Talk:October Crisis
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[edit] RCMP staged terrorist acts
I removed this sentence: "It must be however noted that the RCMP staged several fake terrorist acts in order to bolster fear of the FLQ movement. Where is the proof for this? I have not been able to find any. The article states that over 200 terrorist acts were carried out by the FLQ. Considering this (and in the absence of proof) I don't think it is correct to say the RCMP would need to stage terrorist acts to bolster fear of the FLQ. I also removed this sentence: "It must be taken care not to overblow the size of a movement which conducted no more than a few isolated operations." Is this sentence relevant? How is 200 terrorist acts "a few isolated operations." Joseph haley 18:28, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
- The RCMP burned down a barn that belonged to Paul Rose's mother in 1972. They also produced a fake FLQ manifesto in 1971, in order to prove that the terrorist movement was "still alive". These are well-documented facts; you can read the wiki article about Scandals surrounding the RCMP. Please note that these actions were taken AFTER the October Crisis, at a time when the FLQ wasn't active anymore, so it is understandable that the RCMP would want to "perpetuate" the climate of fear, knowing that the separatist movement was moving towards the (non-violent) political arena at the time. -- Hugo Dufort 23:40, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
- What are the sources for the "200 violent crimes" committed by the FLQ? I don't see any reference in this section. Just wondering; any undocumented information is subject to caution. -- Hugo Dufort 23:40, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
- (I suggest for anyone claiming the RCMP was not involved in bombings and terrorist acts and that the FLQ commited 200 violent acts without knowing what they are talking about to read Investigation Commisson transcripts, Keable commission, McDonald report, to get information on John Starnes one of the Director of Security Services of the RCMP, read newspapers from the late 70s, to learn about Operation Essai, Operation Ham, Carole Devault, Robert Samson, Claude Morin)
I suggest a link to RCMP terrorist actions and False Flag operations to:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scandals_surrounding_the_RCMP
Heres information I found related to RCMP activities;
Keable Commission and McDonald Report found The Canadian secret services and RCMP have conducted operations against the sovergnty movement from 1969 to 1978
December 19, 1969 Trudeau and Robertson ask RCMP Commisioner Higget to deal with seperatists the same way they previously tackled communists. They give the RCMP a blank check (dont tell us, just do it).
RCMP creates Section G to fight against seperatism
1970 after FLQ kidnaps Cross and Laporte, Canadian secret services create the 'Strategic Operation Center' to counter FLQ, the SOC learns that the FLQ has more support from the population than anticipated
RCMP spreads reports of 50 FLQ cells massively armed while Quebec provincial police signals 4 Cells
Operation Essai the name of the military operation that was to operate under Wars Measures act.
Nearly 500 arrest are made without any court orders of people believe to be potential FLQ members.
Carole Devault (24 yrs old) (Code named agent SAT 945171) is used to infiltrate FLQ and also used as an Agen Provocateur to foster terrorism (including planning of bulglary before Cross is recovered and placing bomb after FLQ arrest and Cross liberated).
In December 1970(shortly after crisis), C. Devault actually creates the first of several phoney FLQ cells which in january 1971 places a fire bomb at Brink's. The Police proclaims there is a FLQ renewal (helps intensify anti-seperatism operation). Devault is not the only agent engaging in False Flag operations to be pinned on the FLQ but she is the most documented.
19 February agent Devault uses dynamite bomb behind a post office.
She then creates 6 new (flase) cells that make (false) FLQ communiqués.
Devault then creates the Jalbert cell which attempts extortion by threatening to explode an airplane in midflight
At the end of 1971, Devault organizes a new hold up.
Shortly after Vallières quits FLQ, (alledging there's nearly no real members left in the FLQ, its like preaching to police agents).
Then another communique is released stating that power can only be obtained at the end of a gun. This communique was arranged by Cobb, in charge of the RCMP, later to be revealed that it was one of several RCMP fabricated communiquées. The Federal government denies 'knowing' about it.
1973 of the agents provocateurs in fabricated FLQ cells, Devault specifically is no longer an Agent Provocateur but a regular spy (infiltration, information).
1972-73 Operation Ham, 44 RCMP agents organize the theft of the 60 000 name list of Parti Quebecois members. Prepared in late 1972 the operation takes place in january 1973. RCMP receives assistance from CIA and form Chicago operative for computer data tapes transfer assistance. (as aknowledged by Gilbert Albert, RCMP special section in the 70s). This operation was illegal since the PQ was an officially recognized political party.
1974 Bomb explosion in Westmount orchestrated by an RCMP. A RCMP agent, Security Service Corporal Robert Samson is wounded in the operation and is arrest by police. His identity is revealed which triggers Royal Commissions into RCMP activity.
1992 Claude Morin prominent member of the PQ aknowledges that he was(back then) a double agent working for the RCMP
--Rick: Feb 9 2007 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.38.219.253 (talk) 22:21, 9 February 2007 (UTC).
[edit] Meaning of War Measures Act
As a non-Canadian reader of the article, it would help me to know what specific protections were removed by the invocation of the Act, i.e., what normally would happen that did not. Hope this comment is helpful. --Gary D 08:11, 12 Jun 2004 (UTC)
I do not know what are the exact provisions of the war measures act but as a result The Army had the right to arrest citizens, jail them without hearings and make mass roundup of potential FLQ members. Hope this helps
[edit] Most Serious Attack
I changed "most serious terrorist attack in Canadian history" to "most serious terrorist attack on Canadian soil". The Air India bombing caused far more loss of life, although I supposed it could be argued that it didn't cause as much of a stir as the October Crisis. --LeeHunter 13:31, 18 Aug 2004 (UTC)
[edit] Number of people arrested
Regarging the number of persons arrested, this CSN (a union) report regarding the recent C-36 bill gives it as 497, 62 being charged with anything and about 20 being actualy found guilty.:
http://www.csn.qc.ca/Memoires/TerrorismeC36FrSet.html (This reference is from a Trade union)
Removed incorrect statements on the War Measures Act inserted on 20:58, 29 July 2005 Marc paquin that stated:
- Under the War Measures Act, 497 residents of Quebec who were considered supporters or sympathizers of the FLQ as well as others dubbed radicals (union leaders, teachers, artists, etc...), were subsequently arrested and held according to the law for questioning, without charge, trial or contact with the outside world for up to a 3 weeks in the case of 343 of them. 62 were eventualy charged with various offences although only 20 were found guilty.
I replaced it with information from the McGill University website [1] of senior Quebec cabinet Minister during the Crisis time, and McGill University Law Professor, William Tetley. Marc Allaire 15:24, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
- Not to start a fight over this but why would you assume a federal minister would be more right then a union ?
- I also notice that you have removed other part in such a way as to minimised the fact that the majority of people arrested were not only unrelated to the FLQ but also not political activists.
- Finaly, do you have a source for the Lévesque article in the Journal de Montréal you mention ?--Marc pasquin 01:11, 5 August 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Suggestion
Abbreviate the timeline and move it to the bottom; incoporate removed parts as prose. Also "sectionize" this—it rambles. Marskell 17:04, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
I will respond to this from Gary D: -- As a non-Canadian reader of the article, it would help me to know what specific protections were removed by the invocation of the Act, i.e., what normally would happen that did not. Hope this comment is helpful. --Gary D 08:11, 12 Jun 2004 (UTC) --
The war measure act was used to arrest people who disagreed with Trudeau, the monarchist leader of the canadian monarchy. They sent the army at super time to arrest Singer and Union leader. Without any charge or even hint of any wrong doing, this protection in a normal society is call habeas corpus, basicaly you need to have a reason to arrest somebody. They didn't. How did they know what people to sent to jail ? They stole PQ membership list. Again stealing the membership list name is a criminal offense and yet they did it. So basicaly they had and still have the list of every person who vote against them.
It is only fair to mention that canadian monarchist also have their own terrorist, the Caporal Denis Lortie, who shot dead 3 people while attempting to kill all the elected deputy of the Lévesque party.
[edit] Peer Review for CCOTW
See Talk:CCOTW. Zhatt 21:29, 12 October 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Number of people arrested, part 2
Since this the contribution of the week, could someone else review the revert that Marc Allaire had made to my contribution about this subject. He never answered back and other people decision would be appreciated (even if it goes against what I wrote)--Marc pasquin 18:05, 14 October 2005 (UTC)
[edit] October Crisis in the media?
What this article fails to mention is the lack the explanation of the October Crisis' impact on media, including the films made about the crisis, or set during the time period. --TcDohl 15:20, 3 November 2005 (UTC)
[edit] October 16th
I changed the wording around a bit for the October 16th bullet point, no one actually asked for the War Measures Act to be implemented, and the sourcing was wrong on one of the quotes. It should be alright now, although feel free to change it, I put in the source. Endos 04:18, 27 March 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Link between FLQ & Parti Québécois
Even if the PQ is for Quebec independance, that doesn't makes them linked in anyway with FLQ... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Vlimar (talk • contribs).
[edit] Death of Pierre Laporte
Maybe it would be a good idea to give the version that Laporte actually cutted his wrists by trying to escape and died through blood lost, rather than strangulation... There always been 2 version of his death. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Vlimar (talk • contribs).
[edit] Black October Link
I just signed up so won't edit the live page yet, don't want to overstep my bounds. :)
The (internal) media link to the CBC documentary "Black October" actually links to a page about a rap album by rapper Sadat X being released in October, 2006... was there a page or has it disappeared?
[edit] Accents?
Perhaps someone might like to go through the page and either put accents on letters where appropriate, or remove them all entirely (I support the former). The way it is, though, e.g., sometimes Québec, sometimes Quebec, sometimes Montréal, sometimes Montreal, is both common in this article and unduly inconsistent.
I do not know French, though, so I'm no authority on what accents go where. 24.141.76.6 05:00, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
- There was only one accent out of place that I saw (now fixed). The normal practice (here and elsewhere) is to use the English names Quebec and Montreal rather than the French names Québec and Montréal. However, when the words are part of a longer proper name that has no official English version (like Sûreté du Québec or Journal de Montréal), the accents stay. Indefatigable 13:08, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] There is a citation missing
Merely stating that Canadians in and out of Quebec overwhelmingly favored the instituting of the War Measures Act doesn't make that true. I hope that those citations and various others are added to corroborate the statements made in this article. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 65.110.30.180 (talk) 23:45, 22 February 2007 (UTC).
