Talk:Orléans, Ontario

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I reverted intothedark's edits because they are wrong. He is confusing the 417 with the Queensway. The Queensway goes from Orleans to Kanata, while the 417 is the highway that veers off. It becomes 174 though. Secondly, Orleans was on the border between Cumberland and Gloucester like the article says. Look at a map. Actually, a map will tell you about the Queensway too. -- Earl Andrew - talk 04:55, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

You are incorrect. The 417 runs from the split out to past Arnprior now. The Queensway is a purely arbitrary name, and is not commonly used to refer to Regional Road 174. Orleans was part of Gloucester. It was never a separate municipality. It was under the administrative control of the municipality of Gloucester, and only the Municipality of Gloucester. Orleans was never part of Cumberland, which was a separate township. You need to check your facts. I know maps clearly display Orleans as lying between Cumberland and Gloucester. But those maps do not reflect the true nature of the administrative reality. Orleans was a 'suburb' to use the term very loosely, of Gloucester. Further, many maps, including mapquest.com still use incorrect names for Regional Road 174. You should look up information about the provincial downloading that occurred, which transferred Highway 17 to the City of Ottawa, and thus resulted in the creation of Regional Road 174. It is possible to call R.R. 174 The Queensway, as that is an unofficial name. The official names are Highway 417, which runs from the Ontario/Quebec border, through the split near St. Laurent, out to roughly Arnprior now, and then becomes Highway 17. Past the split we find the 417 veers off toward South Ottawa (then on to Montreal). The other end of that split leads us to R.R. 174. Drive it, you'll see that's what the sign says. Everything that I changed can be found on other pages at wikipedia, including the information about Highway 417, which you could also get from the MTO. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Intothedark (talk • contribs).

I'm not going to argue with you. Everything you have said is factually incorrect and can be verified in the contrary. -- Earl Andrew - talk 06:02, 7 January 2006 (UTC)

Well if you insist on reverting to factually incorrect information, fine. It is sad for wikipedia. I present the proof to what I say, I challenge you to do the same.

Highway 417 is the highway that runs from arnprior through Ottawa, veering southwards at the split near St. Laurent. All provincial highways are numbered, some have been assigned names in addition to their numbering. Highway 417, and it alone is factually referred to as the Queensway, though some also extend the name to R.R. 174.

The Proof: http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/engineering/417ea/ - a map nearly halfway down the page clearly shows Highway 417, and R.R. 174. One is owned and operated by the province (417) and the other by the city R.R. 174. This was the result of provincial downloading under the Harris government. Also, the 417, even through Ottawa falls under O.P.P. jurisdiction, while the 174 is under City of Ottawa police jurisdiction. However, the forces work together.

See Also:


Now for Orleans, if you look under the archived city council minutes of the former municipality of Gloucester you will see things like:

  • By-law No. 101 of 2000; To approve of an art commission at the Orléans Recreation Complex
  • By-law No. 108 of 2000; To amend the City's Traffic and Parking By-law No.1 of 1996 with respect to the installation of traffic control measures in;

(i) the new residential development area in Chapel Hill South;

  • By-law No. 88 of 2000; To dedicate a 0.3 metre reserve described as Parts 3 and 4, Plan 5R-12710 as a public highway to form part of Carrière Street
  • By-law No. 78 of 2000; To approve the change of a street name from Cavalier Crescent, on Plan 4M-106, to Cavalier Way (Chapel Hill South) (Angela Gatto, Legislative Services, ext. 4107).
  • A. Resolution - To approve a proposal to upgrade softball facilities at Carrière and Garneau Parks for the Orléans Amateur Fastball Association (Judy Billingsley, Recreation Planner, Recreation and Culture, ext. 4134).
  • (ii) establishing a "No Parking" during the weekend time period on Apple Leaf Way and Silver Pines Crescent in Chapel Hill South and;

(iii) establishing all-way "Stop" controls at the Beausejour Drive/Country Walk Drive intersection in Chapel Hill (Rodney Pitchers, Head of Traffic Operations, ext. 4190).

THis is all available in the minutes located at http://ottawa.ca/calendar/ottawa/archives/gloucester/council/council_agendas.html

I challenge you to show me the proof that what I say, and back up, is incorrect. Wikipedia is only a great source if information is correct. I am not interested in arguing at all, I am interested in ensuring factual information. I will concede that we could be more specific, and state that R.R. 174 is sometimes referred to as the Queensway by locals, that is true...-Intothedark


I'm not disputing the existance of Highway 174. I know where the 417 runs. However, the Queensway runs from Kanata to Orleans. The Queensway and the 417 are not one in the same. Get a copy of the MapArt Road Atlas of Ontario, look on the Ottawa page then at tile Q 63, and you will see the word "Queensway" right on Highway 174, east of the split. As for Orleans, I can tell you it includes the whole urban area in the northeast corner of Gloucester AND the northwest corner of Cumberland. Just take a look at this map on the city of Ottawa website [1]

The area in Cumberland is known as "Orleans East" by the city. Why would they call it that if it weren't part of Orleans? -- Earl Andrew - talk 00:33, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

I don't dispute any of what you say in your last discussion post. I will not revert the page again, but I feel it should be clarified. The MapArt Road Atlas is not a government printed map, and the map I directed you to was. You can certainly call the 174 'The Queensway'. However the official MTO position is that 'The Queensway' refers to the 417 from Boundary Road to the 416. It was on the page I posted. Nonetheless, I don't have a problem with that. But at least clarify the page so it states that the section of Queensway to which you are referring is technically known as R.R. 174.

The city map you showed is a post-amalgamation map. Further, it is a map of suburban neighborhoods, as it is titled. You will note that the communities of Mer Bleu and South March, among others, do not correspond to administrative jurisdictions, which is the change I made. You are ignoring fact.

I will concede that I am not absolutely sure that all of what has been, or is now considered Orleans, fell within the pre-amalgamation administrative jurisdiction of Gloucester. Yet, you can't deny that at least part of it did. The page to which I directed you was proof of that. Further, I lived in Orleans for quite a few years, pre, and post-amalgamation. Park signs all bore the city of Gloucester logo. Further, our tax bill was from the city of Gloucester. I think clarifications to the page are in order, but since you reject mine, I ask you or someone else to make them.

I am disappointed that you refuted evidence from government sources with "Map Art Road Map". Following that logic, I could prove that R.R. 174 doesn't exist! But rather that it is called Highway 17, as mapquest purports. You are no friend of wikipedia, or academia. It is also sad that you are unable to admit you are wrong. To those who use wikipedia, I strongly urge you to never rely on it. It's accuracy is in my opinion highly questionable. You should go back to your fantastical 'Amerada'... lol...Intothedark

Your personal attacks on me prove that you are nothing but a vandal. Obviously half of Orleans is in Gloucester. Of course the parks signs in that half are going to be for Gloucester. However, *part* of Orleans is also in Cumberland. This is a fact. -- Earl Andrew - talk 07:50, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

I would just to add a point to this HEATED debate that some older maps mentionned about an existant Cumberland Township (embedded inside the old Cumberland) that covered the eastern part of Orleans (from Place d'Orleans or Champlain Street and east) with Cumberland east of that until Rockland, although the Pathfinder Map (from Carp, Ontario by the way) in the later pages put a figure of the Ottawa-Carleton region with just Cumberland which makes it confusing. But I find this odd that they had designated Cumberland Township for the populated portion instead of Cumberland period. I know that formally that land wasn't occupied (thus was a township before the Orleans sprawl) until the mid or late 1980's, and maybe they didn't bother changing it or it is just an error by the map company. Anyway I think the Township part was probably run by the former city of Cumberland. --JForget 03:14, 11 September 2006 (UTC)


Contents

[edit] french version

I've been making links in french articles to Orléans, but it always brings to Orléans, french. I go to the disambigous to Orléans, Ontario, but it still redirects to France. Does anyone know if there is a french version to this article? I also wrote a note in the disambugous page paat 22:39, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

A page does not exist, I just checked and fixed the error. -- Earl Andrew - talk 23:36, 9 January 2006 (UTC)
Thanks Earl Andrew paat 23:47, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] East of Trim Road

Is the developping part east of Trim Road (Springridge & Valin) part of Fallingbrook or is a different community.--JForget 17:25, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Pic of Orléans

What should the pic include? Blv St. Joseph, Orléans main road? Or Innes maybe - since its all new?... paat 02:07, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

St-Joseph could be used as the first photo since it was the main street when it was still a village. Probably also photos of newer areas can be put in the article as well.--JForget 22:16, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Notting Gate

Thanks for giving a precision. I've thought it was called Millenium, considering OC Transpo has put Millenium as a future transit station probably based on the developping area near Trim Road.--JForget 22:18, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

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