Talk:Okie
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Should we mention that most of the Okies were of mixed ethnic backround?
Why not?
well for one thing there aren't any hard statistics to back my assertion.
However since many Oklahomans at the time were Indians and the one who weren't were often hiding their mixed race backround it stands to reason many Okies were of mixed blood. grazon 01:00, 8 October 2005 (UTC)
- Oklahoma is one of the most Native American (Indian) populated states and no surprise they formed a large percentage of "Okies" whom came to California and for other states (major cities of the Northwest, Midwest and Northeast). Today, you may find Cherokee and Choctaw communities in California and elsewhere, whom try hard not only to completely assimilate (in which they had, but are victims of racism as a minority group), they try to keep their Native American culture alive in an urban setting. I've checked out the Oklahoma article on the percentage of blacks or African Americans and they are only 8 percent, but some deragatory comments on Okies are the mixed race underclass is a ridiculous statement, but I'm aware those things being said came from a more racially tense time like the 1930's. + Mike D 26 22:00, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
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[edit] Norfolk
The same person who made this edit also made this edit. I have reverted it. —Ashley Y 03:12, 2 December 2005 (UTC)
- His edits are worthless and don't hold any truth, but he/she could take the edit to the Norfolk, UK article. Okie is indeed used in a positive way by many Oklahomans in the state, but the second edit meant to insult Americans in general is uncalled for. In California, some Okie descendants when they visited L.A. or San Francisco alleged to have encountered negative jokes, comments and stereotypes about their "redneck" or "white trash" heritage by the urban locals. There's a vicious canard going around that Okies are either racists (klansmen or skinheads), oil-rich capitalists, cowboy-like bible thumpers, inbred shack dwellers or gun-toting homophobes, are based on popular stereotypes of rural whites from the Southern or Central regions. I'm worried on the rise of prejudice against lower-income people from rural areas or any "red states", since it became fashionable and more acceptable to make fun of Okies instead of let's say, Gays and Jews and the disabled...and the image of a white turnip-truck right-wing hick is less controversial than to crudely depict black people in the mass media. So far, Okie is a good word but all depends on how it's used in comedy or satire, like for Jeff Foxworthy's regular standup routine is far from what the Beverly Hillbillies accused of defamation of Okies living in a wealthy community in the 1960s. It's not right to make fun of people for their race, religion, nationality, appearance or income class, but there's a whole other standard in how most people kindly use the term Okie. + Mike D 26 22:11, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Modern Usage
The term Okie has simply grown to be viewed less derogatorily. It's not that the people in Oklahoma are ignorant of its roots... I'd know, I'm from Oklahoma...--CountCrazy007 01:30, 16 April 2006 (UTC)
- Other Oklahomans would disagree with you, however, and say it's quite the opposite. User:Charlietwohats added most/all of the contributions about it, and seemed quite adamant about his experience with it. I dampened the tone he put in a bit, but I'm a Jersey boy and am largely ignorant of its actual use (and so can't speak with any sort of authority on the issue). Feel free to remove it entirely if you like; I certainly won't object. --Xanzzibar 01:47, 16 April 2006 (UTC)
I don't know where in Oklahoma CountCrazy could be from but he is very very wrong. I am from Oklahoma, live there & polled some 20 + people on this. the only ones who did NOT consider it insulting were 2 young women who moved just across the line in Texas. After the origin was explained to them they were very embarassed.
No one else would as they state ever consider using it to describe themselves. As one not-so-gentleman said. "I'll stomp your ass if you call me that!"
Saying it is is a simple derivation is like saying Nigger is just a variant of Niger (river). A few people misusing a term (deliberately?) does not excuse a reference for attempting to change meanings.
Having been in music business, I can assure you that Merle Haggard's song "okie from Muskogee" was in intent sole degrogatory and an act of his personal revenge on the town that treated him & other rural people shabbily. Just note the lyrics, they are mostly insulting.
I feel that as shown above in that discussion that if you are removing comments by people that disagree with your 1984 "newspeak" then you are dong a major disservice.
Can I remove countCrazy's demeaning remarks now? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Modern man (talk • contribs)
The famous "paradox" is a great quote, and very humourous, but it is in no way a paradox.
- Easy, tiger. Wanting to remove something because you don't agree that it's accurate isn't revisionism. People delete things all the time because they dispute its veracity. This isn't any different. Different people have obviously experienced different feelings regarding the word, and so we need to work around that. Informal surveys are of no help (Wiki policy on "no original research"), and there's apparently no general consensus at the moment, so we'll need to find other resources to validate these claims. --Xanzzibar 20:39, 16 April 2006 (UTC)
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- Whoever says Okie in comedy at this time isn't breaking a social more or unwritten rule on what term is prejudicial or offensive. But to walk up to somebody in Bakersfield, Fresno or any part of the Central valley, California and shout "you stupid okie" is what some people worry about is (once again) passively tolerated. It's not like calling black people racial slurs or in California where large Hispanic and Asian communities protested against their racial slurs "beaner", "wetback", "chink" and "gook" attacked them for many decades. The current usage of Okie fits in the category of anti-immigrant terms used in New York city or New England in the turn of the 20th century: you may heard of the terms "wop", "guinee", "mick" and "polack" lost it's edginess after the 1950's. There's now a psychological trick used by some Okies to call upper-income urbanites from L.A., Southern Cal. or the Bay Area all sorts of names: "OCies" are initials of "Orange County" since Okies is somehow a code word for "Originated-Kern county". I'm amazed on the fact lots of "yuppies" and "native Californians" have relatives such as Okies and Arkies from the Midwest and Southern states, aren't anywhere near of a "middle American" cultural persuasion. What if they drove to "Okie towns" Tulare, Madera, Salinas, Stockton, Yuba city...or the farm valleys of Santa Maria, Antelope and Imperial known for harboring large numbers of Okie migrant labor in the '30s? Would they explore their family origins/roots or try hard to avoid or ignore it out of classist/regional embarrassment?..and what does it mean in California, where millions of immigrants from Mexico, Central America, the Vietnamese, Filipinos, Armenians, and other countries had recently settled reminding us of how the Okies came to the state before them?...they had to move in order to work and survive...and some residents didn't want them there, hated them, threatened them and blamed them for local problems. It's a repeated tale told alot in the history of immigration and class struggle in America. + Mike D 26 22:24, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Added to the Oklahoma Wiki Project
I am ASTOUNDED that this article had not yet been added to the Oklahoma Wiki Project! Wow! Well, that has now been fixed.
As for the pejorative use of the word "Okie," per Wiki policy, I will do some objective research and see what I can find. Since I expect to find two or more major points of view, I will present, link, note, and cite them. ProfessorPaul 02:00, 9 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Trivia
I disagree with the description of the Will Rogers intelligence quote as a paradox. If Oklahomans of below average intelligence (for Oklahoma) left, Oklahoma's average intelligence would rise. If these same people were more intelligent than the average Californian, then their arrival would also raise the average intelligence of California. I believe the intent of the quote was basically to say that on average, Oklahomans are more intelligent than Californians. It also implies that those who stayed in Oklahoma were more intelligent than those who left. This Okie doesn't think it's a paradox. 137.240.136.81 17:37, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
