Talk:Peanut butter and jelly sandwich

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[edit] Preservation

Instead of trying to preserve bread for so long, why don't they use something like Melba toast (essentially stale bread) or some other cracker-like substance that preserves well? Nortexoid 05:59, 22 Dec 2004 (UTC)

You know, people in the armed forces are ... well ... nuts. And believe me, Melba toast does not go well with peanut butter. It's not as stupid as the astronaut ice cream. -- Toytoy 06:06, Dec 22, 2004 (UTC)
They have produced a shelf-stable bread for the MRE. It's quite dense and not wholly apropos for a PB&J. Can't imagine they haven't tried it, but they never ship PB and J in the same MRE. FYI. --Mmx1 00:50, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Controversy

The "controversy" section discusses a patent on a certain kind of sandwich, but the relevance to peanut butter and jelly, if there is any, is not clear. Unless this is cleared up, I will move that section to the article on Sandwiches. -- Dominus 22:37, 1 Mar 2005 (UTC)

But PB and jelly are so good and sandwiches in general are simply drab. I would never have come across such a ridiculous patent had it been on the sandwich article page. Moving it and providing a link on this article seems reasonable. I'm still taken aback from the patent controversy and it obviously indicates far greater concern for patent (US) laws.Nortexoid 02:40, 2 Mar 2005 (UTC)
I agree the patent should remain linked from this article, since I think it is relevant and interesting. Perhaps there is actually enough information to make an Incredible Uncrustables article? - SCEhardt 04:20, 2 Mar 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Regions

The article states that:

those from many countries in Europe find the idea unappealing

Why is it more relevant what people in Europe think about this food than, say, people in Africa?

Do we really have evidence to make a such a strong statement anyway? Surveys, for example?

Are we going to attach similar statements to every food that is more popular in one place than another?

Geographical origin and distribution may be relevant, but "psychological reactions to the peanut butter and jelly sandwich by geographical region" is only a section for a far more detailed article than this one, and it certainly doesn't belong in the first sentence of the introduction.

Pekinensis 03:32, 12 Mar 2005 (UTC)

While it probably doesn't deserve to be in the introduction of the article, it's still an interesting fact nonetheless and deserves inclusion somewhere. But because we include it does not obligate us to include similar information for every demographic, location, race, etc.
A survey needn't be conducted to affirm that Europeans find the idea unappealing. We could likewise claim without conducting a survey to confirm it that Europeans find the idea of chopping young children into pieces and barbecuing them over burning bodies unappealing. The statement is a fact, not an opinion, and we are aiming to exclude the latter, not the former. Nortexoid 12:09, 12 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Well, as a European (Or at least, English) I can confirm that I'm rather partial to Peanut butter and Jam (homemade, strawberry) on toast (homemade, crusty) Although I don't recall ever trying it on bread, per se, that's largely irrelevant. Perhaps a better statement to make would be something along the lines of, "PB&J Sandwiches are most popular in the US, and less so in Europe." Opinions? Fish-Face 23:05, 21 July 2005 (UTC)
And to counter you (as an english guy), I would like to raise the opinion that while Jam and Peanut Butter are both awesome sandwich or toast fillings on their own, I find the idea of mixing the two together horrid :/ --86.141.88.253 02:13, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
As another English person, seconded. 207.245.124.66 18:47, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

I apologize for my delay in responding.

My main objection is not that the statement about European tastes is an opinion, but that it is unverifiable.

I also find the statement unnotable, but feel less strongly about this.

Finally, I come back to the question of why we mention Europeans over any other group. It's not that I don't believe that there is a reason, it's that I'd like to state what it is, lest the article sound parochial.

Regards, Pekinensis 01:19, 15 Mar 2005 (UTC)

This information would be better on the peanut butter page, pehaps reworked as trivia in regards to North American travelers having difficulty finding "their" peanut butter. As well, that page could have more on other cultures use of peanut butter as in a sause or soup. Glenlarson 05:57, 15 Mar 2005 (UTC)

You know, its probably more appropriate that instead of Europe, the wording be changed to the rest of the world. See, I live in Australia, and nobody I know has ever brought a PB and J sandwhich for lunch. I tried - I didnt like. The result amongst all of us seems to be its and American thing - much like vegimite is to us :PKokiri kid 06:49, 29 March 2006 (UTC)

Although I am generally against the excessive focus on Western (America and Europe + NZ&Aus) ideas etc on wikipedia, in this case, I feel there might be grounds to include a statement (if it can be sourced/cited) related to European (or at least British) and NZ+Aus ideas of the peanut butter and jam sandwich but not other cultures. The reason is because sandwichs and toast, especially sandwichs and toast with peanut butter or jam is probably fairly normal in these cultures. However for many other African, Asian etc cultures, sandwichs and toast with peanut butter or jam is probably less common so it's less relevant (if most people find peanut butter or jam sandwichs/toast rather exotic or unusual then logically, their views on the combination are a lot less relevant) Nil Einne 00:36, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

This isn't scientific, but I confirm from polling my acquaintances that PB&J sandwich does not appeal to Franch taste... Then again, peanut butter is a relatively new product in France, even though it is easy to find in any decently stocked supermarket, or large enough minimarket. The habit here runs to jam spreads (that is, on a single slice of bread, toasted or not, with or without butter or substitute), and does not seem on the way of changing. The fact that it is not customary for schoolchildren to pack a lunch here may also be a factor. --Svartalf 02:25, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Peanut butter and jelly/jam

I know it used to be possible to purchase peanut butter and jelly spread in Malaysia which I'm pretty sure origated from the US (Scmuchers I believe). Surprisingly, this article only refers to applying peanut butter and jelly/jam on the sandwich. Is this scmuchers combination spread really that uncommon/unpopular that it doesn't deserve any mention? Nil Einne 00:40, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] jelly, jam, preserves

Some removed my mention of preserves, by saying preserves is a type of jam. That's not true. Preserves are what is made first from the fruit or berry, then with what's left over they make jam, then with what's left over from that process they finally make jelly. RJII 04:46, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

I'm having trouble understanding how that works. Could you point me to a source explaining the process? Thanks -SCEhardT 06:17, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
I don't know how the exact process works. I just read that that was the process in the Wall Street Journal once. But, if you don't believe that they are three different things, just check out a few links. [1] That they're three different things is obvious to anyone who buys the products. Some are labeled preserves, some labeled jam, and some labeled jelly --with the amount of fruit decreasing as you move down to jelly (along with the price). RJII 01:12, 3 May 2006 (UTC)
Thanks for clarifying that! Sounds like we need to expand our related articles so that jam and preserves are different pages or at least distinguished from each other on the same page. -SCEhardT 01:54, 3 May 2006 (UTC)

Whatever is done on that putative page needs to carefully distinguish American from British/Australian usage; American "jelly" is English "jam" and in England jam is a subset of preserves ... the references quoted are simply parochial in nature.

[edit] Unencyclopedic tone

Do we really need a borderline satirical blurb about possible errors in peanut butter and jelly making technique? This doesn't seem befitting of an encyclopedia, cutesy though it is. 68.154.225.38 19:24, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Fix it yourself u lazy sod. If it bothers u so much! Seriously, get a life

I want to know who decided that "peanut butter and jelly sandwiches are often served with milk?" Is this a fact or an opinion? Maybe it's my region but I don't know of them to "often" be served with milk. 14 November 2006 (Sbrobin)

[edit] Types of bread

Instead of the usual types of bread used for making pb&j, I tend to use Brioche bread. It tastes really good. pinikas 10:02, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Aristocratic PB&J

Did a French Duchess really invent the peanut butter and jelly sandwich? Or is this another dubious Wikifactoid? Pedia-I Project Jesus 06:38, April 1, 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Origins

In regards to "The chief variant, however, is the plain peanut butter sandwich." surely the relationship is opposite, that PBJ is a variant of a peanut butter sandwich. It makes no sense to imply that the PBJ was the origin of all peanut butter sandwich ideas. Veridis 18:40, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] 1940 as Year of First Mention in Print of PB&J?

The current Wikipedia article states that PB&J sandwiches were first mentioned in print in 1940.

However, note the below from the Los Angeles Metropolitan News-Enterprise of December 7, 2006:

“Peanut-butter-and-jelly sandwiches were first mentioned in print in 1940,” according to Wikipedia.com, an online enclopedia put together by a worldwide network of volunteers. That same information appears in Answers.com, Answers.yahoo.com, and other web sources.
“Both peanut butter and jelly were packed with United States Army K-rations in World War II,” the Wikipedia.com website continues. “The combination proved so popular that returning GIs made peanut butter and jelly a standard American food.”
It doesn’t happen to be true that no publications referred to peanut butter and jelly before 1940. Aside from the fact that 1940 pre-dated U.S. involvement in what was then “the War in Europe,” so there were not yet any World War II Army K-rations, peanut butter and jelly sandwiches went back decades, and mention of them did appear in print. However, once a fallacy appears on a website purporting to be a repository of facts, repetition is apt to occur, and recur, with the Internet functioning as a chamber of mirrors.
An article in the Nov. 16, 1915 edition of the Mansfield (Ohio) News, for example, recommends serving “two kinds of sandwiches in each luncheon,” one of the possibilities being “peanut butter and jelly.”
A column in the Jan. 3, 1919 edition of the Bridgeport (Conn.) Telegram advisises: “You must, try peanut butter and jelly, to know what a good sandwich filling it makes.”
A syndicated article appearing in the Wisconsin Rapids Daily Tribune on Nov. 11, 1932, mentions:
“There are pretty colored oil papers on the market with gay designs that will delight children. A good idea is to use ordinary oiled paper for the heavy sandwich, of meat or some substitute, and then wrap the jelly or peanut butter and jelly sandwich in this covering.”

I suspect this author used newspaperarchive.com as a research tool, or some such Internet-based resource offering an "advanced search" option. If the above can be confirm, then the claim in the the current Wikipedia article should be corrected. (Frankly, I think it's always risky to say that something "first appeared in print"; it's better to say that "the earliest known appearance in print dates to" or something like this, which contains a qualification.) --Skb8721 19:28, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

I have removed this information until it can be confirmed. -SCEhardT 22:50, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Sandwich can last for three years ?

The current version of the article ([2]) says "The sandwich can survive in the field for up to three years". I find this rather hard to believe, so I think it needs some citation to support this affirmation. I think the affirmation came from the very first version of the article ([3]) where it says: "The US Department of Defense is researching ways of preserving a PBJ for up to 3 years for its combat troops in the field.", citing an article from Washington Times ([4]). Since 2003, that link is dead, but we can find it in the Wayback Machine: [5]. However the current phrase is rather different from the original phrase ("can survive" vs. "is reasearching ways of preserving") and this change was made more recently ([6]). Anyway, with or without rephrasing, the statement needs a citation. Razvan Socol 09:01, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Well, all MREs are supposed to last three years in cold storage, or one unrefrigerated. It might come from that. 199.76.157.35 10:02, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Europe, get with it! We do not put what the Europeans refer to as jelly on our sandwiches

I am an American and I am disgusted by the fact that Europeans think we put, using a brand name, Jell-O on our sandwiches. I was at school and I noticed this. Please help me get rid of the misinformation. Jelly usually refers to gelled fruit juices, and not the whole fruit as the term jam exists in USA. Edit: If I see jelly come back onto the page I will report this. It is misinformation and a hoax created by Europeans who do not understand what Americans refer to as jelly. --170.211.117.137 20:03, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Peanut butter on both pieces of bread?

I dispute the claim that putting peanut butter on both pieces of bread is the standard method. The simpliest and most common form is simply one layer of peanut butter and one layer of jelly. As a PB+J loving American, I've never seen or heard of the two-PB-layer variety before. Pimlottc 04:30, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Agreed. PB on one, J on the other, ensuring equitable distribution. If your jelly is seeping, you need to decrease your jelly or purchase better quality bread.199.76.157.35 10:03, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

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