User talk:Sandpiper

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[edit] Welcome

Just wanted to welcome you. I've be dabbing here and there, like yourself, started by making a corection or three. Then checking this or that, to get bite by a stub, and redirected to a title that seemed totally out of context - it was, sort of, as five differentl languages had lent names to the town at one time or another. In coming to an understanding of that, as well as the subject matter I was originally interested in (See Lushun aka Port Arthur and follow just about any link for the Russo-Japanese War) I got involved in a serious expansion. For the last three weeks, I've been improving the whole related set of articles before and after said war. It's fun! Starting in on a Vfd Debate is probably a little quick, but there's no problem with that either. Your posting has already drawn some commentary, so you want to go back and look at the thread.

Here's a good secret: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Sandpiper/NewArtName will create an article page in your user space that you can refine before copying it into 'Article Space'. One Caveat - create a link for yourself on your talk or user page like [[1]]... Proably the best way to procede would be to create the link, then follow the redlink to the 'Edit The Box Below' autopage to begin building your contribution.

The following is something that someone first posted on my talk page, and the links are useful, so I copy it verbatum here for you... Besides, if I don't go to dinner now, I'll be divorced instead!

So enjoy and help us stamp out ignorance!!!

Welcome!

Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia. Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! By the way, you can sign your name on Talk and vote pages using three tildes, like this: ~~~. Four tildes (~~~~) produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump or ask me on my Talk page. I have it on good authority that there is a Help Desk... I don't know how to find it yet, but it's there and I should know soon.

Again, welcome! Fabartus 01:39, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Infinite loops

The relevant guideline is Wikipedia:Disambig, and also see Category:Disambiguation. It may be appropriate to create Infinite Loop (street), and at the top of Infinite loop add a line that links there. The earlier case was two pages of which the names only differed in capitalization - and that is a bad thing. Radiant_>|< 12:26, Jun 14, 2005 (UTC)

  • You are correct, that was my reasoning. We sometimes do that on wikipages if one of the two topics is only a very short definition. Radiant_>|< 12:39, Jun 14, 2005 (UTC)

[edit] CAP rearrangement

Hi,

I'll move the paragraphs somewhere else than objectives if you like. I couldn't find quite the right place for them, but thought that was the most suitable area. I wanted to move the paragraphs out of the "critique" section, since they don't really deal with a critique of the CAP. I'll look into it.

Peregrine981 02:46, Jun 20, 2005 (UTC)

Now that I see "critique" in terms of arguments in favour and against, I am happy enough to replace the paragraph. I hadn't thought about it, and assumed critique to be criticisms.
Peregrine981 11:10, Jun 20, 2005 (UTC)

[edit] George Galloway

Please read No original research, particularly the section about cite your sources. If you can cite a reputable source that says that the Sunday Times views are opposed to Galloways, lets see that source. If not, then it is your original research. Also read poisoning the well. --Mrfixter 4 July 2005 23:11 (UTC)

Please cite a reputable source that says that the Sunday Times views are in opposition to Galloways. You are poisoning the well by attempting to cast doubt on the Sunday Times as a source on his marriage difficulties. --Mrfixter 4 July 2005 23:30 (UTC)
The Sunday Times intentions are not the issue. The Sunday Times is a reputable source and so should be quoted about a story concerning Galloways personal life. The Sunday Times politics with regard to Galloway are pure speculation on your part and original research. That a newspaper has a bias is not worth putting in an article about Galloway. Has anyone claimed that the Sunday Times has been running a witchhunt against him? Cite your sources! --Mrfixter 4 July 2005 23:51 (UTC)
No, I never said the Sunday Times is absolutely reliable, I only stated that it is a reliable source. I never denied it had a bias either, I was only stating that your original research about the Sunday Times having views in opposition to Galloway should not be in the article. I would also draw your attention to the fact that at the time Galloway was NOT a labour mp, having been expelled from the labour party a while before the general election. He was running as a Respect party candidate, not a labour one. I think you should also read WP:NPOV. --Mrfixter 5 July 2005 09:52 (UTC)

[edit] Hitler's Portraits

Thanks for the support, I will expand the portraits page, but I am waiting to see if they delete it. I don't want to do a bunch of work if it is going to be deleted anyway !!

[edit] Agricultural Policy

Welcome, from FLetch. I took note of your remarks and I agree that these are *possible* rationales for policy action. Good comments too on the structure of the page as well. Clearly, the "arguments against" section needs to be tightened up and then expanded to include other criticisms, such as higher domestic food prices in the rich world. Some advice: if just alterring a heading or a few words and sentences in a section, these are considered minor edits and require little comment. Some information on me: I'm an American from Milwaukee, Wisconsin and am an economics graduate student at the university here. I'm a political centrist in that I switch between parties and candidates too, depending on the issues involved. I occasionally contribute to the ag. policy and free trade pages here. The free trade page is much more in need of cleanup.

[edit] Matthew Parris

I removed Category:British MPs because the article is also listed under Category:Gay UK MPs, which is a direct descendent of it. By the same reasoning I also removed Category:Gay, lesbian or bisexual people as it is a parent category of Category:LGBT politicians and thus Category:Gay politicians.

That having been said, Category:Gay UK MPs needs work as well. I'm working through Category:LGBT actors before I do that, though. Cheers, Cleduc 01:55, 18 July 2005 (UTC)

I beg to differ: if you click on Category:Gay UK MPs you will see at the bottom that it is a subcategory of Category:British MPs. Whether this is absolutely necessary or not I do not know -- I don't know if there's consensus that Category:British MPs has grown huge and unwieldy like [[certain other categories. However, removing Category:British MPs did not remove that attribute from that article -- it remains in the same category hierarchy nonetheless. However, I'm not terribly pleased with Category:Gay UK MPs being under Category:British MPs, but I haven't tackled that one yet. Cheers, Cleduc 14:19, 19 July 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Macropedias and Wikibooks

I saw your comments both on the Wikibooks VfD discussion on the Harry Potter Wikibook as well as a comment that you made to Aya on his user:talk page. I wanted to go over this for a moment.

There has been several attempts in the past to try and organize a private "Wikipedia" on a single subject or topic. The best example of this that I can come up with is Memory Alpha which is a Star Trek universe Wikipedia. Mind you that this is a totally independent Wiki and has nothing to do with the Wikimedia Foundation, although there does appear to be quite a bit of cross pollination between Wikipedia and Memory Alpha on a great many articles between both projects. Memory Alpha in some situations even tries to act as though it were Wikipedia in the 24th Century, describing events of the Star Trek TV series' as part of the historical record.

The "small definition" of Macropedia would be trying to create an almanac or 'pedia collection of articles that focus on a specific topic.

While something like this regarding Harry Potter would be incredibly cool to have, it is totally inconsistant with Wikibooks policy to allow something like this to be started there. I thought (and on this I need to learn more about Wikipedia) the whole purpose of a Wikiproject was precisely to organize content like this, but have the articles as a part of the mainstream Wikipedia as well. Perhaps I'm mistaken on this. There also appear to be a small subset of users on Wikipedia that are hardcore deletionists that will kill a Wikipedia article for almost any trivial reason, and some of them have tried to delete Harry Potter content because it is about fictional characters and concepts, therefore not worth preserving as human knowledge. I vehimently disagree on that point, but that is another battle to fight another day, perhaps. The rest of the arguments to keep or delete are pure political posturing and I don't think are really valid arguments for the most part. Some of the people doing the voting also don't understand Wikibooks and its purpose in being.

Literary deconstruction is, however, something that would be useful to have on Wikibooks, or an in depth analysis of the universe of Harry Potter, and how it relates to the larger world of contemporary witchcraft (including wiccan philosophies). There are numerous Wikibooks that could be created based on a study of the Rowling books, but it will take some creativity to get them put together.

I'm throwing this discussion on your Wikipedia user:talk page because it seems from your user page on Wikibooks that you frequent Wikipedia more often are are more likely to read this. I tend to hang out at Wikibooks more, and point to that on my User page as well. Feel free to contact me if you have any other questions.--Robert Horning 14:03, 9 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Anonymous editors

Since when has any part of Wikipedia become closed to anonymous editing ? I understand certain votes may be closed, but I don't believe anything else has; I don't believe you have a valid reason for telling me to get an ID. I also don't agree with your idea that WikiProject pages are "consensus pages", as Wikipedia has always favored editing without discussion first, then gaining consensus if debate breaks out.

I have done no harm to the project, and have helped it considerably, particularly on the /Images page: most images on the page were added by me and the current organization of it was made by me. I made edits to the main project page accepted by anyone who commented. I also made the book reference templates. Your assertion that anonymous editors should not be allowed is not backed by any evidence that that "protection" is needed.

I reserve the right to not get or use an ID; that is my decision, not yours, as you do not set Wikipedia policy and that policy allows full editing privileges to anonymous editors. I have been editing Wikipedia (anonymously and not) since 2003: far longer than you have. Being arrogant by deciding Wikipedia policy for all of us and then telling me what to do in the edit history is not acceptable, or polite, behavior.

That said, your edit to the to-do list was good. To incorporate it into the main project page (the server isn't smart enough to detect changes automatically), make sure to choose the small purge link on the to-do list on the main page. — 131.230.133.186 05:01, 16 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Lily and James Potter

I do find the speculation about a friendship between Lily and Severus interesting. However, if it is to be included in any Wikipedia article, it needs to be backed up with hard facts from either the books, interviews with Rowling, or other valid sources. There are a million and one fan theories out there, some of which contradict eachother, many of which have been proven wrong over time, and many others that will never be proven right or wrong. Theory, opinion, and speculation do not belong in Wikipedia, as fascinating as they often are. If you have sources to back up the theory of Lily and Severus's friendship, by all means include them. Otherwise, the extent of its inclusion should be a line akin to "Because of the way Lily chastised James for his mistreatment of Severus, some fans have theorized that Lily and Severus were friends." --Icarus 03:33, 1 October 2005 (UTC)

That Lily defended Severus when James was bullying him deserves a mention. But any information about Lily and Severus having any sort of friendship is pure speculation at this point, unless you have a link to an interview with Rowling in which she confirms it. Just because they were in the same class doesn't mean they were friends. Just because Lily didn't like the way James bullied Severus doesn't mean they were friends. They might have been, but there's no way to know one way or another. Unsourced speculation does not belong in Wikipedia. --Icarus 07:25, 1 October 2005 (UTC)

It's a possible theory. But Slughorn's personality must also be taken into account. He wants to form social and political alliances. Flattery, by means of emphasizing (or even exaggerating) Harry's mother's accomplishments, while tactfully abstaining from mentioning Harry's nemesis's accomplishments, can be easily explained as nothing more than that. Rowling may reveal information in the last book that strengthens your theory, but until then it's fanon at best. There isn't enough support to include anything beyone a brief, passing mention of fan speculation in the article. --Icarus 05:02, 3 October 2005 (UTC)

I've moved this entire conversation (plus my latest additon to it) to the James and Lily Potter article's talk page. This way it's all in one place (instead of divided between two talkpages, though I compiled it all onto mine too for convenience) and other users can weigh in with their thoughts. --Icarus 03:36, 5 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Half-Blood Prince

Hi icarus, just had a look at your latest revision. I have to still say, I don't see why you insist on going through theories of whether Harry was right or wrong in what he concluded about the potions/spells. The book does not discuss whether Harry might have made a mistake, I havn't particularly (or indeed at all) seen this point debated by anyone seriously arguing that Harry was wrong. I am not convinced it is important to argue whether he was right, or to explicitly argue at all about it in the story. What is gained by proposing alternative interpretations? Sandpiper 19:02, 15 October 2005 (UTC)

When did I say that Harry was wrong about his conclusions? I never said that he was wrong to think that the spells were written by the HBP. You, however, are implying that because it was not specifically mentioned that Harry thought the potions tips were the Prince's original work, that means that Harry didn't think that. This is not confirmed by the book. It is an extrapolation that may or may not turn out to be true. Or was it something else you thought I was saying Harry was wrong about? (BTW, if you reply, please do so on my talk page. I don't check wikipedia as often or as thoroughly as I used to, so I'll probably miss it if you post it elsewhere. Thanks!)--Icarus 03:41, 16 October 2005 (UTC)
The way it appears to me is that rather than me trying to insert theories about the Prince having written the potions tips, you are trying to insert theories that he didn't. I haven't responded point-by-point to the evidence you've given, but what it boils down to is that you have an interesting theory that may turn out to be true, but is not definite as of yet. But I've given up trying to keep such unverified speculation out of the article (even Dumbledore's house being Gryffindor is considered unverified, so I'm not just being nitpicky) because I don't have the time, and it seems clear that you're not going to budge. So instead I'm trying to present a balanced view that includes your theory, but also points out that it's not yet verified. Maybe Harry thinks the Prince wrote the potions hints, maybe he doesn't. It's unclear. Your theory that he did not cannot be included unless it is done so in a way that makes it clear that it hasn't been verified either way. There are many things that will hopefully be cleared up in the next book. Until then, no unverified theory can be presented as fact.
It occurs to me that you may not even be aware of how leading your wordings have been. Look at the descriptions of the events surrounding Dumbledore's death for examples of how words can state mere facts, but be worded in such a way to lead people off in a particular direction. For example, one editor tried to add "But things in the Harry Potter world are not always as they seem." See how this implies that that is true in this specific case, even if the sentence itself is only a general statement? If someone strategically added "But Dumbledore trusted Snape, and he demonstrated his loyalty many times in the earlier books." after a section about Snape's possible defection, that too would be a statement of fact, but the wording and placement within the article would lead readers in a specific direction. You may think that you're merely stating the facts, but you're doing so in such a way as to lead the reader in a very specific direction (intentionally or not). I still question whether or not your theory is widely accepted enough to be notable, as you have provided no evidence on that, but like I've said, I've decided to stop pursuing that line. Now my main concern is that the article not lead the reader to think that one particular as-of-yet unverified theory is more valid than another. --Icarus 04:10, 17 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] go back to blair page

return to the blair page and save it from biased apparatchik David Boothroyd (Dbiv)

Hickster 23:38, 27 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Ollivander's

Thanks for the heads up. I'll update the watchlist. Incidentally, I keep this watchlist "public" (take a look at the actual watchlist article and you will see that I'm perfectly happy to let other people help me out with the watchlist. :-) Thanks, Deathphoenix 07:02, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

Hmmm... when I think about it, I don't really see any harm in keeping it. It'll come in useful if, say, someone tries to remove the redirect and create another article. If this is against consensus, it'll let the rest of us revert this easily. If this is according to consensus, we don't have to re-add the article to the watchlist. Thanks, Deathphoenix 07:04, 3 November 2005 (UTC)
Yup, looks like I have Mr Ollivander on the watchlist as well. I think I agree with having Mr Ollivander's store merged with Diagon Alley. I think keeping info on his store and Mr Ollivander himself separate, but I'm not strongly of this opinion. I think most of the information available in the novels about Mr Ollivander is about his store anyway. --Deathphoenix 07:16, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] ...where your loyalties lie...

Hey Sandpiper, just checking in to say hi, thanks for your comments about Snape on my talk page, and I've replied there to avoid clogging up your page. See you there! Peeper 18:07, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] RE. Harry Potter

The book was Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix I'm sorry for not specifing which book. Cheers. KnowledgeOfSelf | talk. 02:49, 10 November 2005 (UTC)

The chapter is Career Advice, sorry to take so long to replie. I was caught up in a basketball game and archiving my talk page. KnowledgeOfSelf | talk. 03:36, 10 November 2005 (UTC)
LOL NO! I'm watching a Chicago Bulls game on T.V. or I guess I'm listening to it since I'm watching my editing lol. It's freezing cold outside, I don't think I'd be playin basketball right now :-D KnowledgeOfSelf | talk. 03:45, 10 November 2005 (UTC)
I wanted to leave this directly on your talk page. lol The reason Slughorn rarely mentions Snape is because Snape is either A) A former death eater, or B) A current death eater. (Who knows for sure which he is). If you will recall Slughorn doesn't like to ave the children of death eaters in his Slugclub. On the train in book 6 when Harry sneaks into the Slytherin compartment, he hears Zabini tell Draco that Slughorn doesn't seem intrested in death eaters. I left a replie on the talk page too. I look forward to your response. :-) KnowledgeOfSelf | talk. 21:51, 12 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Harry Potter Wikibooks

I will try to explain on the WikiProject talk page. It can get a little confusing and I want everyone to hear it. Just give me a few minutes. Thanks. --LV (Dark Mark) 14:34, 18 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] R.A.B.

Hello. I wanted to send this to you personally, because you already changed this once. The foreign editions of HBP were definitely not delayed. Believe me, I am a foreigner. Sure, they appeared several months after the english version, but this is true for every other Potter book as well. It is because the translators only get the book with the rest of the world and need some time to translate it. Sure, the english version of HBP was a bestseller in about every European Country, but the same was true for the english versions of GoF and OotP. OotP even was the first english book, which topped the bestsellerlist in both Germany and France. Just an example: The enlish version of OotP appeared in June, and the German and French translation in November. Compared to this, the release date of October 1st for these two translations with a worldwide release on July 16th is far from a delay. Neville Longbottom 21:49, 23 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Charles Whitman

Hello Sandpiper,

Read your suggestion about the rewrite and I find you have that rare insight some people have to try and quell a hostile environment. I have contributed vastly to the Whitman page because I have been Power of Attorney for Houston McCoy for several years now. As a new comer, I was met with hostile editing and "original research" rules that quite frankly,appear to favor the editors and not the contributors, no matter what sources are cited. I no longer contribute there because I know they will edit my contribution to their own purposes and then make it appear that their edit is just, without resources and based upon their opinion of what an abortion or unborn fetus is. It's all contrary to the records I have on Whitman and the UT Tower Tragedy (I have all the records by the way.) One member insists that since the unborn child of Claire Wilson had to be delivered by C-Section, it constitutes an abortion and not a killing by Whitman. The mother had been seriously wounded at 8 mns pregnancy and the C-Section was performed to save mother and child. Unfortunately the child has been killed from the bullet that entered her hip, destroying her colon and uterus. Now these Yahoo's want to claim it was an abortion and history does not record unborn children in the death tolls. Tell me if I'm crazy or not! Look in the reference section to the link "Cop Compensation.... or similar" that explains my positions. Thanks! Subwayjack 18:26, 14 December 2005 (UTC)subwayjack

Hello Sandpiper,

Saw your comments on the discussion page, your questions may be answered there in the new injured list section. We have at the moment reached a compromise, however, if you look at the arguments, your input would be greatly appreciated! Thanks again!Subwayjack 20:19, 16 December 2005 (UTC)su

[edit] Harry Potter Project

Thanks for your response to the questions! -Reagle 17:16, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] ArbCom question

Thanks for your question about my ArbCom candidacy. I have just answered it, and hope you think the answer is satisfactory. David | Talk 21:10, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] RFC/KM

You commented on Kelly Martin's second RfC. it is up for archival. you may vote at Wikipedia_talk:Requests_for_comment/Kelly_Martin#Archiving_this_RfC. CastAStone|(talk) 03:47, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] For your work...

Morsmordre
Morsmordre

On merging the Tom Riddle article with the Lord Voldemort article, I award you this Dark Mark. Mwahahahahahaha. No, seriously, it took some work, so thanks. Keep up the good work. --LV (Dark Mark) 18:05, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

Oh, I understand, but you have done a wonderful start on this immense task, so I thought some recognition was in order. See ya. --LV (Dark Mark) 18:09, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Well Deserved Barnstar

Tireless Contributor Barnstar

For your tireless work recently on various Harry Potter articles........ Good work Death Eater Dan 19:09, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

This is funny, I just came to your talk page about to award you a barnstar (probably a different one) for the same thing! Congratulations! --Deathphoenix 20:32, 26 January 2006 (UTC)
  • Just out of intrest (because this is the first barnstar I have awarded)..... which one would you have given him, DeathPhoenix? Death Eater Dan 22:56, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tom Marvolo Riddle

Hi Beowulf, I notice you altered one of my changes. First, Tom Marvolo Riddle is a redirect, so shouldn't be used as a link, either use Tom Riddle or Lord Voldemort. I am trying to rearrange things so that tom riddle is only linked when it is explicitly only tom who is meant. Otherwise link Lord Voldemort, which includes his whole life history. Anything which is using both names so the reader knows they are the same person should go directly to Voldemort. Thaks,Sandpiper 16:16, 27 January 2006 (UTC)

Ok, not a problem with removing the redirects. However, the link I "reverted" I still think is proper. Slughorn was not talking to "Lord Voldemort" - he was talking to a young boy who would become Lord Voldemort. If you absolutly must, then make the link
[[Voldemort|Tom Riddle]]
instead, but as far as the text is concerned, "Tom Riddle" is correct in that usage, "Lord Voldemort" is not. - Beowulf314159 16:26, 27 January 2006 (UTC)

Issues of personal style should not cloud issues of factual clarity. For now, I will ensure that the text of articles remain accurate. How you think they should be linked - in this case at least, I agree - is secondary. You may wish to propose an article merger, if one has not already been proposed. - Beowulf314159 16:56, 27 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Battle of Hogwarts

Apologies for the confusing deletion log, I've fixed it now. I think the objections were both to the title and to the material. Many of the deleters made clear they didn't think the material needed to stand alone at all, at least not in such minute detail. I'm not sure that more than one of the deleters said it was necessarily all included anywhere else, although many indicated that a more efficient version of it could be. If you want to know where someone thinks it has been merged to, you should ask them rather than me, I think. I can userfy it for you, if you'd like to see the material again (but note that this wouldn't be a license to recreate the material in article space). -Splashtalk 13:57, 16 February 2006 (UTC)

I have moved the article to User:Sandpiper/Battle of Hogwarts. Standard cautions about recreating deleted material apply. Also remember that, if you should merge parts of it, you need to provide a 'credit' in your edit summary back to the subpage, and to retain the subpage. -Splashtalk 20:42, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
Since the GFDL insists on attribution of authors, if you move the work in the article to elsewhere, we need to be able to track back to its authors, hence the suggestion of a link back to the usersubpage in the edit summary, and the consequent need to retain the subpage. It's the same as the issue of merging and deleting. -Splashtalk 21:20, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
We do not merge and delete, since this would remove the revision history and the attribution that the GFDL insists we keep. It is hypothetically possible to copy the history to the talk page, but with a multi-article merge this would be either difficult or impossible. Which is all to say that you need to retain the userfied article if you merge it anywhere for GFDL purposes. -Splashtalk 21:33, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
I've seen that document somewhere too, but it certainly isn't a provision in the text of the GFDL. No, we do not ever merge and delete, though people on AfD sometimes say we should. There request to delete is simply passed over. I suppose occasionally an admin might do a history merge or paste histories onto talk pages, but these are both very much the exception rather than the rule. -Splashtalk 23:05, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
Yes, it does. Redirects are cheap, I guess. -Splashtalk 00:14, 17 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Schools class

Nope, three preserved; (30)925 Cheltenham, (30)926 Repton 30(928) Stowe.

— Dunc|☺ 18:25, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] 4-6-0

I reverted back your reinsertion of the two pictures on 4-6-0. I feel that on a page about a wheel arrangement, pictures that are so dark the wheels cannot be seen are rather pointless. When there are already pictures in the article that don't have that flaw, I don't believe we should keep up bad pictures - it would be different if we had no other pictures to illustrate it. Matthew Brown (Morven) (T:C) 21:37, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

Ah, now I see your point - seeing beyond 4-6-0 as a wheel arrangement and showing it as a type. Fortunately most North American 4-6-0s predate 1923 (public domain cut off point in the US) and thus photos will be quite available, I hope. I'll see what else I can find, too, and if you can see if those pictures can be given a bit more clarity, that'll be good too. Matthew Brown (Morven) (T:C) 22:03, 18 February 2006 (UTC)
Or more to the point, I can (usually) get good quality photographs of most engines; go to http://fotopic.net/ and look for black five or hall class or the number of a preserved engine. Now, Stowe is a bit difficult to find, but please consider quality. If photos aren't up to scratch, then they'll be ignored, especially if we have one of the same engine which is better. Therefore, I do recommend if you want to upload your photos on the net though you use http://fotopic.net/ as a vehicle, not Wikipedia. And like Morven says, contemporary photographs are much more useful than modern photographs. Please. — Dunc|☺ 22:15, 18 February 2006 (UTC)
I think 4-6-0 should be a general history/description of the type - surviving examples should go into a supplementary list or category. The article at present is badly US-centric and needs that to be fixed, of course. 4-6-0s were popular in North America in the late 19th and early 20th century, before being supplanted by 4-6-2s and other larger power. Britain probably stuck to the type the hardest, especially the GWR. German use paralleled the American; Pacifics took over in the most part. I think there was a fair amount of use in France, Belgium et al. Matthew Brown (Morven) (T:C) 22:38, 18 February 2006 (UTC)
Yes, there currently aren't articles on those US types. There should be, of course, but it awaits someone with enough information to write the article. I think I may have enough for the Southern Pacific one, but not sure about the other.
At some point, we need articles on the evolution of the steam locomotive in each major nation and some articles comparing them; the British and American way of doing things was rather different indeed, with German often somewhere in between and France just wierd. Matthew Brown (Morven) (T:C) 00:14, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

Sorry, I was a bit short with you before, see commons:category:Preserved British steam locomotives for basically what we have. And yes, the 4-6-0 right through from Highland Railway Jones Goods to BR standard class 5, but I've sourced most of them and I think at least I know what good composition is. As a rule of thumb though, the harder the photograph is to obtain, the lower quality will be acceptable.

Also, I think we need to wait on other language Wikipedias coming up to speed (the German wikipedia is reasonably up to speed on their steam engines, go via DRG BR 52 and click on the language link), but I don't think the French, Dutch or Italians are anywhere near. Also II we are far from finishing British types, most of the grouping types are stubs, while many pre-grouping types simply don't exist. And the problem with pre-grouping types is that they are very complex (particularly Midland 0-6-0 freight engines) and information is only available in books. So, yeah, there's a lot to do. — Dunc|☺ 11:31, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Schools photo

This photo
This photo

The photo is of Repton. Cheltenham is out of service in the NRM (I think). Repton is normally based on the NYMR. It is visiting the Glos Warks Rly and for that it has been temporarily renamed/renumbered Cheltenham because that school is local to the Glos Warks Rly. — Dunc|☺ 15:55, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Image Tagging for Image:Gazelle1.jpg

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[edit] Longest streets in London

Please stop simply reverting this article back to one fixed version, it's not helpful. I moved the list in question to the talk page, so anyone that finds a verified source for any item on the list can move it back in, which is slow going, but moving the list back in its entirety wipes outs everyone's work, including those who are trying to reference the claims made one by one.

AFD reached no consensus, but that does not mean that the article must be frozen at that point in time, which is what your reverts are resulting in. Several claims were disputed, and when no references were forthcoming for several weeks, the disputed claims were moved into the talk page, until references can be found. If you can find references for any item on the list, please do so and add back in the referenced item. You mention that there are "trivially verifiable", if that is the case, references should be easy to find. If you can't find references, please consider that it's possible that these items are actually quite difficult to reference reliably. Also, please note that even if you find a reference for the lengths of all the street on the list, you should not put it back in as a numbered list unless you also have a reference that these are the 1st, 2nd, etc, longest as well, as, while the two claims of length vs longest are related, they are quite separate. Regards, MartinRe 18:42, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The Comma :-D

The comma in Differences between book and film versions of Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire. Sorry about it. I was under the impression (USA's rules, at least) that all punctuation goes on the inside of the quotation marks, should it be necessary. Considering that we're dealing with a "which" adjective clause after that, the comma is almost 99% necessary – this we agree on. But, I thought it should go on the inside. A trivial point, sure, but I'll check out some grammar rules around. Thanks for your help with the page. --Fbv65edel (discuss | contribs) 22:09, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

All righty. I don't really mind. Just as long as we understand the differences. I'm okay. --Fbv65edel (discuss | contribs) 15:06, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

Um, how about "Students (Hermione and Neville) at the Yule Ball"? Good? I'll go change it and if you don't like it you can put it back. --Fbv65edel (discuss | contribs) 01:07, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] HBP reference in GoF film

I've looked on the dvd for it on my tv, but its too small for me to be able to read the print now. I originally noticed it one of the later times I saw it in the theatre. I've gone back on the DVD, and I believe its the vial visible at 1:49:29, but since I can't read it too well on the size of screen I have I may be mistaken. I hope this helps. And if you can't find anything to verify it with, I won't be upset if you remove it. I'm quite sure I noticed it on the big screen though. Carl.bunderson 21:40, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure I'm thinking of the one that you mentioned first. Its like at the crook of Snape's arm as he's holding the veritaserum. I am unable to read it however, on my tv. If I ever get a chance to see it in a cinema again I'll do so to try n figure it out for sure. Carl.bunderson 03:00, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Re: Bellatrix quotes

"Hi, I noticed you reinserted the quotes that anon had removed, but placed them in the text. I am not at all convinced by his argument. The quotes were relevant information about Bella, so I do not see what difference it makes where they go in the article, somewhere they are separately explained, or all collected together. They were not irrelevant to the text. I would have placed this comment on his page, but it seemed pointless for an IP with only one edit. Sandpiper 23:57, 17 April 2006 (UTC)"

What do you want me to do about it? Revert it, or place your comments on the Bellatrix/Anonymous IP talk pages where they belong. I'm the person who created the "Memorable quotes" section; I obviously thought they were important to the article and not copyright violations. I didn't bother evaluating the justification for the deletion of the section; people will delete or change what they don't like, regardless of wiki policy. I'm just looking out for my contributions by situating them in such a way that they won't be deleted again. Guermantes 17:20, 18 April 2006 (UTC)


[edit] about Stege molleporten.jpg

Hello - I'm sorry, but my english writing is not the best , but the text in the danish artikel says something like : The Mill gate in Stege was one of three towngates in the old defensive wall. It is mensioned for the first time in 1531 in the Town-book of Stege, but is probably from the late 1400.

The drawing is from the late of 1800.

(Mølleporten i Stege var en af tre byporte i det gamle fæstningsanlæg. Den nævnes første gang i 1531 i Stege By's bog, men er formentlig fra slutningen af 1400-tallet)

Yours sinsirely Nico-dk 08:17, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] New Hogwarts teacher?

Hi Sandpiper, you put in some interesting points in Harry Potter: Book Seven, and although I've become a little less caring about analysis or speculation, there's one point in there that I found interesting:

  • Someone from Harry's class will become a Hogwart's teacher[2].

I took a quick look at the above link and only found discussion about the new DADA teacher in HBP and how he will be someone who has a magic eye and be able to face down Draco Malfoy. Could you give me a small passage of text to search for to find the area where JKR says the newest Hogwarts teacher will come from Harry's class? Thanks, Deathphoenix ʕ 14:06, 19 May 2006 (UTC)

Ah, that's right, now I remember the quote. Danke for the information! --Deathphoenix ʕ 15:46, 19 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Snape

Hi Sandpiper. I noticed you reverted my edits on the Snape page because I removed the HarryPotter template but I think that if you think it's a good idea for it to be on there I think it should be on every one, Harry, Ron, Hermione, Dumbledore, Lockhart, Nearly Headless Nick, Fred Weasley etc. ForestH2

[edit] Creation

Do you think we should create a template like the one you said on my talk page? ForestH2

[edit] Alignment.

hahaha... so how do you feel about being neutral? (answer: whatever) --Deathphoenix ʕ 12:19, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

It must hurt. ;-) --Deathphoenix ʕ 14:22, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Further Information

The school website has a load of information about the school's history if you would like it. www.wps.org.uk


[edit] Image Tagging Image:440locomotivestowe.jpg

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[edit] Re: Genetics

Hi Sandpiper. As I mentioned to Tasc on User_talk:Tasc#Genetics in Nicholas II and elsewhere, the genetics information is probably unnecessary and therefore inappropriate for articles on the more obscure nobles. This is especially true because, as you said, it is true of thousands of people.

The genetics information is significant for a few, however, like Nicholas II of Russia, the czarina, and her ancestor Queen Victoria, and maybe some very notable ancestors of these, because the mitochondrial genotyping of these people was one of the first and most widely-reported applications of mitochondrial genetics. --Saforrest 19:16, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] License tagging for Image:Tunbridge Wells station eastern approach.jpg

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[edit] Wikiproject Novels

Regarding your question about the tag on the talk page of Severus Snape, members of the Wikiproject Novels will assess the quality and importance (for the novels project, that is) of this article. Every novel and fictional character that has a separate article is in scope of this project. However, as you are not a member of Wikiproject Novels (I think) you don't have to do anything. It will be evaluated by us (eventually). Errabee 11:40, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

It seems we could really use your help. Why don't you become a member of Wikiproject Novels? You are not obligated to do anything, but that way you can be part of the assessment team. Our assessment procedure can be found here: Wikipedia:WikiProject Novels/Assessment. Indeed many people cannot say they have read that many novels, not even I (and I have read a lot of novels). So your help would really be appreciated. Errabee 11:54, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Stop

Please stop. If you continue to vandalize pages, as you did to Talk:Harry Potter 7 (book), you will be blocked from editing Wikipedia. —Wknight94 (talk) 23:20, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Harry Potter 7/seven/VII/sqrt(49)

Reference: My talk page

Hi. Thanks for the words of welcome.

I came across the discussion at WP:RM. I opposed the change in article name from "7" to "seven" for stylistic reasons, which I outlined in the post (the "rule" that numbers be spelled out if less than some arbitrary value, which I held to be applicable only to prose writing, and not to the numbering system of books, movies, chapters, etc).

That being said, I have no knowledge of any prior or subsequent movements of the page, or of anything else to do with the pages for that matter. I merely stopped by to voice my opinion on the article naming debate as it stood at that moment; my interest here was merely one of housekeeping. In all probability, I won't be back this way again. With respect to HP's world, I consider myself a "Muddle" (i.e. hasn't read the books; enjoys the movies; annoys fans with questions like "so, like, he's the bad guy, right?"; and further annoys fans by saying "Muddle" prompting said fans to indignantly correct him to say "Muggle", whereupon he merely smiles and shrugs).

Cheers. --SigPig 11:11, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Harry potter 7 title

Hello Nice to see that some new faces have recently become interested in commenting on the article. However, I am interested to know how you became involved with the page? It would seem that someone came along and changed the title without any discussion. Then someone started a debate about a different title. A number of people I have never seen comment on a Harry Potter page then opposed the proposed further move, and in just 7 days, you yourself closed the debate. This is quite extraordinary attention for a HP page.

No one has yet explained the grounds for changing the page from its original title. Can you explain why this was done? It was also done by someone who had never edited the page before and was pretty inexperienced. A justification was given, but not explained. Then (as you noticed) an anon deleted the debate. Also very strange. Why would anyone do this? Sounded like someone wanted to avoid discussion. While I do not think it likely that people would have opposed the page title change if it is satifactorily explained, this has still not been done. I do not see how any change of title can be discussed or considered to have been voted unless someone explains why it needed to be moved in the first place. Sandpiper 07:49, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

By the way, i tried to look up the definition of vandalism. it says: "Vandalism is any addition, deletion, or change of content made in a deliberate attempt to compromise the integrity of Wikipedia.". It then goes on at great length. Perhaps you would like to reconsider the comment you placed on my user page? Sandpiper 08:29, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
Oh good, an easy question. Page moves can be done by anyone at anytime as long as they're within reason (i.e., don't rename Harry Potter 7 (book) to The new Harry Potter book that is going to be so cool!!! or Harry Potter 7 (book) on Wheels!!!!). For this, consult WP:BOLD. If someone wants to move an article to a title that is obstructed, they need to use WP:RM. For this, consult the first two or three sections of WP:RM. This is what Cafzal (talk • contribs) did. Several people logged votes and opinions and the result was an overwhelming (by comparison to other move requests) vote to not bother with the move. Rather than comment on the open move request, you kept asking why it was moved in the first place. The problem with getting persistent with that question at that point (as you are continuing to be now) is that you don't own the article. For this, consult WP:OWN. No one owes you an explanation as to why it was moved in the first place. You can politely ask and you can propose some other move but, if no answer is given, you should probably drop it. Anyway, back to the move request: Then I became involved. I'm an administrator. Administrators go through WP:RM and close out requests. This move request came up and I closed it out. That means it's closed. As in closed forever. Read the red text in {{polltop}} and {{pollbottom}}, "Please do not modify it." That means do not modify it. Ever. You modified it. The first time, I re-closed it and tried to be firm in my edit summary. Then you modified it again. Then you got a nasty message on your talk page. I was being kind with that simple message - other admins would have put up one of the nasty red stop signs or even just blocked you outright. Hopefully that clears up your confusion. You're free to go to WP:RM and you're free to use WP:BOLD to move it somewhere else but the community has spoken pretty clearly on that particular move request. —Wknight94 (talk) 11:25, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
In reply to the first comment, I was involved with the article before, but I have since created a new account. About the article renaming, if I remember correctly, it went from "Harry Potter book seven" to Harry Potter 7 (book). I think that the page was moved because somebody said "7" is more encyclopedic than "seven" and is more consistent with other articles. Myself, I prefer the newer title because I think that "book" should not be in the middle of the title, but at the end. However, I don't feel too strongly either way but I don't think that it should be changed back. 0L1 17:44, 21 September 2006 (UTC)


Ah, I think we are getting somewhere. you are saying that someone had initiated a formal request to move the page, and that you as an admin who does that sort of thing, closed the debate according to established procedures and timetable? Right. That does explain why a number of new editors had suddenly decided to comment on an HP page.
This is the first time that I have become aware either that there is such a procedure, or that it had been initiated. All I saw was that a discussion was going on, on the page, about whether or not to move it. this followed someone having already moved the page without any comment except for a cryptic sugestion that the name violated rules. I may be wrong on that, because it appeared to have already been moved at least twice before this debate. Other strange things were happening, as you commented the debate had been deleted entirely the last time I saw the page before you closed it. Then, along comes yet another total stranger and decides to 'close' the debate. This does not happen. Discussions about alterations to these pages typically meanders on for weeks or months, frequently simply petering out. So, I saw my clear course as to find out what was happening, first by asking questions on the talk page, and then when no information had yet appeared, insisting that the debate continue. This seems to me entirely in accord with 'any addition, deletion, or change of content made in a deliberate attempt to maintain the integrity of Wikipedia.', to approximately reverse the summary statement describing 'vandalism'.
Now, I have not had time to read all the pages of advice to admins on how they are supposed to warn people that they are breaking 'rules'. It is quite clear to me at least, that I was not aware I was interefering with your formal procedure to debate a name change. It is rather implict therefore, that I was certainly not warned about what was going on. I am a bit unclear also about what a 'stage 3' warning is. The description page would seem to imply that an admin is supposed first to issue a stage 1, then a stage 2..etc warnings.
As a responsible editor, it is my responsibility to find out what is happening when a bunch of total strangers turn up and start mucking about with a page title which has been perfectly happily sitting there for considerable time, for no apparent reason. I did this initially merely by asking a question on the page, to which none of the voters replied. This is not now surprising since the people concerned were simply 'voters', who had just dropped in to voice an opinion, and would not have understood why I was asking questions which to them seemed irrelevant, even if they came back and saw them. I did get a reply from t-dot, who is a regular contributor, but who I suspect was as bemused as me by what was going on. As it appeared to me, several total strangers staged a mock debate over changing the title. I did not recognise anyone as people who might normally sensibly consider a question such as the best name for an HP article. You are quite right that no one 'owns' an article, but nonethelless people generally form themselves into groups who 'look after' articles. I 'wrote' a good part of this one. None of the voters, or yourself' seem to me to fit this description. It is not hepfull to wiki if 'bands' of people wander about changing titles as they please.
It would seem there has been something of a misunderstanding of what was going on, and that all you were doing was following procedures. There would seem to be a fault in the system, as the nature of the debate is not apparent to anyone (like me) simply scrolling to the bottom of the talk page to look for new entries. Perhaps, as an admin, you could suggest doing something about that?
This is all the more disappointing, since I noticed on your RFA page that you stated that you would never find yourself in the situation where you were involved in a disagreement with an editor, where you had not followed all the correct procedures according to guidelines. As I said before, perhaps you would like to reconsider the comment you placed on my user page? Sandpiper 19:05, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
Oh, and I still have no view on the original name change, since I still havn't really found out who did it or why they thought it a good idea. My point was that arbitrarily closing a discussion on this is rather futile, when nothing has really been decided. However, it seems you and I were debating different things. Sandpiper 19:05, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

My first reaction here is that you may be taking things a tad too seriously. It was a small faux pas on your part followed by a warning from me when the faux pas was repeated. Out of that, you've gone to the lengths of pulling up my WP:RFA and reading through the whole thing and even extracted information out (BTW I'm honestly not sure which comment you're referring to in there). All of that over an article which is probably going to be renamed two or three more times before a title is finally announced, after which it will be renamed four or five more times for a variety of peculiar reasons (probably having "...ON WHEELS!!!!" at the end for a short time). Really - it's not worth it. We should both be adding and fixing content here rather than continuing this. It sounds like you've been here much longer than me and you've never seen a WP:RM in action so you may want to research some of the processes here as well. I wish you luck in improving the article on the Harry Potter 7 book, regardless of the article's title!  :) —Wknight94 (talk) 19:37, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

I have spent several hours trying to sort out what is going on here. finding your RFA is the least of the difficulties in trying to find out what was supposed to happen. This situation illustrates one of the problems with wiki, that the more people write rules about things, the more impossible it becomes to read them all, never mind follow them. I try not to read any more rules than I absolutely need to, because, as you say, it wastes a huge amount of time. If I need to move a page by debate, then I shall reluctantly find out how. Perhaps you might give some consideration to the difficulty which happened here, that someone stumbles into the middle of one of your formal debates, without any indication of what it is. The title doesn't help, really, unless you already know what it implies. I see that there is a notice at the top of the page, but I didn't even stop to read the guff there (quite a bit), never mind realise it related to the debate at the bottom.
You are also right, that people get very upset by small offenses. However....if you could see your way clear towards deleting the 'stop' note which you placed on my talk page? (but I promise not to delete the section again, now I know why it is there)
Oh, there is a little box to click to show that an edit is a miinor one. One reason i seldom use it, is that experience suggests there is no such thing as a minor edit, including spelling and punctuation. Sandpiper 20:10, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

[copied from other page....]Now, to get back to present time.... the section i think I had in mind in your RFA was the following. The questioner was asking about a different situation, but it seemed to me reasonable to assume that your response was transferrable. Sandpiper 00:59, 30 September 2006 (UTC)


4. Question from Axiomm: How are you willing to handle the following situations: You tag a user as a "sockpuppet" and the user removes it. Would you leave that person alone or would you retag?

I would retag immediately and explain to the user that s/he would need to go through proper channels to get the tag removed, just as the proper channels were followed to get the tag attached in the first place. —Wknight94 (talk) 14:30, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
The problem is people don't understand the guidelines in regards to whether a user's homepage should be tagged. I trust however that you'll be patient with users and use proper judgement. Axiomm 15:32, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
Well yes. As I said, I would explain why I tagged their user page - and I would direct them to the applicable policies and processes. But, if I am the one who added the tag in the first place - as your scenario specifies - then I applied it for a reason and it should not be removed except by an admin. Even if the WP:SSP process is complete and they are deemed not to be a sockpuppet, an admin would still be the one removing the tag. (Sorry if I'm belaboring the point.) —Wknight94 (talk) 16:18, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

Must admit, it does again illustrate the need to read carefully and understand what someone has written before commenting. I see that the section jumped out at me as being immediately relevant rather more than it does on later reading after a weeks cooling down. However, you do imply that you always follow proper channels, and will always be patient and use proper judgement with users.

Now, my request that you reconsider the original note you added to my page, and remove it? (hope this comes out ok after I re-created it) Sandpiper 00:59, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Harry Potter seven

See my reply to your inquiry. ~ clearthought 21:05, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Hello again!

I took a long wikibreak, and am just becoming active again.

I just saw your question about the effects of low doses of radiation. For a long time, all the low-dose information we had was estimates from A-bomb survivors - very poor estimates of doses. Gradually, a pool of data was built up on nuclear plant workers and submariners - although this was a very healthy lot. All the information available was incorporated into the BEIR Reports (Biological Effects of Ionizing Radiation), of which the latest is BEIR VII (2005).

BEIR VII says any radiation is dangerous (see [3] and [4]).

Now, BEIR VII apparently did not incorporate data from those exposed during the Chernobyl accident. However, the non-soviet nations were very diligent about radiation monitoring, and in the future we likely will have more reliable low-dose data fr certain types of cancers. Most cancers won't be trackable, though, because smoking and other health factors kill so many more people for these cancers.

So, in answer, the data we have says to act as if any radiation is dangerous. Simesa 07:25, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] I've Replied

See my reply at User talk:John Reaves#severus Snape John Reaves 19:46, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

Okay, sounds good. On a side note, good job on the copyediting, it really helps the article's quality.
John Reaves 19:58, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Any Help

I have a minor quarrel going on with Duane543 on The Slug Club talk page (he thinks the Club is just the name for all Slughorn's favourites given to them by others, and that accordingly Lucius - and Harry - as Slughorn's favourites should be listed as part of it; I think the Club is an informal but quite real gathering around Slughorn of those who are willing to accept his patronage (thus, not Harry, who refused to join), and that consequently we don't know if Malfoy was a member, since we only know that Slughorn once favoured him. Want to leap in? Michaelsanders 12:39, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

The discusion contines!!! Are you still going to be a part of it? (Duane543 17:06, 7 December 2006 (UTC))

[edit] Assessment comments

The comments you are after are lined to via the "here" word in the verbage at the bottem of any articles NovelsWikiProject banner. Most don't have them present although these two novels do. Let me know how you get on. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 09:12, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Assistance

If you are interested, please give assistance in the articles for deletion. Students in Harry Potter's Year and Harry Potter characters birthday list have both been put up for deletion, which I feel is extraordinarily unreasonable, especially since the deletionists clearly have no grasp of the relevance of the articles. Please help. Michaelsanders 21:23, 10 December 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Snape: not fictional traitor

Well, I read your comments on the talk page but I'm not so sure about your standpoint. Are you netral, or do you support this or not? May I ask: Could you please get involved again in the debate and help me in this kind of thing since the talk keeps taking long while the whole problem seems not easy to be solved, if you want to remove that unfair category and feel interested. Arhugefan 16:58, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Uh, if not, I take back those words, thanks for your time. Arhugefan 17:01, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Arfan (Talk) has smiled at you! Smiles promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by smiling to someone else, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Smile to others by adding {{subst:smile2}} or {{subst:smile3}} to their talk page with a friendly message. Happy editing!

→ I want you to know that I'm very happy about the fact that you removed the category (without any objection from anyone). Thank you very much. I really should have shown my appreciation much earlier. Wish you well. Arfan (Talk) 10:15, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Image:Kensingtonpalacesnow.jpg

You wouldn't happen to have a higher resolution version of this anywhere, would you? I'd love it as my desktop wallpaper, such a nice picture :) JoeBaldwin 11:45, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Deathly Hallows

Since we don't know much about HP's Hallows, I think a separate article encompassing every meaning the word can have would be the best solution.

If you ask me how I see the section in the DH article, I find it sufficient in its current aspect. The best thing, for me, would be reworded definitions using dictionaries, then maybe illustrations of various (if we can find anything else that arthurian legends) uses of the word in literature.

Concerning a precise description of the arthurian hallows, although it would absolutely not be original research, I think that, as far as DH is concerned, it would be off-topic.

In that case, a separate entry for Hallows appears to be the best solution, since it would (h)allow (^^) the contributors to be exaustive about arthurian legends and other myths/literary uses.

However, what I would not like on the DH article, is definitely an exhaustive mention of the arthurian hallows, then an insistance about arthurian influences on HP, then an insistance on the similarities between Horcruxes and arthurian hallows, in order to build a point, whatever it might be, concerning the meaning of the HP Hallows.

Concerning arthurian legends, there are as many versions of the stories as there were authors to retell them. However one of the most known versions, that really established some of the basics, that is, Chrétien de Troyes's, has only four "hallows", the ones mentionned in the DH article. Other authors have surely created other relics, it's possible, yes...

As for refs to lexicon and all about theories, I basically agree with that. We could say it like that: "There are many theories trying to deduce the meaning of the word Hallows using various axes/sources etc, available on websites like Lexicon etc". However it would be essencial to check if it wouldn't be concidered as spam...

Folken de Fanel 21:39, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

I have studied Chrétien de Troyes in highschool, but that was 2 years ago, and it was not as deep a study as have done professors and all. So I know a bit about it, but not really more...

The plot continuity with Horcruxes and all is relevant, well...in a "plot continuity section", however I can't see the use of mentioning it where we talk about Hallows. So yes, these mentions are relevant, but only in the "plot continuity".

Concerning the article, the version before mine appeared to me as blatant OR, that's why I modified it. When I noticed than another contributor had raised doubts (and that he had reverted it also), I decided to rework it on my own.

When I speak about arthurian influences, I don't necessarily talk about Horcruxes, but lulurascal has pointed out an interesting things, that there are indeed authentic literary critics that said Harry was an "athurian character" or something like that. So while it's perfectly relevant in a literary analysis section, it was in "meanings of Hallows" just to build a point, and that's why I edited it out. However I wouldn't write about the arthurian refs in HP in the hypothetical Hallows article (unless if documented with essays by literary critics), as it would also be building a point...Folken de Fanel 23:17, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Boesen School (District 28)

Check out WP:PROD for more on why the above article was deleted, then just now undeleted. Cheers. youngamerican (ahoy hoy) 21:16, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Half-blood Prince

Point by point...

"well, we meet again. Rather than argue in the edit tags, I thought we might do it here.

"I'm willing to go as far as mystery is solved, but not truth is revealed. As I said, the one truth we can be sure of, is that any truth revealed at the end of HBP is likely to be wrong. So it is not accurate to claim here that a truth has been revealed. We wait to se what will happen."

'The mystery is solved' seems thoroughly inappropriate. It implies a Marple-esque neat solving and wrapping up of the solution by the detective. Which isn't what happened. The 'truth', as it stands at the end of HBP, was revealed by the criminal. The only 'solving of a mystery' was Hermione's confirmation that, yes, Snape's parents were a witch and a muggle, so he must have been the HBP. Suggest a better phrase, perhaps, but 'the mystery is solved' is just...wrong.

"I'm not hugeley exercised in arguing over Slughorn loans Harry and Ron a pair of the spare Advanced Potion-Making textbooks kept in the Potions storeroom.. but I note that now you have left out Libacious Borage."

I'll put him back.

"Ill gotten. How is Harry's achievement ill-gotten? He only used the book Slughorn gave him."

Ill-gotten - to Hermione - because he didn't get his success legitimately. He cheated. That's why Hermione got so angry (unlike his trouncing of her in DADA, where she asks him to teach her).

"What is the issue with explaining the anagram properly? If you don't give the full name and full anagram translation then it sounds bad and is misleading, whereas it is a precise anagram. In that respect it is quite different to translating Severus Snape as HBP. Not in any sense an anagram."

???

"half blood is an insult, why use the euphemism and highbrow 'offensive connotations'?"

Prince isn't an insult, as such, it has thoroughly muggle connotations (since 'there are no wizarding Princes'; there are - or were - wizarding lords, given the Peverills, Bloody Baron, and Sir Nicholas); half-bloods, to purebloods, are better than muggle-borns. So the name has poor associations, but isn't necessarily an outright insult.

"For Harry, it means "the boy who had been so clever, who had helped him so much", and whom he refused to think badly of, is, in fact, his bitter enemy.

"This is not at all obvious to me, but an interpretation of the book. What I read was that Harry was in shock, and frankly hadn't had time to decide what he thought. Thus I object to claiming he had a settled view."

"It's just that I was sort of right about the Half-Blood Prince business, she said tentatively. D'you have to rub it in, Hermione? How d'you think I feel about that now?" "murderer, Harry spat." "Hermione had just inadvertantly reminded him, he, Harry, had been taken in...the boy who had helped him so much...helped him...it was an almost unendurable thought now..." "I had proof Snape was [evil] too" "His animosity was all for Snape" "And if I meet Severus Snape along the way, so much the better for me, so much the worse for him." I think it's pretty clear what Harry thinks regarding both Snape and the Prince. Yes, maybe he'll change his mind, but he certainly isn't showing any intention of doing so.

"How this sickening revelation will affect Harry's quest to destroy Voldemort and avenge Dumbledore's murder remains to be seen.

"Maybe Harry did find this revelation sickening, but that is not what the article says. The article says that an average reader would find the revelation sickening. Well, I didn't, nor did those those I have spoken to personally. Interesting, exciting, amusing, audience gripping... If you want to say Harry found it sickening, then I am open to suggestions (been a while since I read it, mind), but as I said on the point above, I'm still not convinced Harry really had time to think much at all about this."

I'll change that to make it clearer, but as I said above, Harry's making his feels on the matter abundantly clear.

"I didn't change it, but I also thought para 3 Slughorn loans read better when it explains at the start that the book had potions tips, jinxes and the nickname. This is for reasons of collecting together information; place all sentences explaining the books content together. Still no problem then in the next para talking about the difference between potions and jinxes. I felt this also gave the last sentence of the Slughorn para more punch: Enthused by his unprecedented success... reads better if you do not have to stick in the sentence immediately before explaining how the prince comes into it, because I dealt with that at the para start. Sandpiper 23:02, 19 February 2007 (UTC)"

Perhaps.

Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Michaelsanders"

Michaelsanders 23:31, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Sirius Black

"just had a quick look at it, and there seem to be a few errors here and there. I don't see any reason to suppose Siius was miserable at 16. He seems to have always enjoyed himself. Perhaps what is written in the article is not what you mean?"

Possibly needs rephrasing - the context, however, makes it clear that we know that he was miserable in his homelife by the time he left, although we don't know the prior circumstances.
"The thing is, that the line you put in is not necesarily mean he was miserable solely at home. It can be read as an add on point that he was miserable always. But I am not convinced he was necessarily miserable at home. He might have enjoyed baiying his parents untill they finally threw him out."
"I ran away from home...I'd had enough...[Why did I] leave?...Because I hated the whole lot of them...I don't like being back here...I never thought I'd be stuck in this house again."


"Which bit didn't you like about James trying to impress Lily? that's what it says. He keeps looking at her, even gets her to laugh, and then is really pissed when she tells him off. can't understand why she isn't impressed."

You claimed that the bullying of Snape by Sirius and James was not only because they were bored and disliked him (both clearly stated in the text), but because James wanted to impress Lily by mistreating Snape. The last doesn't seem to have any specific textual support, or general textual support; and, as I said in the summary, given Lily's reaction, I don't really how it could be seen as intended to impress her.
"This is not stated explicitly, but step by step. James writes her initials, he keeps looking at the girls ,sys so every now and then, gets her to laugh at him sttacking Snape, and finally is shocked that she is not on his side. His loving her is explicit, his disappointment at her not being pleased by what he has done is also."
You claimed they attacked Snape because James " wished to impress Lily Evans, who James was in love with." There is no reason to think that - James responded to Sirius' complaints that he was 'bored' by saying, "This'll liven you up...look who it is...". They then attack Snape and mock him, before attacking him with magic. None of this could be reasonably considered to be an attempt to impress Lily, especially since James would presumably have known her character. Yes, James had a crush on her - 'in love' would be a little extreme - but there is no reason to think that the attack got her angry with him was meant to be an attempt to impress her.


"Where do we learn animagi are invulnerable to werewolf bites when transformed?Sandpiper 00:58, 2 March 2007 (UTC)"

"They couldn't keep me company as humans, so they kept me company as animals," said Lupin. "A werewolf is only a danger to people." Michaelsanders 11:42, 2 March 2007 (UTC)
"'a werewolf is only a danger to people, does not mean that 'transformed animagi are invulnerable to werewolves'.I didn't understand it mean that, and not did others. I don't know if anyone has asked rowling about it.
found you this quote 'Sirius was bleeding, there were gashes across his muzzle and back...' P.279 UK poa CH20. So Siruis suffered harm from lupins attack as a werewolf. Not invulnerable then."
A werewolf is only a 'danger' to people, not to animagi. Lupin harmed Sirius, as your quote shows - but Sirius did not become a werewolf. So Sirius was never in danger from the werewolf. Michael Sanders 14:32, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
It's clear that James had a crush on Lily, yes, and those quotes show that. What they don't show is any indication that his bullying of Snape was to impress Lily, rather than to alleviate his and Sirius' boredom or because he hated Snape (both clearly stated in the text). Blackmail, perhaps - "go out with me, and I'll never lay a wand on old Snivelly again". But there is no reason to think it is to impress her.
As for the werewolf thing - Lupin said, "A werewolf is only a danger to people". Since people and animals are equally at risk of being shredded, he can only have been talking about the werewolf curse - which, as we saw when he attacked Sirius in PoA, didn't infect Sirius when in his animagical form. Michael Sanders 19:01, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

It's clear that James had a crush on Lily, yes, and those quotes show that. What they don't show is any indication that his bullying of Snape was to impress Lily, rather than to alleviate his and Sirius' boredom or because he hated Snape (both clearly stated in the text). Blackmail, perhaps - "go out with me, and I'll never lay a wand on old Snivelly again". But there is no reason to think it is to impress her.

Er, so why so many references in the text to his keep looking at the girls, and his obsession with one girl in particular. It is woven through the whole scene that James is interested in how she reacts to his actions. It even ends by explicitly saying that her reaction is important to him. Incidentally, it is incorrect that James and Sirius attacked Snape. Sirius only tagged along, James started it and the article ought to make that clear. James is the real bully in this scene.

As for the werewolf thing - Lupin said, "A werewolf is only a danger to people". Since people and animals are equally at risk of being shredded, he can only have been talking about the werewolf curse - which, as we saw when he attacked Sirius in PoA, didn't infect Sirius when in his animagical form. Michael Sanders 19:01, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

er, yes, exactly, so you cannot say that (animagi are invulnerable to werewolf bites when transformed), because they simply aren't. They may be protected from the magical aspect, presumably because they are not human, but they are not proteced from the physical aspect of the attack. Sandpiper 19:28, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Favor...

Hello, Sandpiper! I think that you're a really great editor, so, do you think that you could sign my autograph book, maybe? It would be an honor if you did! See ya later, Sandpiper! Cremepuff222 (talk, sign book) 23:37, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, about that... Can it be deleted? Cremepuff222 (talk, sign book) 22:39, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Deathly hallows

You have manipulated my words.

Be sure I'm not going to let this just "happen". There will be consequences for you.

If you refuse to play the game according to the rules (ie if you're not ready to accept that someone can contradict you), it will only backfire at you.

I had expressed my concerns, however you have specifically picked up a sentence that didn't include these concerns, and you just showed it, ignoring everything I could have said after, you have talked in my place and you have manipulated my words.

You have not played according to the rules. It's just unfair, and Wikipedia is just not like that. Wikipedia is a collaborative work, and you can't just eliminate the other by manipulating their words, you have to accept you're not the only one here, you have to play with others if you want it to work.

You have obviously played alone, and you have used an insidious trick to get me out of the way, and Wikipedia doesn't work like that. Folken de Fanel 00:50, 6 March 2007 (UTC)


I have proposed my own amendments to the text, that you conveniently ignored and tried to hide when an administrator went on the talk page.
I have expressed my concerns and you know what they are. Do not pretend you don't, please.
I have said the article (if there has to be a need to be thorough about other unrelated hallows in an HP article) needed to have literary refs to other forms of hallows. Folken de Fanel 07:50, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Regardless of what Folken de Fanel said, or what he meant, he is now saying he does not agree with the change. I'd advise you to work towards a solution you both agree on. Trebor 15:45, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] In regards to your recent restoration of archived comments on the talk page for DH

I'd like to draw your attention on something:

Wikipedia:Vandalism#Types_of_vandalism:

"Modifying users' comments:
Editing other users' comments to substantially change their meaning (e.g. turning someone's vote around), except when removing a personal attack (which is somewhat controversial in and of itself). Signifying that a comment is unsigned is an exception. Please also note that correcting other users' typos is discouraged."

Please realise that if you continue to pretend I'm not objecting to your proposal, if you continue to ignore my arguments and bring back old sentences to try to make me sound like I agree with you, or worse, if you continue to tweak the archive system in order to restore obsolete comments while conventiently "forgetting" to restore my most recent opinion on the subject, you could be concidered a vandal.

Please keep this in mind when you'll contribute to the talk page. I really don't want to have to give you proper warnings, but I don't want you to continue to use insidious methods in place of arguments either. Stop this before it becomes too serious. Folken de Fanel 00:34, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

As I've stated, I have merely restored the actual ongoing debate. As I've said the text you restored was obsolete and did not correspond to any ongoing debate I had participated to. The section you restored was not ongoing, yet you pretended it was (a convenient way to hide any remark I might have said against your text). The section I restored was ongoing.
If you want to argue that you established a continuity in related sections (in your second restoring only), fair enough, however do not accuse me of anything or it will backfire at you, as your responsibility in altering comments and making me say what I didn't say has been undisputably established.
You have made errors in understanding original postings, you have ignored any improvement I requested, and I certainly didn't say what you pretend I said. I said it was good but needed improvement, instead of adressing my remarks you merely tried to insert your text. Doing that without even trying to add whatever text was needed was a mark of disrespect, which then prompted my total disagreement, besides still having reclamations about the text. Then I saw what were your arguments and how I was right to object to the edit, seeing what you had in mind when writing it. Folken de Fanel 22:04, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
I had made comments to which you didn't answer.
No, sources for information about HP are not sufficiently reputable for their content to be explained here. Unless they have already read book 7, they are not, and JKR has never ever stated that these websites were "sufficiently reputable for Wikipedia".
They do not present facts, they present unsubstanciated theories.
Wiki never presents uncertain informations (please note that informations are not uncertain. Either they are information, or interpretations. Wiki presents information, and in certain specific subjects which are still a source of debate for the whole mankind, interpretations made by persons that have enough credential to do so, because interpretations are the only thing mankind can have. And in any case there absolutely not interpretations lazily thrown on a message board by 14 year old kids on message boards, they are very serious works that have been evaluated, tested, researched, for years and years, based on various scientific observations, calculated with computers, and all. Which is not the case of HP7, it's not one of the great mysteries of the world, it exists, it has been written, and JKR knows the answer, and only her (and her editors). That fans which have no credential to present any theory (have they read book 7 ? No. So they aren't reliable). It's just that a bunch of kids dreaming about a soon to be published book. So, absolutely nothing notable here. The book will be published in a few months, so we are not interested in theories.
One last thing : it's your proposed text, it's you who have to improve it. So either you take into account others' opinion, or you don't, and in that case you don't propose anything. Folken de Fanel 13:44, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
Well, you're wrong on this one, and you know it. WP doesn't report unsubstanciated theories. Folken de Fanel 19:27, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Re:Jimbo

Erm, I'm not quite sure what you're talking about per your cryptic message on my talk page. If you're talking about the Essjay thing, I couldn't care less about him. Not in a bad way, but I only really heard about it yesterday. Jimbo is not God however - you statement about the design of a paperclip is remarkably similar to the ol' "God makes every blade of grass" quote... Spawn Man 04:15, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] HP wiki

Hi, I meant to do this a long time ago, but I guess I forgot. You are the "Sandpiper" on the HP wiki right? John Reaves (talk) 04:58, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Okay, thanks for the confirmation. John Reaves (talk) 08:07, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Cygnus Black

Thanks for pointing that out to me. The best thing to do is for both of us to search for some indication of why the date has been changed on the Lexicon (if necessary, try e-mailing). If there is good reason to think that it derives from Rowling, we change it (for my preference, noting the change in the article); if the Lexicon has changed it off its own bat for a good reason, we don't change it in the article, but note that the Lexicon has changed it and give the reasoning. Michael Sanders 19:08, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The Original Barnstar

The Original Barnstar
I, GoldenIrish, present you The Original Barnstar for your exceptional work on the Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows article.GoldenIrish 17:58, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

(Note: This is the first Barnstar I have ever given.)

[edit] Horcrux

I know - I was intending to do it at 18:15, like I promised; however, internet packed up, and I hadn't checked the horcrux article today anyway; bit of a surprise, I must say, to discover. Anyway, hopefully, the miscreant will be willing to discuss the issue again, instead of taking it upon himself to view his sole voice as a majority view. Michael Sanders 18:38, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Oh dear. So sad. As sad as wine in your glass and a seat by the fire.
If we're lucky, he'll perhaps learn from this that he is not above the rules. Michael Sanders 18:44, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
Delusions of grandeur; although one might hope our's will share the orignal's fate. Michael Sanders 02:52, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Dates in Harry Potter

Dates in Harry Potter - I've recreated the article. I've done some major rewriting, and a lot of sourcing, and I've readded it to the main section because I think it's in good enough condition now to pass muster; however, I haven't reached the bottom yet, which consequently is still in bad shape. Please could you help if you get the chance? Michael Sanders 01:11, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Dates in Harry Potter

There seemed a clear consensus to delete, and I felt the nominator proved his case - there were just no, or far too few, reliable sources used, and it seemed likely they didn't exist at all. The fact that the creation of a timeline for the series was a fan undertaking also seriously undercut any claims to notability. But my primary reason for deletion was based on consensus, and the delete voters made their case pretty well. I would not have objected to transwiki-ing it somewhere, but no one suggested that and I'd imagine that if there's a Harry Potter wiki they'd have the same info already.--Cúchullain t/c 13:52, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Blood purity

Just thought you'd like to know: Blood purity is up for deletion. Michael Sanders 23:20, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

I've also reported Folken for breaking 3RR on Horcrux. Michael Sanders 23:22, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] new section

Hi I'm soooo sorry Sandpiper for wrighting this right here but I have 2 questions I would like you to try and answer on my discussion page. If you could at least answer the 2nd question that would be great! I'm friends with GoldenIrish he's might of mentioned me a few times and now I've changed my user name to HarryFanatic102HarryFanatic102 19:30, 7 April 2007 (UTC)HarryFanatic102

[edit] Deathly hallows article

Do not add theories on fansite as sources. They reflect your POV only, and are certainly not the only ones that exist on the subject.

That fansites wrote those don't make them "considerable".

Again, you lack the detachment required for Wikipedia.

A newspaper reporting there are theories is good. Mere theories from fansites aren't.

And stop adding those source.Folken de Fanel 22:54, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

It was in a news on Mugglenet, maybe it was even included in the article. People from WB or Bloomsbury or whatever just said these had nothing to do with JKR (you'll see there are a lot of titles registered, each more strange than the other, anyway). Folken de Fanel 23:13, 7 April 2007 (UTC)
Then you understood absolutely nothing, as usual. I have said it many times (but maybe you master english even less than me ?), I don't have anything against fansites, only their are not to be taken as sources for speculation because they are not reliable.
So now you stop being mulle-headed, you have no choice.
Evidence ? Go to mugglenet, since that's all your life.
What OR ? Do you know what OR is (well, of course you don't...)Folken de Fanel 10:43, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
You forgot to say "please"...Folken de Fanel 11:09, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
Anyway, I assume such a word doesn't exist in your dictionary, so here it is: http://www.mugglenet.com/app/news/full_story/555. Folken de Fanel 11:14, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
No. Without proof, nothing in the article, because OR. No one knows anything about the other titles so you can't assume which were "probably" the ones. I remind you the list include also Peverell Quest, Wand of Gryffindor, Ring of Destiny, Elder Wand, etc...
So no. Simply do not assume things.
Besides, the comment is clear: "representative for Jo said the titles were "never contenders" for Book 7. "We often registered a few spares to keep people guessing! Whether Jo reveals what her two other favorites were, I don't know." " The comment clearly covers the "few spares" which have been registered, including the ones you want to cite. The representative for Jo didn't mention any difference between old and new "spares", so believe what you want, but keep it for you.
Folken de Fanel 11:31, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org../../../s/a/n/User_talk%7ESandpiper_0787.html"