Talk:Scotch

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[edit] A little history on American English?

How did the word "Scotch" in reference to the people of Scotland, rather than the drink of course, survive in American English but not in any other dialects of English? Surely there is a story to be told even if it is just a quick description of how the American English dictionary was compiled to explain the difference. [This unsigned comment by User, 80.41.227.227 - 21 June 06]

it isnt used in other dialects of english because scottish people dont like being called scotch (before you ask how i know this i am scottish and every scottish person i know including myself dont like it)

[edit] Working class use in Scotland

"Scotch is sometimes still used by the working classes who often regard Scots as an anglicised affectation" - Says who? Shouldn't there be a source to this claim. I have live in Scotland all my life and have never heard any Scottish working class person use the word "Scotch" instead of "Scots". [This unsigned comment by User 80.41.221.1539, 80.41.227.227 - 21 June 06]

I agree; I have seen historical references for this, but have no awareness of it as a contemporary phenomenon. --Doric Loon 09:53, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

I have taken this out because I too have never come across working class people shying away from the use of 'Scots.' as an 'anglicised affectation' (Where on earth did this come from?) In some of his more anti-Scottish passages George Orwell recommends the use of the word 'Scotch' specifically because it is guaranteed to cause offence to all manners of Scottish people. Rcpaterson 01:27, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

Its in the Oxford Companion to the English Language in an article by A.J. Aitken. It may well only used by auld biddies now though. Still common enough in Ulster though. Perhps rephrase the entry to indicate that that phenomenon is perhaps receding.

84.135.216.35 19:18, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

If it was ever used in this way, the phenomenon has long disappeared. Ivor Cutler used it in 1978 for comic effect: Life in a Scotch Sitting Room, Vol. 2. I think my grandmother, who died at the end of the last century at the age of 103 and had learnt to use the word in her childhood in Lancashire, may have been the last Scot in Scotland to use 'Scotch' seriously (and she was not working class). In modern times, indeed, the word is used in much the same way as 'Yank', 'Frog', 'Kraut', 'Eyetie': to cause mild offence while allowing the user to disclaim any such intention. I have again deleted this weird claim. Ariwara 10:17, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

The Oxford English Dictionary says the following under the entry for "Scotch"; "In the 20th c. the word Scotch has been falling into disuse in England as well as in Scotland, out of deference to the Scotsman's supposed dislike of it; except for certain fixed collocations, (such as ‘Scotch mist’, ‘Scotch whisky’) Scottish (less frequently Scots) is now the usual adjective, and to designate the inhabitants of Scotland the pl. n. Scots is preferred (see Gowers/Fowler Mod. Eng. Usage (1965))." Walter Siegmund (talk) 23:42, 16 December 2006 (UTC)