Talk:Schizoid personality disorder

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[edit] Merging "Narcissism and Schizoid Disorders"

[I feel that the existing article on Narcissism needs editing to be even more concise and to incorporate a considerable amount of the Narcissism and schizoid disorders article, the rest to be merged into Schizoid personality disorder. There is absolutely no justification for an article that makes the link between the two.

As a precedent it could generate a neverending supply of superfluous articles, for example "Narcissism and Alcoholism", "Pregnancy and Nausea", "Fish and Chips" --Zeraeph 06:53, 8 January 2006 (UTC)]

I feel this article covers the bases faily well and is not in necessary need of additional information from that article. I don't think the Narcissim article would benefit that much either, although I don't see it hurting it much either.- K-111
Hi K-111, the idea of a partial merge from Narcissism and schizoid disorders to this article is not so much make up any deficit in this article but that there are probably elements of the article that are more appropriate to this article than Narcissism. It is more about the dispersal of the "meat" of a superfluous article than any lack in Narcissism or Schizoid personality disorder. Of course, just how much "meat" that will prove to be depends entirely on how much of the Narcissism and schizoid disorders can be substantiated beyond it's existance as an original hypothesis --Zeraeph 13:04, 13 January 2006 (UTC)
Cannot find a trace of any real substantiation for the article Narcissism and schizoid disorders at all, so I am now listing it for deletion instead, unless anybody can show otherwise --Zeraeph 12:22, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] SPD is not a personality disorder

SPD is not a personality disorder. Another one of the tricks to keep the gifted few, who are different, back in the heard. SPD contradicts fundamental principles of individual liberty (individualism and liberalism so cherished by our society give full freedom to an individual to maintain any lifestyle he/she desires as long as it doesnot disrupt social order.) Hence the concept of SPD as a disorder is against doctorines of social contract upon which the legal systems are based. -apurv

Good point. I've tried to represent your argument in the section about the Status of SPD as a mental disorder. Please check if it says what you mean, and feel free to improve on it, of course! Best regards, Sietse 18:32, 24 Oct 2004 (UTC)
The fact that SPD, or any other PD, is a disorder, does not contradict any principle of liberty. Flu is recognized as a disease, it does not mean that people who have the flu are compelled to take any treatment. Apokrif 22:24, 8 August 2005 (UTC)
SPD is most certainly a disorder, as it is currently classified as such in DSM-IV. Whether it deserves that classification is a separate matter (though I believe it does). -A schizoid, 156.34.90.214 08:49, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
Just a thought, but would it make better sense to change the article's title to "schizoid" and redirect SPD to it? It's a minor change, but perhaps a telling one? Or alternatively, to leave this article as related to the DSM category and create another, fuller Schizoid article? --Zeraeph 12:25, 15 January 2006 (UTC)
I don't follow your line of reasoning. A schizoid is a person diagnosed with SPD. Why would this require another article, or make a better title than the name of the disorder? -A schizoid, 156.34.90.214 08:49, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

"People who are afflicted with Asperger's syndrome often have very intense interests, while people with SPD are typically more indifferent with regard to their activities"

The article says:

While people who have SPD can also suffer from a clinical depression, this is certainly not always the case. Unlike depressed people, persons with SPD generally do not consider themselves inferior to others, although they will probably recognise that they are different. Unlike avoidant personality disorder, those affected with SPD do not avoid social interactions due to anxiety or feelings of incompetence, but because they are genuinely indifferent to social relationships.

So the "differential diagnosis" section should be more nuanced than the current black-and-white description, I think. Apokrif 05:19, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

The comparison between SPD and the flu is a circular argument, since it presumes SPD is comparable to a disorder in order to show that it is a disorder. You can't use your conclusion as a premise!

The hypothesis is not that the flu is a disorder, but that the flu is recognized as a disorder. And my point is not that SPD is a disorder, but that recognizing SPD as a disorder does not contradict fundamental principles of individual liberty Apokrif 22:04, 20 September 2005 (UTC)

"SPD is not a personality disorder. Another one of the tricks to keep the gifted few, who are different, back in the heard". I don't know of any evidence suggesting that being a schizoid makes you gifted, aklthough some gifted people are obviously schizoid.

Randy_LeJeune 10:39, 24 October 2005 (UTC)

Dear Randy LeJeune, If you were really schizoid, you would care less about what others (including doctors or psychologists) think about you or how they label you. We are way better than them. LOL Liz from Brazil

  • I would certainly consider SPD a personality disorder. (I myself fall in line with a number of the prerequisites for having this disorder, for the record, though it's irrelevant, it dispells the notion that I seek to somehow quarintine the schizoid segments of the population) Keep in mind that in order for it to classify as a personality disorder there are a number of prerequisites. Even if a person meets three (or even all) of the traits listed in the criteria they would only be considered to have "Schizoid Personality Disorder" if they also met the criteria for personality disorders: that the afforementioned traits are resulting in dysharmonious behavior, negatively affecting one's functioning, maladaptive to their personal or social obligations, result in personal distress (though this may not be apparent in later stages, or wish schizoid or anti-social traits), negatively affect occupational performance, etc. If you exhibit schizoid traits and manage to hold own a job competently and are content with your lifestyle you wouldn't be labeled as suffering from "Schizoid Personality Disorder", though you may most definitly have the traits. - Xvall

I think it isn't the place of anyone here, or this article to determine whether SPD is actually a disorder or not. If tomorrow, someone came out with utterly conclusive proof that SPD -isn't- a disorder, it would still be reasonable for this article to exist under this name, as a result of how it has been considered. Consider, for example, the existence of Category:Obsolete_scientific_theories. Document the contreversy regarding the status of SPD as a disorder, absolutely. But it skirts too close to original research to just say it's not a disorder, when it's commonly accepted as one. neongrey 04:19, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Schizoid Personality Disorder, An interesting "disorder" because the "sufferers" don't care...

I thought that seeing as how I recently discovered that I "suffer" from this affliction, perhaps I could share my experience with this "disorder".

"neither desires nor enjoys close relationships, including being part of a family almost always chooses solitary activities has little, if any, interest in having sexual experiences with another person takes pleasure in few, if any, activities lacks close friends or confidants other than first-degree relatives appears indifferent to the praise or criticism of others shows emotional coldness, detachment, or flattened affectivity"

While this perfectly describes myself, and my supposed "disorder" there are several indescrepencies on the page http://www.toad.net/~arcturus/dd/schizoid.htm. For example, I quote: "While these individuals do not particularly struggle with shame or guilt, they can be quite anxious about basic safety" this is certainly not accurate for myself, as I have a tendency to show a strong lack of interest in my own safety, much to the dismay of the people who are determined to surround me.

Also, my case of SPD is very different from the one discussed on this page for two reasons: I have excellent social skills (that I choose not to use), and I am extremely articulate when I have to be. Only over the last four years (I am now 18 years old) has this "disorder" set in. In the last few years of my life, I had many friends and had parties regularily. There were a lot of things that happened to me, mainly with a certain relationship that made me dislike attention and speaking with others. I moved from my small town to a city almost six months ago, and I do not miss any of those people I used to know at all. I'm glad that I no longer have to talk to anyone. I still don't know anyone here, and I'm glad of that. My family always suggest that I meet people, but I really don't want to. The emotion I feel when I am alone is actually strikingly similar to the love I once felt.


I also show the lack of emotional spectrum symptom. This is an interesting one. I can't say if this is bad or good, because I simply don't feel enough to care. I have had this issue almost the whole four years, steadily degrading for the first two until the most sadness I could feel was about on par with the sadness a normal person would feel if they dropped a sandwich. My happiness too, is about the same as how happy a normal person would feel if someone gave them a sandwich.


I don't really want to type anymore. The preceding unsigned comment was added by 220.236.216.178 (talk • contribs) .

Just a brief thought but, perhaps while there certainly is a Schizoid Disorder (where contact brings distress for example) I wonder if, perhaps, there is also a perfectly healthy "Schizoid Orientation"? --Zeraeph 13:43, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

  • This has been conjectured by others as well. Some make a distinction between "higher" and "lower" schizoids, the former being the most withdrawn. -A schizoid 156.34.90.214 08:59, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
Just a thought, but I don't think disorder should be defined by how "withdrawn" you are, but rather but how functional you are, in the sense of being law abiding and self supporting for example. Otherwise you are tagging "withdrawal" as disorder in it's own right, and I doubt if it is.
Perhaps, in many cases, the best way to treat the disorder is to strive towards a more functional, self-supporting form of withdrawal, rather than to attempt to fight the need to withdraw? --Zeraeph 12:43, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
It isn't the superficial symptoms that make it a disorder, it's the underlying cognitive processes that result in them. -Objectivist-C 04:11, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
That is assuming psychologists actually have the faintest idea what they are talking about.

[edit] Personality "disorder"?

Is being a "schizoid" really a personality disorder? Western, specifically American, culture places much emphasis on being seen, being heard, and just plain being noticed as it does on competition and individualism. Status is dependent on other people. After all we don't have the phrases "conspicuous consumption", "rat race", and "dress to impress" for nothing. Maybe there are others (the truly introverted and schizoid) who do not want to capitulate to such extroverted nonsense.The preceding unsigned comment was added by 172.190.86.53 (talk • contribs) .

I think there is a Schizoid Personality Disorder, where the condition causes distress, and/or threatens function and survival (hard to imagine how it could threaten others?), but I think there is more to that disorder than just "being Schizoid", if that makes sense?

I think it is possible to be Schizoid and function and survive as well as anybody. I think many do, and I don't think that should be called a "disorder". However, equally, I don't think those with Schizoid tendencies who are struggling to find ways to survive should be called "functional" either. --Zeraeph 13:46, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

There are also those of us who are functional, but find that our issues get in the way of attaining our goals. -A schizoid 156.34.90.214 09:01, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
I think, maybe, being Schizoid becomes a disorder when the issues cause unreasonable distress by getting the the way of goals (I am sure everybody has a certain amount of issues that obstruct their goals to a degree). Or perhaps, when the issues and goals of the individual are in too much conflict?
I suppose it's something for the individual to determine. If you are Schizoid, self supporting, as content as anyone else and feel no need for any kind of help, then you surely can't be "disordered"? But you surely are different. --Zeraeph 13:02, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
When I say "getting in the way of goals", I mean specifically schizoid traits like the social inhibitions getting in the way of career advancement, for example. But there are other justifications for maintaining it as a disorder, as making it easier for the few desiring treatment to receive it, in some cases. -Objectivist-C 22:16, 12 April 2006 (UTC), formerly "A schizoid".

I think you misunderstand me, I am saying that just being Schizoid is not always a disorder, though it can be if it interferes with functionality or quality of life. I think we need to keep BOTH "healthy schizoid" AND "schizoid personality disorder as seperate conditions. --Zeraeph 23:06, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] References style

The style used here is ungainly and ugly, could someone format it in a different way? Add the page number also. Italise book titles. Skinnyweed 09:18, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

The citations now use the proper cite templates (i.e., {{cite book}} and {{cite journal}}), and I've also converted the referencing style over to the <ref> footnote style. The citations are now more consistently formatted (and hopefully the references section looks less ugly too). — Jeff | (talk) | 03:42, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Relationships with others

The paragraph discussing sexuality has no citations. It was added by someone on a psychiatric problems discussion board, so I'm aware of their motive and that they only added it because it was their personal experience, and not something he read out of published material. I suggest that this be cleaned up and proper references added. -- Cyborg Ninja 04:34, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

It does not matter if you think you know who added this and you have no way of knowing if this was personal experience. The only thing that matters is whether this is true of Schizoids or not. Yes, these two paragraphs definitely needd proper references, but there are more apprpriate methods of dealing with this. The appropriate way of doing so is not to remove, but to post here in Talk: that you see a problem with it. Then you add the fact tag for signaling to those who are interested in the personality disorders that they should pause in their journey, pick up a textbook or two, and add those references. If they unreferenced sections are deleted, that smacks more of vandalism then helpfulness. But many newcomers make similar inexperienced leaps into misjudgement. So, keep your head up. You could learn a great deal. -I am Kiwi 04:09, 7 October 2006 (UTC)
Considering I read the person's post myself on the message board, there is 0 doubt it was added out of personal experience, and even out of contempt. I actually had to go and fix your tag because it wasn't the correct format. And you call me a "newcomer." Yes, I could add a reference for those "facts." But it would have to be to someone's personal comments on a forum. That's not much of a reference. -- Cyborg Ninja 02:28, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

This is not true of scizoids. Four members of my family (including me) suffer from this disorder,and even my GP said it was not trueCerebus shun 22:33, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Speculation

† Just a thought I've been having, maybe we shouldn't keep talking about what we "think", and getting into what we "know". Almost no one has this as a personality disorder (a lot of people seem to come up with a ton of immediate family members who meet the requirements without being diagnosed because they DO NOT HAVE IT). The fact is, if it is actually a personality disorder, then it is causing a problem with that person's ability to function in society, as is the definition of a personality disorder. If it is not doing that to the person, then it is not a personality disorder. And it would do people wise to stop the self-diagnoses from information you got from Wikipedia.


Hello, I am just now learning about this disorder, social tendency or how ever you wish to describe it. I am dealing with an individual, who advised they had been diagnosed as a result of severe depression, so much, so suicide was contemplated. I am confused. If someone is schizoid,split or detached, how is the strong feeling generated to bring them to the state of depression?

[edit] mnemonics

I have noticed recently that a lot of the personality disorder pages have mnemonics about the diagnosis criteria of the relevant disorder. It's painful to me to see such inane crap on these pages. They aren't even clever -- they're tasteless, patronizing, and read like something a particularly unintelligent student would memorize for a psych 1 test. It took considerable restraint to keep from just deleting them without asking, but I beg you, the wikipedia psych-editing community, delete these childish things!

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