Talk:Scots tablet

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I realise that there are many variations on the tablet recipe, all of them enjoyed by different people. The recipe I link to is my family's one, which I hope doesn't contravene policy.

What gives? How did this get moved from Scots Tablet? I have never heard the term Swiss Milk Tablet. The term only gets 37 hits on Google, mostly from this page. "Scots Tablet" gets 113 hits. --scruss 17:33, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

That's simple. I moved it of course. I am Scottish and have been making (and eating) tablet since the 1960s. In Scotland it was always called Swiss Milk tablet or just plain tablet but never Scots tablet. I recognise that people living outside Scotland might well call it Scots tablet (although they should call it Scotch tablet since it is a foodstuff). What Google calls it is neither here nor there since Google didn't exist until fairly recently. What is important is what we Scots call it since we are more than likely the major manufacturers and consumers. In fact checking out your 37 Google hits indicates that many of them refer to Scottish websites (some of which are local agricultural shows with tablet-making competitions) whereas most of the 113 refer to sites outside Scotland. If you want a real authority on tablet, I would suggest contacting the WRI rather than Google. -- Derek Ross | Talk 19:42, Apr 23, 2005 (UTC)

Please don't move this page again. If you know Scots Tablet by another name, add it to the article, and create a redirect from your named page. --scruss 17:58, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Please give me a good reason why it shouldn't be moved again. I'm still waiting for one. -- Derek Ross | Talk 19:46, Apr 23, 2005 (UTC)

I'm Scottish too, Derek; it's only in the last three years that I moved to Canada. My family has known it as Scots Tablet, or just plain Tablet, since the 1940s. As I kid, I'd go to numerous coffee mornings and sales-of-work, and it was always "Tablet" or Scots Tablet". Until yesterday, I had never heard the term "Swiss milk" for condensed milk. It must be a regional thing.

A good reason not to move the article again? Tablet is known by many names. I created the article under the name Scots Tablet, because I knew it under that name while living in Scotland. If you had created the article as Swiss Milk Tablet, and I'd found it, I would have respected where you'd put it, but added a link or reference to the term Scots Tablet.

Also, the Glasgow Sunday Herald didn't complain about the naming when they linked to my recipe in 100 Things To Do In Scotland Before You Die. Am I Scottish enough for you now? --scruss 15:07, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Obviously blue and white all the way through (and in a similar position to myself vis-a-vis Canada)! But getting back to the main topic, I don't think "Swiss Milk" is a regional name. The link that I gave is from Edinburgh and I saw several others which I didn't give, one being memories of a Dundee childhood, others referring to results from agricultural shows in Colonsay and in Stranraer, and in Aberdeenshire. That pretty well covers the whole country south of Inverness. I more inclined to believe that the name "Swiss Milk tablet" was originally coined in contrast to the older "Cream tablet" which you mention in the article as the traditional recipe. It's more probable that you always heard it called "tablet" because that is what everyone calls it in conversation. I would imagine that "Swiss Milk tablet" is its "Sunday" name, to be found only in recipe books, agricultural show class names -- and encyclopedias. However I'm not going to move it again without the support of references since it's obvious that both of us are relying on our personal experience which differs. I'm not currently in a position to do that since I'm visiting Houston and don't have access to any recipe books. And in any case I won't move it unless I can convince you that it's the right thing to do. Cheers -- Derek Ross | Talk 17:24, Apr 24, 2005 (UTC)

Nothing to do with the above but I note that you say that your Aunt's results were better than your own. This is possibly because she used castor sugar (sold in Canada as berry sugar) rather than granulated sugar. Doing so improves the texture by reducing the grittiness of the final product. -- Derek Ross | Talk 18:57, Apr 24, 2005 (UTC)

Okay, I've had a think about this. The compelling reason not to move the article to Swiss Milk Tablet is that it might make people think the confection is traditionally from Switzerland. The term itself might be a trademark; the old posters used to have "Nestlé's Swiss Milk" as the banner. Use of "Swiss Milk" to denote condensed milk is confusing, for it's an American invention.

I'm also not sure that using finer sugar would have much effect on the finished product. The sugar has to dissolve, then reach melting point as the water evaporates. There should be no crystals remaining from the original sugar; the old confectioner's term for this was boiling sugar back to sugar. The only things I've found that affect flavour and texture are using beet sugar (which makes it taste of turnips, yuck), and using any kind of brown/golden sugar, which causes interesting lumps of molasses to precipitate. The result's tasty, but it ain't tablet. --scruss 01:54, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

After investigation, I find that there are two recipes for tablet. The older one just uses milk and sugar. It is known as Cream Tablet. The newer one uses condensed milk and it is known as Swiss Milk Tablet. The article already alludes to the two recipes but doesn't mention the different names. -- Derek Ross | Talk 07:06, Jun 4, 2005 (UTC)

Just to add some more conflicting viewpoints to the mix, I've only ever heard of the name "tablet". Neither Scots [sic] or Swiss Milk tablet would have meant much to me in other circumstances. Scotch tablet makes most sense in the same way we'd use Scotch whisky abroad or just whisky here. My relatives are from the Perth/Edinburgh/Lothian areas, if that helps things any. -- 81.131.73.198 01:51, 31 July 2005 (UTC)
That's fair enough. The only places that you might see it called Swiss Milk tablet would be recipe books, sweet shops or at an agricultural show. Otherwise as you say, it's almost always just called "tablet". -- Derek Ross | Talk 02:04, 13 September 2005 (UTC)
Well my mother's family are from the highlands (now mostly Skye) and I was brought up to cook (and eat) tablet there. Tablet was the only name by which I knew it. Marian McNeill in 'The Scots Kitchen' cites the Household Book of Lady Grisell Baillie (1692-1733) as listing among the purchages 'taiblet for the bairns'. 'Tablet' as a term by itself seems then to have a decent pedigree. Indeed my cookbook 'The Glasgow Cookbook' (1965) calls it 'vanilla tablet' or 'walnut tablet' or whatever. I suspect that 'Swiss Milk Tablet' is of more recent origin and either referred to a specific recipe or ingredient. The more generic name seems better for an encylopedia entry.
Mind you, in the family its normally known as 'fudge', and only called 'tablet' to distinguish it from the nasty chewy thing the lowlanders eat. Its also unclear why one needs the 'Scots', but that's another debate. I still make the stuff with cream and sugar, there's no need to use condensed milk unless you are really useless at cookery. Francis Davey 18:49, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

you say potato, I say potato. You say tomato, I say tomato. Swiss Milk Tablet, Scots Tablet, Tablet, whatever. Perhaps (Swiss)milk tablet refers to the name Nestlé (a Swiss company, I think?) Nestlé over time became Swiss to mean any tin of condensed milk (you know, Hoover meaning any vacuum cleaner) as in the receipes in the Scottish Women's Rural Institute for 'Swiss Milk Tablet' and 'Swiss Milk Toffee' from whence I travelled to this page to find out what the hell '1 tin of Swiss milk' meant since I had no idea. I knew only tablet in speech (I am originally from Clydebank) but there were many different types of tablet sold over the counter, including, I think, Swiss Milk Tablet. Perhaps this was meant to convey a superior quality of tablet, you think?) I have no connection whatsover to the Scottish Women's Rural Institute, I collect recipe books -- this one was collected on a trip back home. - Anonymous

There was a 19th century American producer of condensed milk known as the Anglo-Swiss Milk Company. This probably where the term Swiss Milk meaning condensed milk comes from. -- Derek Ross | Talk 18:42, 7 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Proposed deletion of 26 Dec.

On 25th Dec User:Oo7565 proposed that this article be deleted because it was "non noteabl sunject outside scotland not importent enough to be on here". I stopped the proposed deletion because this topic has a far longer history than most of the confectionery items listed on Wikipedia and is known under other names in other countries (the article gives details), thus showing the proposer's reasoning to be faulty. --- Derek Ross | Talk 07:25, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Indeed, tablet is known (and made) in other parts of the United Kingdom. Francis Davey 21:50, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
Yes, thanks. I missed that while I was away. --scruss 23:33, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
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