Talk:Renee Montoya

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I will add some more background info later. Could someone please post who created her and what her first appearance was? CyberSkull 10:27, 2005 Jun 1 (UTC)

Contents 1 I know she first appeared in the animated series but... 2 batwoman 2.1 SID 3 New Pic 4 Alliances 5 Question about her new moniker

[edit] I know she first appeared in the animated series but...

She had a really small role compared to the comics. Shouldn't it come after as a footnote? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 69.107.93.22 (talk • contribs) 01:07, 2005 December 10 .

[edit] batwoman

there is a rumor that because she has left the force that she will become batwoman in One year later. should this be included in the article?

This is irrelevant now that we know that Batwoman is Renee's ex-girlfriend, Kate Kane.--Dont Waltz 07:58, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] SID

Hey. ACS here. Ahem. Forgive me if this seems obvious, but did Renee realize that Batwoman was Kate Kane in week eleven? ACS (Wikipedian); Talk to the Ace. See what I've edited. 18:08, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

She realized it was a Batwoman, she realized someone taught this Batwoman how to throw a punch, then she said "...I'll be damned." Yeah, the implication is that she realized BW is Kate, that it may have even been Renee who taught her those things, but the creative team chose not reveal that. Unless you can find another source, it's got to be left as speculation at this time. CovenantD 18:22, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

See, this is where you seem wrong, in an odd way. Why would Renee say "someone" in her head if she was referring to herself? Her thoughts seem pretty clear and open. However, your crazy ass bit of speculation isn't my point. The writing team could have easily hinted at Renee knowing in a variety of ways. The fact that she said the same thing, then repeated it to herself, followed by an "I'll be damned" and her reaction to the Question's statement are clear indicators. If I were one to speculate the kind of things you do, I'd probably be all "they need to say it outright!" too. However, this is based on logic and multiple well placed hints. Besides, if anyone would figure it out, it'd be detective Renee Montoya. Open your mind and eyes. This is obvious and they meant it to be. ACS (Wikipedian); Talk to the Ace. See what I've edited. 18:45, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

Well, it seems obvious to me that she said "someone" at that point because it was BEFORE the realization. You can see that something interupts her thought in the second to last panel on page 23. That could be when she recognized the fighting style and THAT led to the realization that BW is Kate. Or, it could have just been because this hot woman turned and looked at her. (She was, ahem, admiring BW before anything else entered her mind.) The ironic thing about this discussion is that I agree she recognized Kate. I also realize that it's not stated because it's written to be another "clue" to Batwoman's identity. CovenantD 19:00, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

She was outed—SID-wise and so on—in a press release. There's no Mystery of the Batwoman. Not really. This was done in attempt to be more "creative" when letting the reader know what a character has realized. Had they just written "That's Kate. I know it is", I'm sure Wacker would have asked them to be a bit less boring/blunt. Now, if you i=agree, why isn't it in the article?ACS (Wikipedian); Talk to the Ace. See what I've edited. 19:14, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

Because you're drawing a conclusion based on your interpretation of events, which isn't entirely confirmed by the source from which you draw it. Can't do that. It's bad. Until it's specifically noted that she is indeed Kate, it's speculation to say for sure that she is. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 19:16, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

Wait...What? Read the Batwoman article. Read the friggen press releases. Are we actually debated whether Kate is even Batwoman now? ACS (Wikipedian); Talk to the Ace. See what I've edited. 19:27, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm not saying that Kate isn't Batwoman, I'm saying that Renee hasn't been confirmed as realizing this fact. I should have worded that better. In any case, I agree that she most likely recognized Kate. However, I do not know this for sure. I have not seen a quote saying "Oh, Kate is Batwoman", have you? I doubt it. It's speculation to say otherwise. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 19:31, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

Hmph. Well founded speculation.. ACS (Wikipedian); Talk to the Ace. See what I've edited. 19:36, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

But speculation nonetheless. Give it an issue or two. You'll get a confirmation. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 19:38, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] New Pic

I just have to say that the current pic in the info box is horrible. Maybe we can replace with one from 52? Like the one where she's on the cover with the Question holding the sci-fi gun. Jupiterzguy 15:43, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

I'd personally rather see one from the pages of 52, and one that focuses on Renee, what she looks like, by herself, and can sort of embody who she is. Which the pic we have in the info box kinda does, though the quote helps :) -- Ipstenu (talk|contribs) 15:59, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, I do like the current one because of the quote. Also, I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with it; it's how she was depicted throughout most of Gotham Central, after all. Though, a pic from 52 might be more appropriate because the art style is much different from Michael Lark's, and she's unlikely to appear extensively elsewhere until the series is over. If nobody changes it, I'll look through my issues and see if I can find a good pic of her, but I'm still kinda partial to the current one. --SHODAN 17:36, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Maybe the one from 52 with her smoking a cigarette with her arm in a cast, when we meet Kate? That's very iconic of Renee. Now I'll have to go re-read all of 52 ... Darn. ;) -- Ipstenu (talk|contribs) 19:00, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

I'm looking at that issue now, and while there's an OK picture of her where she's lighting her cigarette (just before she looks down at the newspaper), I have to say that, even after having flipped through various issues of 52, I still prefer the Lark picture that's up now. In that one picture, she has that gritty & determined, yet somewhat worn look that I've come to associate with Renee. Plus, I really like Michael Lark :) I say we keep it. --SHODAN 03:41, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, I'm for keeping it unless we can get a nice hard-boiled shot of her to replace. (I'm also not totally sold on the art for 52, but knowing they have to get a new ish out every week, I'll give them a pass). -- Ipstenu (talk|contribs) 14:29, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Alliances

Okay, I was basing it off Richard Dragon, who has Bronze Tiger as an affiliation, because together they were a (get this) team :) Renee and Charlie were a team. Batman and Robin are a team. "include any current or previous team affiliations. Please stick to notable affiliations." They were a team, and this is highly notable. -- Ipstenu (talk|contribs) 03:07, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

And most partnerships have been, and still are being removed from that line. As are "employees" without an organization.

The listing is for "teams" not "partners", "mentors", "sidekicks", or "employers". The best way to list fit the Question in that light is "The Question and Montoya". Otherwise the listing gets not only the organizations and teams she has belonged to but every single character she has worked with, whether the belonged to one of those teams also or not. — J Greb 03:30, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

Her detective parters are superseded by GCPD, which encompasses Cirspus Allen etc. But she spent 40-odd issues teamed up with The Question, and there should be some way of listing that notable and life changing partnership. -- Ipstenu (talk|contribs) 03:33, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

Uh-uh. If the reason for the line is to hit notable associations, then "Allen & Montoya" is notable above an beyond "GCPD" and should be given as much weight as "Question & Montoya". Notable is notable. — J Greb 03:41, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

And yet nowhere in the SHB talk page does it say 'Teams are only teams with cool names like JLA,' it just says teams and does not say 'excluding one-on-one partnerships.' Which is the crux of my argument. 'Allen and Montoya' is covered by GCPD, which also includes the over-reaching team of her other PD partners, as well as the whole department whom she worked with. However, I can see this is a discussion for THAT page and not this one, since it needs to be clarified in such a way as to avoid the ambiguity of interpretation we're having now. -- Ipstenu (talk|contribs) 14:13, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Question about her new moniker

If the 52 storyline concludes with Montoya becoming the second Question for good, should this article moved to something like Question (comics) or should that article be renamed Vic Sage?--kchishol1970 23:14, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

Per a conversation we're having over on Talk:Question (comics), we're waiting until 52 is over. After all, if they kill off Renee too, we'll likely keep this as Renee. Also, she's yet to be called the Question. She's just ... Renee with no face. The proposed new name would be Question (Renee Montoya) and Question (Vic Sage) with Question (comics) being a page like ... Flash (comics). Though likely smaller. -- Ipstenu (talk|contribs) 14:07, 2 April 2007 (UTC)