Talk:Nyarlathotep

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[edit] Mr. Skin

"Mr. Skin" doesn't sound very Lovecraftian. -Litefantastic 12:27, 26 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Eh, that was my first impression as well. However, I found out that Mr. Skin is the title of a short story written by Victor Milán that appeared in an "anthology of twenty-one stories developping the Cthulhu Mythos", Cthulhu's Heirs (source). I have never come across any of Milán's works, but apparently he is a Prometheus Award recipient who wrote quite a bit of novels, as shown here. This seems to be his official website. As for the connection between Mr. Skin and Nyarlathotep, I saw it mentionned on this page as well as this one.
I'm not the one who added Mr. Skin on that list, by the way. Just wanted to share the information I found regarding this particular Nyarlathotep avatar using Google. I think "Mr. Skin" may as well be listed in this article, even if I'm not certain that it is notable. -- Audrey 04:46, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Ambiguous wording

The Dark Pharaoh: a hairless man with dead black skin and hooves for feet; this form is peculiar to Egypt. This form and the previous two appear to be slight variations on the same Mask.

I'm concerned about the wording here getting out of date as new entries are made - indeed, I wonder if it already has, as "The Crawling Chaos" is probably not one of the two forms intended. I'm not qualified to rework it correctly though, not knowing the original intent. nae'blis (talk) 17:46, 30 September 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Pronunciation

I actually came to this page hoping that there would be a pronunciation of Nyarlathotep. Maybe someone who knows how to pronounce it could include the pronunciation near the top of the page, in the usual spot one would place it. --magiluke 00:11, 25 November 2005 (UTC)

  • I always pronouced it Nyar-la-ho-tep. I base this assumption - yes, I confess that's all it is - on the fact that 'ho-tep' is a real and legitimate surname, such as in Bubba Ho-tep. -Litefantastic 00:20, 25 November 2005 (UTC)
  • It seems that you are pronouncing Nyar as one syllable. I always wanted to make it two syllables. I'm guessing it's similar to the way you pronounce kyo in Tokyo, or nyet. --magiluke 00:51, 25 November 2005 (UTC)

From many years of reading Lovecraft and all the others my take on pronunciation is Nuh-Yarl-Uh-Tho-Tep.Wizardboy 18:37, 17 February 2006 (UTC)

  • I've always pronounced it N-yarl-A-tho-tep. Reading Litefantastic's comment, I suspect it should be pronounced N-yarl-at-Ho-tep. Maby there should be something in the article that addresses that there is no consensus on pronunciation?Pdarley 19:33, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
  • Lovecraft wrote that the pronounciation doesn't matter since the names aren't made for human tongues.172.173.186.227 16:36, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Ambiguous text

I removed the following text because I can't figure out what it means. No reference was given, so I don't what to make of it:

Nyarlathotep (the Crawling Chaos): A desert noise cult whose namesake has convicted some to create "loathsome sounds from beyond".

-,-~R'lyehRising~-,- 16:06, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

  • Update. This is apparently some sort of noise band; however, the sentence is poorly written (should "convicted" be "convinced"?) and most certainly does not belong at the top of the page. Based on other information (see Talk:List of noise musicians#Nyarlathotep), it may not be noteworthy enough for inclusion anyway. RlyehRising 12:15, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Original research

The Nyarlathotep in the mythos section contains information that appears to be original research since it does not say where it comes from. This section could be greatly improved by providing verifiable information.
-,-~R'lyehRising~-,- 16:24, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

The following section is a sort of hodgepodge. Some of the info can be substiantiated with a ref, while other pieces seem to violate WP:NOR. I have noted my recommendations for clean up.

Nyarlathotep differs from the other beings in a number of ways. Most of them are exiled to stars, like Yog-Sothoth and Hastur, or sleeping and dreaming like Cthulhu; Nyarlathotep, however, is active and frequently walks the Earth in the guise of a human being, usually a tall, slim, joyous man.[1] Most of them have their own cults serving them, while Nyarlathotep seems to serve them and take care of their affairs in their absence.[2] Most of them use strange alien languages, while Nyarlathotep uses human languages and can be mistaken for a human being.[3] Finally, most of them are all powerful yet purposeless, yet Nyarlathotep seems to be deliberately deceptive and manipulative, and even uses propaganda to achieve his goals.[4]In this regard, he is probably the most human-like among them.[5]

Notes

  • 1 This probably does not need a reference. Most of these facts are covered by other Cthulhu mythos articles.
  • 2 The phrasing needs to be changed here; it is somewhat vague. I'm not sure what "affairs" refers to (since the Outer Gods are said to be mindless and care little for the human world).
  • 3 I'm not familiar with the Outer Gods' "strange alien languages"; what source speaks of this? (This appears to be largely a deduction on the part of the original author.)
  • 4 This could be substantiated; the part about "propaganda" is somewhat dubious. (Nyarlathotep seems to prefer outright lying; e.g., "The Dweller in Darkness" by August Derleth; "The Dream-Quest of Unknown Kadath" by HPL.)
    • Update. Upon reflection, the depiction of Nyarlathotep as a sort of "charlatan/showman" in Lovecraft's prose poem of the same name would suggests that "propaganda" might just be one of the things in his bag of tricks. RlyehRising12:24, 18 February 2006 (UTC)
  • 5 Looks like a generalization. So Nyarlathotep is like human beings because he is deceitful? That's an interesting claim (and not without its merits); however, can this be substantiated by a source?

-,-~R'lyehRising~-,- 17:07, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

Expanding on this, considering that Lovecraft did not intend for there to be a "Cthulhu Mythos" and that there's substantial lack of clarity in the existence of a "canon" of Cthulhu Mythos, I'm overall puzzled by some of the portions of this article, particularly the table of forms, which seems to be treating many different materials together as forming a sort of canon of Nyarlathotep. To my mind, this article requires substantive restructuring, beginning with a section limited to Nyarlathotep's appearances in Lovecraft's fiction, and then keeping the various sources clear throughout so as not to delve into novel synthesis and original research. Phil Sandifer 20:53, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

I think this article would greatly benefit from junking the table as well as the section noted by R'lyeh Rising. Nareek 01:34, 24 October 2006 (UTC)
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