then I think I will feel the need to act... Satu Suro 14:47, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Collab reminder - Yup I'm troubled about the way the railways are mentioned in the first sentence - and I've got a handle on bicycle stuff - so I'll be in there - thanks for the reminderSatu Suro 12:48, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Nah no worries - I am probably thinking of the road vs rail argument issues here in wa history of the early 50's - things change so much - I'd need to find what i call a good ref if i was ever to even think of changing something like that - inherently the sentence is correct - but its political climates for infrastructure costs in either form of transport that i think needs a another place another article... cheers - no sign of another wikitravel in western tas or i havent been watching close enough...Satu Suro 13:25, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Heheh well you know what i feel about that! cripes I'll have to drop my tagging for the projects and think! that'll be dangerous... :) Satu Suro 13:38, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Bit disappointing to find the transport and road transport articles more or less have the same first sentence though... :) Satu Suro 13:51, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Thats a good one! I wont quote you though - been to too many afd parties recently... Satu Suro 14:06, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

I suspect my three hose persons of the apocalypse/ or was that the drought - gnangarra/moondyne/hesperian between them - probably hesp because of his magnificent wa project lists - might know something -hes signed off tonight long ago but that message repeated to him might get a better response than I a humble please help me moondyne ed when it comes to those type things... sorry i'm about to sign off as well - cj? longhair? - anyways until next we chat, cheers Satu Suro 14:30, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Trust all that got sorted out - oh how my anthrop lecturers and my ex phd supe would read and weep at the discussion on terminology ... :( Satu Suro 09:02, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks

It's been a week since my recent request for adminship passed, and since I haven't managed to delete the Main Page - yet - I figure it's safe to send these out. Thanks a lot for participating in my RfA; I hope to do a good job. If you see me doing something wrong, need help, or just want to have a chat, please don't hesitate to drop by :) – riana_dzasta 07:13, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

Hi Scott,

Thanks for the welcome. I can't really see any major issues with the ATCC results you mentioned. Any particular points you are concerned with?

Please let me know if I'm not following protocol with any of my contributions. I had a look at the "rules" and nearly fell off my chair.

Cheers,

GTHO 09:59, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

5000 runs, and Lists of lists

Hi Scott, I don't dispute your deprodding given your explanation. I'd concur a discussion is needed on lists in general. One of the reasons I created Lists of Australians was to pull them together into one place after List of Australians bit the dust, and start looking at duplicates, obscures, unmaintainables, and list articles that were just categories by another name. I'd suggest having the discussion at the 'Lists' talk page with pointers from the Aussie project and notice board. Looking forward to paring down the lists! --Steve _(Slf67) ^talk 23:05, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

I've posted my opinion on talk:lists of Australians. Let's see what else happens. --Scott Davis ^Talk 06:23, 24 February 2007 (UTC)

Compass Resources

Scott Regarding Compass Resources page http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compass_Resources - might I ask you consider if it would not be more appropriate to revert to Golden Wattle's original work or longhair's as it was simply factual, unbiased and protect that work rather than locking and protecting a page, the neutrality of which is listed as disputed, is clearly biased and anti mining, making unsupported and potentially defamatory comments and accusations. Might I at least ask you consider deleting the link to copyright infringement contained in the protected page Compass Resources NL (2005). Retrieved on 2006-11-11. - protest web site Chriso au 03:18, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

Continued on talk:Compass Resources. --Scott Davis ^Talk 09:39, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

Soldier settlement (Australia)

Hi Scott, soldier settlement schemes directly influenced every state of Australia and have a direct link to irrigation commencement etc which I notice that you have an avide interest in. Until today there was no article on Wiki covering the topic. I have started it and have also suggested it to be a WP:ACOTF article - would welcome your support if you think that such an article is appropriate for a collaboration project? --VS ^{talk...images} 02:02, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

Sounds like a good idea. I have an "avid interest" in lots of things, but no particular knowledge on soldier settlement. To keep the ACOTF nomination going until the selection covering Anzac Day, you need it to collect about 8 votes, but slowly enough to allow three other selections beforehand. --Scott Davis ^Talk 06:25, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

List of Australian Touring Car and V8 Supercar Champions

Scott,

Yes, you are right, there was a championship for drivers of 2 litre Touring Cars (from 1993 to 2000/01). However I think we should record those championships separately from the List of Australian Touring Car and V8 Supercar Champions

Regards,

GTHO 10:18, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

Conversation moved to talk:List of Australian Touring Car and V8 Supercar Champions. --Scott Davis ^Talk 10:47, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

Woodbine Avenue at AfD

Another editor has listed an article that you have been involved in editing, Woodbine Avenue, at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Woodbine Avenue. Please look there to see why this is, if you are interested in whether it should be deleted. Thank you. --Eastmain 03:13, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. I've looked, and I think two could be delete, but the other four should probably be kept. --Scott Davis ^Talk 21:44, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Six Hour Le Mans

Scott,

I have just created an entry for "Six Hour Le Mans" but I'm not sure how it should be linked into "Australian Motor Sport" or if I have entered my references correctly.

Cheers,

GTHO 04:55, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

I've added {{WP Australia|motorsport=yes}} to talk:Six Hour Le Mans, and [[Category:Motor racing in Australia]] to the bottom of Six Hour Le Mans. --Scott Davis ^Talk 06:36, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

You're back

which edit war would you like to be dragged into :) nah just joking... we've had some new piccies on the west coast tas arts from a newbie - what a relief... Satu Suro 23:48, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

I wasn't away THAT long! --Scott Davis ^Talk 06:36, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Cripes so you really found that edit war after all - with the category addition you made - hope you didnt see my ravings on the talk page of the deletable article of the same name - you'll probably think i really am a nutter ;) Satu Suro 12:14, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Terrorism in Indonesia wasn't hard to find - I really wasn't looking for it, but followed some ramblings on another user's talk page. --Scott Davis ^Talk 12:59, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

A very interesting game of chess moves between some serbians, and an indonesian and some australians on an indonesian graveyard - reminds me of my fieldwork in java - a royal graveyard... enough politics and arguments between siblings and factions ... sigh Satu Suro 13:27, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Most of the articles linked from the template I added at the bottom are longer, but of similar (poor) quality to the Indonesia one. I don't know much about Indonesia, but would be surprised if an article on terrorism there didn't mention Aceh, Maluku, Timor and Papua at least - and not all of them are related to JI. --Scott Davis ^Talk 21:52, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

The issue and template is beginning to haunt the small band of Indonesian project - no doubt the saga will continue - the milhist antgonists have shown no sign of actually listening to the complaints - the issue is not a simple one and templates are not the way to go... Satu Suro 22:31, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Do you mean {{Asia topic}} originally placed, then removed, then added back by me (without realising it had been there before), or do you mean the rather ugly {{Campaignbox Jemaah Islamiyah}} / {{Campaignbox Terrorism in Indonesia}}? A brief look at Jemaah Islamiyah shows that the two concepts are not synonymous.--Scott Davis ^Talk 23:40, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Scott - sorry for a start i really wouldnt want to drag anyone into this mess - but yes the template campaign boxes had a messy combined temp for delet which i have got involved in and helped withdraw the nom last night - as even the top brass in the milhist area agreed (my talk) was not exactly a shining light - the prob is the originator has re-placed the template back into the indonesian bombing arts (one friend admin offline has suggested he can be possiby warned re his editing...) - the whole temp for delete anti argument is that it is pov and i argue non encyc but that hasnt stopped the ed putting it back... despite having it pointed out in the temp for delete all the issues that arise from putting such an item in. thank god im not on all today as i have real life to attend to otherwise in between doing thw whole indonesia project cat talk pages with class=NA to try to sort out some project cat issues - I'd pobably be harrasing people re the continued fiasco. sigh. i clog your talk page with this - sigh Satu Suro 00:19, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

There seems to be support for nominating each of those four campaign templates individually for deletion. One or two might get kept, but the reasons for deleting each one are different, so lumping them together didn't work at all. Sometimes the AFD process works and articles change significantly during the process - TFD can work the same sometimes. --Scott Davis ^Talk 00:25, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

I agree totally - if it was possible to do a good article on the subject (with all the historical, regional, and 'types of violence' variations carefully mapped out) it would be an intriguing introduction to the country from the terms of violence and conflict - sadly there are neither the editors or the will and even a well intentioned serbian campaign box builder has really sparked the inspiration/motivation... The time and resource issue simply defeats us - and I am not a 100 per cent sure that the idea of multiple more specific article will either get done either! sigh. Satu Suro 00:11, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

JdH response to /Archive 7#solar tower

User:JdH wrote the following into /Archive 7 in response to a conversation last October.

I can't believe that you guys are seriously thinking that I have anything to do whith any of those Aussie projects. Of course not. All I ever did is digest information that is freely available in the internet and in the scientific literature, and let the facts speak for themselves. Anybody who takes the trouble to look at the numbers will inevitably come to the same conclusion: The Solar Tower is a loser, for the simple reason that there are other Solar thermal energy technologies out there that are far more efficient. The Australian government appears to have done its homework, and come to the same conclusion, Solar Systems to Build A$420 million, 154MW Solar Power Plant in Australia. JdH 17:20, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

The point is that we shouldn't draw the conclusions. Either state the facts in a neutral manner with no embellishment, or cite a reliable reference to someone who did come to the conclusion you want to have exposed. "Efficient" can mean several things - energy efficiency is one, but economic efficiency may not lead to the same outcomes. Enviromission now claims to be exploring building towers in the western USA, I think somewhere near where you said they already have much more energy efficient solar power stations. Governments also take a number of factors into account. From memory one of the factors for choosing the Victorian bid is that the Victoria Government is also throwing in $50M, leading to a larger effective result from the federal government money than a NSW proposal with no state money thrown in. The governments might also wish to develop a photovoltaic manufacturing industry, where there is little new manufacturing industry for tall round towers. They might even have made some judgement of the management and viability of the companies involved. --Scott Davis ^Talk 13:52, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

It is about time that you wake up to the facts. I have given all the relevant links in the past, unequivocally showing that the Solar updraft tower has a yield between 0.5-2%, while competing CSP or CPV technologies have efficiencies ranging from 30-40% This may be your opportunity to make a quick buck by shorting EnviroMission stock. JdH 14:23, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

The facts are that neither project has actually built anything yet, and one of them has government funding from two governments. Beyond that the economics are speculation, and in particular there is nothing to say that both projects cannot proceed. Which one you favour depends on whether you're a civil engineer or an electronic engineer. There is no more reason not to have different technology solar powerstations than that there are different technologies for gas power stations and nuclear powerstations. At the moment, I don't think I'd touch Enviromission shares even to short them. --Scott Davis ^Talk 22:16, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

It is of course possible to do all sorts of calculations, and make pretty good predictions of how the economic feasibility of certain designs compare to others. SunLab has done extensive calculations; those are probably the best ones available at the present time. If I remember correctly, their conclusion was that right now Parabolic trough designs look best, in the immediate future the Dish designs may surpass that, and in the more remore future Power tower designs may beat that. It appears that Solar Systems is trying to leapfrog ahead by going straight for a solar power tower design. Also, they go for a PV-based system rather than thermal systems, while SunLab's conclusion was that the economics of Solar thermal energy looks better than Photovoltaics. SunLab clearly does not believe in the economic feasibility of solar updraft towers and energy towers. I am prepared to bet a bottle of good Californian wine against an Australian equivalent that no utility-scale Solar Tower of Energy Tower will be realized anytime soon. JdH 05:55, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

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Category: User talk archives

User talk:ScottDavis/Archive 9

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Contents

ASX 200 Companies

Yorkshire/North Yorkshire

ASX 200 Companies

Major Party Leader tables on NSW election page

Yorkshire/North Yorkshire

Coordinates

Leyland Brothers

Predab concerns

Scarborough (again)

Time

Road transport in Australia

List AfD's

MATS

Aborignes

ACOTF

wikitravel

Thanks

5000 runs, and Lists of lists

Compass Resources

Soldier settlement (Australia)

List of Australian Touring Car and V8 Supercar Champions

Woodbine Avenue at AfD

Six Hour Le Mans

You're back

JdH response to /Archive 7#solar tower

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