Talk:Richard Dortch
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from VfD:
Not notable, or at least notability not established. The whole article reads: "Richard W. Dortch was the Illinois District Superintendent of the Assemblies of God from 1970 - 1983." -- Keep for rewriting based on new info-- see below. Wolfman 01:10, 19 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- If he presided over a particularly important time period, or perhaps was influential in changing the group in some significant way (major theological changes, etc.), maybe. Right now I'm saying delete. Inky 03:21, 19 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- Delete: If he did as Inky suspects, he's probably well discussed in the church article. Substubs like this kill us. Geogre 04:09, 19 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- Delete The stub has existed for 5 months. Without being expanded, the article is useless. DCEdwards1966 02:28, Nov 20, 2004 (UTC)
- Keep. Person with 23,000 google hits. Listed in Who's Who in Religion. Clearly those saying he is not notable have not done the slightest bit of research. anthony 警告 02:09, 22 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- I am unable to replicate your Google results [1]. Would you mind posting a link to your search here? Thanks. Wolfman 06:50, 22 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- Hmmm, there is a Richard Dortch who is notable as a convicted felon and sidekick to Jim Bakker; not sure if it's the same guy. Wolfman 06:58, 22 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- Wouldn't it make more sense to figure this out than to just blindly delete? If they turn out to be different people, then we can separate the two articles with a line. Considering Bakker is known for being a preacher for Assemblies of God, that our very own page on him says "His sidekick, Richard Dortch, senior vice-president of PTL, and associate pastor of Heritage Village Church, also ended up in prison", and that "Heritage Village Church was an Assemblies of God Church." [2] I think the connection is nearly certain. anthony 警告 13:03, 22 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- Anthony, I certainly do not blindly delete. I did a Google, and I came up with between 10 and 50 hits depending on how I specified the search. I have no idea how you get 23,000. Now, the article as it stands is absolutely useless, and in my opinion Wikipedia is better off without it. In the process of this vfd, we may have found some useful info to include; I appreciate your role in uncovering it. That's for the good, and that's one reason we this process, so multiple people can check it out. It may be that we get a decent article out of the process. But if the existing article had been deleted instead it still would have been an improvement. That's because the current article is essentially misleading about the man in leaving out the most prominent facts about him -- that he's actually a felon, convicted of fraud, not just some mild-mannered district superintendent of a church. Changing my vote to keep, so this new info can be included to make a decent article.Wolfman 03:11, 23 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- It seems to me your search was inconclusive. But I do the same search you list above and the top hit (other than this page) says "Most of us know Richard Dortch as host of the national nightly television program You and Me, now viewed in many cities throughout America." "Listed in Who’s Who in Religion, Richard has served as Executive Director and President of P.T.L. Television Network; and Executive Presbyter of the Assemblies of God, the denomination’s highest elected body, 1971-1985. He had oversight of 900 ministers and churches in Illinois when serving as Superintendent of his district, 1970-1983. Prior to that, he was President of Emmanuel Bible Institute of Andrimont, Belgium; and served as Field Fellowship Secretary for the Missionaries of the Assemblies of God in Europe, 1958-1963." "Pastor Dortch has written a new book, Secrets. This follows his other books entitled Integrity, Fatal Conceit, Caring Enough, Losing it All, and Letters to Leaders." It seems to me that the first hit alone establishes notability. As for the search I did, I used "Richard Dortch", because I think we should give the article the benefit of doubt. That's why I mean by "blindly deleting". Just doing a google search on an extremely narrow term and looking at a number in my opinion qualifies. I'm sorry if you took the term to be derogatory, though. I should note that my comment that "those saying he is not notable have not done the slightest bit of research" did not apply to you, because you admitted that he might be notable. anthony 警告 15:00, 23 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- Anthony, I certainly do not blindly delete. I did a Google, and I came up with between 10 and 50 hits depending on how I specified the search. I have no idea how you get 23,000. Now, the article as it stands is absolutely useless, and in my opinion Wikipedia is better off without it. In the process of this vfd, we may have found some useful info to include; I appreciate your role in uncovering it. That's for the good, and that's one reason we this process, so multiple people can check it out. It may be that we get a decent article out of the process. But if the existing article had been deleted instead it still would have been an improvement. That's because the current article is essentially misleading about the man in leaving out the most prominent facts about him -- that he's actually a felon, convicted of fraud, not just some mild-mannered district superintendent of a church. Changing my vote to keep, so this new info can be included to make a decent article.Wolfman 03:11, 23 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- Wouldn't it make more sense to figure this out than to just blindly delete? If they turn out to be different people, then we can separate the two articles with a line. Considering Bakker is known for being a preacher for Assemblies of God, that our very own page on him says "His sidekick, Richard Dortch, senior vice-president of PTL, and associate pastor of Heritage Village Church, also ended up in prison", and that "Heritage Village Church was an Assemblies of God Church." [2] I think the connection is nearly certain. anthony 警告 13:03, 22 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- Comment: I'd just like to reiterate my request that people look at "What links here" before listing an article on VFD. anthony 警告 13:14, 22 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- Keep. For reasons stated by other that vote keep. --
Dittaeva 20:45, 23 Nov 2004 (UTC)
delete(overall delete votes-5/keep votes-0 i guess that makes me a deletionist) Oh, well.User:Fledgeling02:02, 24 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- 'choo, scratch that- my google serch (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Richard+Dortch&btnG=Google+Search ) also hit 23,300 for Richard Dortch
so i vote Keep.User:Fledgeling02:07, 24 Nov 2004 (UTC)
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- well i agree with keep. but a note on proper google usage: you need to use quotes around "richard dortch" to get any sort of reasonable google count. even with quotes, you'll find lots of richard dortch's other than this guy. Wolfman 03:00, 24 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- Proper google usage is to use google to find articles about someone and then read them, not to blindly look at a number. Putting "richard dortch" in quotes would eliminate pages where his middle name was included. anthony 警告 13:50, 24 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- well i agree with keep. but a note on proper google usage: you need to use quotes around "richard dortch" to get any sort of reasonable google count. even with quotes, you'll find lots of richard dortch's other than this guy. Wolfman 03:00, 24 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- Keep. - Ta bu shi da yu 02:23, 24 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- more than likely. I ran into that problem when i was doing reserch to write a article on 'Wilson's Magnolia;User:Fledgeling 03:17, 24 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- Keep - Tεxτurε 21:30, 24 Nov 2004 (UTC)
end moved discussion
[edit] Added references
Added references and verified facts. References have material to expand.--FloNight 02:28, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
