Talk:Robin (Tim Drake)

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Contents

[edit] Jeff?

Can someone cite the comic where we find out his middle name is 'Jeff'? I'm missing a backlog and can't look it up myself, but it seemed off that it's not 'Jeffery' or something. -- Ipstenu 20:09, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, in all the secret files he appears only as Timothy Drake - kidfried 00:22, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
Good to know I'm not going crazy! ;) I took out 'Jeff' from the article. -- Ipstenu 00:40, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
Just to add (I know it's been a while) but the name 'Jeff' was the name that Tim was originally to be called, and indeed in one panel from Batman issue 441 (Page 14) has Tim being called 'Jeff' by Dick. The letters page of a later issue explains the mistake 80.177.121.177 20:54, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Article name

For research purposes for those wanting to know more about this particularly Robin, I think "Robin (Tim Drake)" would be a better name than simply "Tim Drake". WesleyDodds 06:05, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

I had three different answers, and I think I have to disagree. Looking up 'Robin' gets you a summary on the four, so you can pick your Robin. As Dick Grayson is now Nightwing, I imagaine one day Tim will become something else. And at that point, 'Robin (Tim Drake)' would no longer fit. When you have one 'person' for a hero it makes sense, but with all the multiple people who've been Robin, and all the ways Robins grow, it may just bit our asses later on. -- Ipstenu 22:45, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Yes, but it's not the goal of Wikipedia to predict the future. What if Tim takes on another identity? What if he doesn't? We can always retitle the page later. WesleyDodds 02:23, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

True, but if we have a good reason to guess things may change, we ought to build for the expected future. I can't help but feel we'll just end up with the mess that is Nightwing today, with half the article saying 'Dick' and half saying 'Nightwing' (and yes, I think the Nightwing Article should be split into Dick Grayson and Nightwing). I know I still think of Dick when I think of Robin, and a disambiguation Robin page, pointing to the 'real' names seems logical to me. But. Let us see how others weigh in :) Obviously we're 50-50 split now ;) -- Ipstenu 03:12, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

Ahem. Gidday. To begin, I believe that the article name is fine as is. If anything, I'd just say it should be "Time Drake (Comics)" but that's probably beside the point. Anyway, I'll now explain my opinion on the matter.

First off all, Both this article and "Robin (Comics)" should do a good enough job of explaining that tim drake is the current. Identifying him as robin in the name is almost redundant. The title is not exclusive and this wouldn't even be debated if tim was, say, inactive or had changed his name to something else.

Oh! I think a great example is Red Hood II. Jason took that title and has been known by since his return. Sure, He was robin before that, but should his title have been changed to "Red Hood" anyway? Jack Napier never really used it and most people would rather forget he was ever robin anyway so...why not?

>.>

<.<

Not to be annoyingly rhetorical, but i'll tell you why not. The Joker still had the title first. There's a "Red Hood" page and everything just like there's one for Robin. There's really not much difference.

Besides, It's not like the current title makes Tim inexcessible. A person searches for "robin" and they get the disambiguation page. They pick "Robin (Comics)" and they get the list. They then get to pick which robin they were looking to research and maybe learn (more) about the others.

Now, If this were like "E3" or something, Wes might have a case. But since it isn't, He doesn't. No offense, Wes.

Finally, It'd almost be favoritism. Calling him "Robin" just because he's the current? He's already quit once and he originally started, not because he was like batman, but because no one else would. We don't know what the future holds, but it's a safe bet we'd regret changing the name to "Robin (Time Drake)".

Ace Class Shadow 05:23, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Powers & Abilities

Would it be safe to add under abilities, advanced knowledge of genetics and molecular biology, due to his close working relationship Superboy?

No, I don't think so. Mainly because it is unclear just how much Tim really does know about genetics and molecular biology. I assume the "working relationship with Superboy" you are referring to is his attempts at cloning Conner. So far, as this story is being told in Teen Titans, we have no clear indication how much Robin really knows about cloning, as it seems that his equipment is doing all the work and he expects to learn the "secret" of cloning from what the equipment Brotherhood of Evil has stolen. --rrmonroe 17:49, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tim and Cass, Tim and Cissie

When did Tim and Cass (Batgirl) become a couple? I don't remember that happening. Cass has had 4 sort of love interests. First was Azreal, then Superboy, then the terrorist, and finally the guy in Bludhaven who she thought was cute.

I also don't remember Tim and Cissie (Arrowette) since Tim was dating Stephanie at the time. CureWhite

Agreed. I think we should just consider it WikiFiction like how Tim was mistaken for Dick in the Starfire article. Ace Class Shadow 04:48, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

Cass and Tim have never been a couple. Because of thier close ages and circumstances (both Batman sidekicks)there seems to have been some sexual tension between the two, especially in the story arc "Fresh Blood" and the current story arc running in Robin, but the have never become an official couple. As for Tim and Arrowette, I never read Young Justice, but I've read somewhere that Cisse was supposed to have had a crush on Tim. --rrmonroe 17:55, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

Ciss kissed Tim in YOUNG JUSTICE when she left the team, and there had been hints that she had found him attractive. Greta meanwhile had a major crush on him throughout the series. As for Batgirl and Robin, they hinted at Tim being attracted to Cass when in one issue Cassandra wore Barbara Gordon's old costume. He mumbled and blushed and mentioned how good she looked.

Solo #10 had a Batwoman/Batman story starring Cain and Drake as romantic leads. --Chris Griswold 21:16, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Earth-8

I don't think we should list Earth-8, since it really adds nothing to the character. Every single char who's been created since CoIE is an Earth-8 denizen, but it doesn't matter to them. It's not like the GLs or Flashes, where their 'home' Earth affects their history. If it becomes a thing in the future, where Tim makes adventures to E8, then yeah, but until then, it's something we've got listed on the Multiverse (DC Comics) page, and it's mroe apropos there. If it added to the legacy of Tim, that'd be a different story. -- Ipstenu 19:22, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

Agree - Neodammerung 00:46, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Birthday?

someone wrote Tim Drake's birthday is July 19th on Drake's page, does anyone know if that is official information or vandalism? if it is official does anyone know where i could find out super hero birthdates? Dick Grayson

According to Robin #116, it's official - Neodammerung 14:23, 23 April 2006 (UTC)
Since comic characters age only about one or two years in their time about ten real years, Tim is about around 16, as he says in an issue of Robin that he turned 16 a while after the events of the Infinite Crisis and the Battle of Metropolis. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Jonathan.Bruce (talk • contribs) 22:40 July 2, 2006 (UTC) Now it's One Year Later, indicating that he has just turned 17.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Jonathan.Bruce (talk • contribs) 11:35 July 3, 2006 (UTC)
Either way, he's 17 now. The thing is, he is 15 before No Man's Land, which lasted a year, and afterwards, he is seen driving. Before Infinite Crisis. Maybe Superboy Prime punched his driver's license. --Chris Griswold 05:15, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
As it's now One Year Later, I don't think Tim Drake, Batman, or Nightwing will be aging for a long time now. I mean, Tim Drake's probably now out of high school, that is, if he went to school while going abroad, so will he go to college and make Batman solo again? Probably not! --Jonathan.Bruce 5:42, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Perhaps the writers made a mistake in saying that he turned sixteen before the Infinite Crisis, and that he probably turned sixteen while spending nearly a year abroad with Batman and Nightwing. Besides, he says in one issue following One Year Later that he only spent seven or eight months before returning to America. If Bruce Wayne is adopting him as his son, he's got to be around sixteen and not turning eighteen. What's the point of adopting him if he's been 17 for a while and turning 18 in less than a year, when he becomes of age? Maybe the writers should retcon this little detail, which they probably will. --Jonathan.Bruce 10:33, 17 July 2006 {UTC"

Maybe. But I remember Tim turning 16 around the time Azrael was being Batman (he had to sneak into the Batcave to get his Robin Car) and then he was running around on his Robin Bike at the end of War Games. Zero Hour being what it was, I think it's correct that he's been 16 since before IC. -- Ipstenu (talk|contribs) 01:44, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

I could swear he was 15 before No Man's Land, but maybe he had a motorcycle before that. Anyway, I thought they made a distinction there that because a years passes in that storyline, Robin was one year older. --Chris Griswold 07:22, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

Comics characters age slower than us, but they always stay around the same medium! He was fifteen during the No Man's Land storyline, and presumably Batman: Hush took place a few months after that (and took a few months to unravel). The One Year Later takes place a year after the Infinite Crisis, but Batman's War Games, War Crimes, and his search for the newly resurrected Jason Todd took a few months (2 or 3). Then, Batman trains Harvey Dent for another month in martial arts before leaving for Europe. Perhaps the writers made a mistake saying he turned sixteen before IC and he is still sixteen, nearly seventeen, since he returned to Gotham after 8 months (he says it in one issue!). So One Year Later was, chronologically speaking, one whole year after Infinite Crisis. Perhpas Batman continued his war on crime in a more low key way, since the hunt for the Red Hood was a quieter mission than No Man's Land, and he, Robin, and Nightwing were gone from eight to ten or eleven months before Batman "officially" returned by fighting Poison Ivy in the WayneCorp building. Since they might not have been gone a whole year but rather most of it, Tim must be around 16 1/2 to 16 9/12 or just turned 17 and a few weeks as of now. But I don't think that he will be aging anymore from now on, since they broke a number one rule and aged Batman by one year. Besides, I don't want Tim graudating and moving away to let a new Robin come in. Look at Dick Grayson, he was Robin for about 44 years! (He debuted in 1940 at age 11 and became Nightwing at age 18; only six to seven years of "their time" passed!) Therefore, Tim will not become 19 or 20 anytime soon, nor will Batman ever reach 40!

In addition, I heard an upcoming story arc that will involve Batman and Robin getting involved with a youth restorative designed by Ra's Al Ghul, who wants to keep immortal after his Lazarus Pits were used up. This decreases their ages by a few years, making Tim 11 again and Batman becomes 29 again. However, it contains elements of the Lazarus formula, making Batman reckless and out of control when it comes to fighting criminals, while Tim becomes greatly enraged over his father's murder. I do hope that this will happen, and we'll not have to watch another Robin leave the nest. --Jonathan.Bruce 5:18 19 July 2006

Please do not change other people's talk page comments. I meant what I said about before IC and I'd really rather you not alter that. if I'm wrong, I'm wrong, but that's my place to be wrong. - We all know comic chars age in special time. What Chris and I are saying is that In Character Events indicate it's been over a year since Tim was 15, before the events of Infitite Crisis. -- Ipstenu (talk|contribs) 03:14, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
No, I did not change your comments, and I accept your apology. --Jonathan.Bruce 8:39 21 July 2006.
Thank you, Bizarro Jonathon.Bruce. (re:"Yes, I did not change your comments, and I accept your apology") --Chris Griswold 18:18, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
Even so, I don't think anybody will age anymore, since Tim is more popular than Dick and Jason, it wouldn't be a good idea to have him leave the role of Robin. Who would he become? Firebird? Red Eagle? Besides, if they brought a new kid in for Robin and work him up in years, it would make Batman around 40, and Batman will never become 40 (except over the hill in Dark Knight Returns and Batman: Year 100!) They won't be aging for years now! --Jonathan.Bruce.

[edit] Some big problerms with the article

The importance of first the three Robin mini-series by Chuck Dixon and Tom Lyle is hugely underappreciated in the article as it currently stands.

The first series in particuliar was a sensation when it debuted, triggering multiple reprintings of the first few issues. After the public´s hatred of Jason Todd the (largely unexpected) popularity of the series led DC to re-examine their treatment of the character. None of this is mentioned in the article currently.

Also Chuck Dixon has clearly had the most influence on the character and his development over the years, yet the article fails to mention him even once.

Im not enough of a fan of the character to make the changes but the article needs a big general rewrite to reflect the characters history outside of his fictional biography. - Hueysheridan 03:13, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

It's mentioned in the Robin article somewhat. Is that was you were looking for? -- Ipstenu 03:25, 7 May 2006 (UTC)
Not really. Its important info about the Tim Drake Robin and it should all be mentioned here as well. The article at present does a great job of explaining Tim Drake's continuity, but Wikipeduia is not Whos Who in the DC Universe, its meant to be a real encyclopedia and as such it should also cover ther real world aspects of "Tim Drake" such as how and why he was created, how his popularity contrasts with the unpopularity of his predecessor and why, the timeline of his various appearances series etc, and the creators who have been involved in his development. There are bits and pieces of this type of info already in the article, especially in the first few paras of "Character history", but nowhere near enough, and the examples I gave in my previous post are the mpost glaring omissions imo. Hueysheridan 22:00, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

"is Batman's sidekick but also a young hero in his own right." That is an extremely stupid first line if you ask me... I think it can be completely removed, or at least, rewritten.

i dont think theres enough info aout tims life before he became robin - like his relationship with his parents, his computer genius etc. TommyStardust 08:07, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

I don't remember too many comics written about that. There was the Robin Year Zero:Model Bulding one-shot, but otherwise, there has not been much written. --Chris Griswold 12:57, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

please rewrite the first line - "is Batman's sidekick but also a young hero in his own right." seems awful stupid TommyStardust 18:46, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

You've complained about it more than once; why don't you have a crack at it? --Chris Griswold 07:34, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Father?

Did Bats adopt Tim since the death of Jack Drake?

He tried to, but Tim invented a fake uncle (and hired an actor to play him) so he could not be adopted or enter the system as an orphaned minor. It also gave him freedom to leave school. But, after Infinite Crisis it is unknown if Tim has been offically adopted by Bruce, but it is clear that Tim is living on the Wayne estate.--rrmonroe 17:59, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
In Batman #654 [6-28-06], Bruce propositioned Tim to reconsider adoption and it's understood that Tim accepted. (Tim cried in Bruce's arms)--Redredrobin 07:22, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Legion Flight Ring

"*Robin may also be in posession of a Legion Flight Ring, which he recieved from Superboy, when the Titans traveled to the 30th Century to aid the Legion of Super-Heroes. Unfortunately following the Titans departure of the future, the Legion's history was re-written, leaving into question whether Robin or any of the Titans still have their rings." I don't fault Ipstenu at all for removing this, but when I saw it, I thought it was interesting enough that it should be stripped of speculation-talk and added somewhere, even if not in this article. Suggestions? --Chris Griswold 20:51, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

A mention of the adventure could be put in Young Justice and the Teen Titans? "When the Titans traveled to the 30th Century to aid the Legion of Super-Heroes, they were given Legion Flight Rings. Since <Post Zero Hour?>, the Legion's adventures have been ..." something. IO forget -- Ipstenu (talk|contribs) 21:00, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Trivia no more

I moved the Trivia bits into sections I thought were more approriate, though they still need some clean up. Romance, Alvin Draper, and how he's different from the other Robins is in Personal Life. The Titans stuff is in the Young Justice and Teen Titans section. I think I got it all mostly right, but it made more sense to me to have the information folded in, rather than tacked on at the end as an after thought. -- Ipstenu (talk|contribs) 14:11, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tragedy Boy

I would like to note that in the span of a few months, Tim loses two romantic interests/girlfriends, his best friend, his father, and his favorite superhero/friend (Blue Beetle). I have no idea where to do this. Suggestions? --Chris Griswold 05:35, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

Personal life? - Neodammerung 13:24, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
Sorry, I keep getting ideas like that when I should be sleeping. --Chris Griswold 23:10, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] What will Tim become in the future?

So now if Tim is 17 as of OYL time jump, does this mean they're gonna write him out somehow and make him leave the cape of Robin, thus to create a new Robin? I mean, there's still a lot more stuff they can do with his character; Why change all that continuity so one guy can grow up? Nightwing already did, but he was young for nearly 40 years! --Jonathan.Bruce 5:41, 18 Sept 2006 (UTC)

First of all, log in once in a while. Second, this is not a messageboard, and you should know that by now. --Chris Griswold (☎☓) 21:28, 19 September 2006 (UTC)
Sorry about that, Chris, you're right. But what do you think? Tim Drake is more popular with readers than Jason, why getting another Robin. Look what happened with Stephanie/Spoiler! --Jonathan.Bruce 06:19, Sept 21, 2006 (UTC)
and this is connected to producing a better Robin article how? Can I suggest http://www.newsarama.com for those types of questions. --Charlesknight 10:48, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Stephanie: EX when murdered?

When Leslie Thompkins let Stephanie die, was she still dating Robin? I thought that by the time Robin started at his new pre-War Games school, he was free of that crazy chick. But it is clear that Darla Aquista was a new love interest for him, whether he was dating Stephanie or not.--Chris Griswold (☎☓) 06:26, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

I don't know, I think that Aquista might have been his new love interest. Not fully sure, but hopefully the writers can reveal some more of the love arc between them. --Jonathan.Bruce 06:13, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
It was in the weird time. Tim was definitely still dating Steph when he started at Pre-War Games school. That winter, while Steph was being Robin, she stopped answering Tim's calls and he asked out Darla, and the weirdo who was killing the Tim-alikes showed up. But knowing teenagers, 'ex' is arguable still. -- Ipstenu (talk|contribs) 23:54, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Graphic novels listing

Can anyone verify for a fact if the Robin II: The Joker's Wild! and Robin III: Cry of the Huntress mini-series were ever collected into their own respective individual trade paperback/hardcover volumes (or graphic novels, if you will)? I know that at least Robin II was collected (along with other material) in Tragedy & Triumph. However, as far as I can tell, the group of just Robin II #1-4 has never been collected solely on its own (aside from that collector's edition which had all of the variant covers for the entire mini-series in one convenient polybag, but in my opinion, that doesn't count) and the group of Robin III #1-6 has never been collected anywhere. Does anyone have any definitive evidence of either of these trade paperbacks/hardcovers actually existing? Additionally, why are Showcase '93 and Robin 80-Page Giant #1 listed at all? For the former, again, I have no idea if a collected edition ever existed, and for the latter, I'm not sure it should count because it's just an individual comic (albeit a larger-than-usual one). --WordsSayNothing 23:29, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Request: Tim Drake Joker pic!

Not only would it be radical and badical, it also symbolizes Tim's fate in the future of the animated series. Pleeeeeeeeeease? 71.217.236.119 01:29, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

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