Talk:NEXTSTEP

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the debate was no consensus. —Nightstallion (?) ^{Seen this already?} 10:37, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Requested move

NEXTSTEP → NeXTSTEP – Despite the inconsistent naming, a cursory search of the wiki, as well as the article in question seem to indicate that NeXTSTEP is the predominately used capitalization on the site. While no standard seems to exist on what the right capitalization is, I suggest NeXTSTEP be affirmed as Wikipedia's choice on the basis of precedence.

[edit] Survey

Add *Support or *Oppose followed by an optional one-sentence explanation, then sign your opinion with ~~~~

• Support as less ambiguaous, but it's still ambiguous (wasn't there a TV show?) so maybe NeXT operating system would be better. Ewlyahoocom 11:48, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

NeXT technically produced two operating systems, the other being OPENSTEP. Dysprosia 12:02, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

Not unless you consider NEXTSTEP and OPENSTEP as being two versions of the same operating system, as OpenStep seems to do: "they released an OpenStep compliant version of their flagship operating system NeXTSTEP (...) and rebranded it OPENSTEP". Qwertyus 01:33, 9 May 2006 (UTC)

They clearly have different names. "NeXT operating system" doesn't describe either. Dysprosia 06:32, 9 May 2006 (UTC)

• Support any consistent capitalisation. I like "NEXTSTEP," but "NeXTSTEP" or "NeXtsTEp" or whatever is fine so long as we pick one and stick to it. NEXTSTEP the OS is the primary meaning of the word, if there is a TV show or anything else that has a Wikipedia article it can be linked to in standard ways (Template:otheruses1 etc). NicM 11:57, 8 May 2006 (UTC).
• Strong Oppose NEXTSTEP's logos are clearly all-caps Logos, which, yes, constrasts with their capitalization of NeXT, the company name. --Davidstrauss 09:35, 9 May 2006 (UTC)
• Oppose If NEXTSTEP was the final name, we should use that. Other articles should use the capitalization appropriate for the time they are describing. Qwertyus 09:14, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Discussion

NEXTSTEP uses NEXTSTEP. Perhaps we need to make the capitalization consistent, not the page name. Dysprosia 08:06, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

That sounds awfully confusing. The operating system went through at least 4 different name changes, and I don't believe that the system internals actually referred to itself with any care to capitalization. NeXT marketing was also rather inconsistent with their capitalization. -- Inanup 07:24, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

Yes, but the operating system's login page says "NEXTSTEP", which is rather indicative. Dysprosia 08:58, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

I don't have a copy of NeXTSTEP handy, but I do recall seeing in The NeXT Book by Bruce Webster, published when the NeXT cube was first released, and the login pane screenshot had no indication of the OS name, just a giant NeXT logo. Are we just going by the OS' last iteration in choosing the naming convention? My thinking is that it's better to call it NeXTSTEP because it seems to encompass the camel case variants that the OS had prior. I realize most stuff on the web shows NEXTSTEP, but that's probably because that was the version that had the most Internet presence due to timing. -- Inanup 23:29, 9 May 2006 (UTC)

When people change their names, we use their new name, not their old name. NEXTSTEP was NEXTSTEP at its last iteration, so we should use NEXTSTEP. Dysprosia 23:34, 9 May 2006 (UTC)

Well, if that's the position, then I think that NeXTSTEP (or any other variants) should be a redirect to OPENSTEP, since the OS just changed names and conformed to the OpenStep API developed by NeXT. -- Inanup 01:14, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

You make it sound like the jump from NeXTSTEP to OPENSTEP is a trivial one -- it isn't -- even though the operating systems may look the same, architecturally there are large differences. It makes sense to keep the two distinct since we don't need a discussion about NeXTSTEP when we are discussing the OpenStep API in the same breath since they have nothing to do with each other. The OpenStep article does not just talk about the implementation, OPENSTEP, but discusses the use of the API as well. Dysprosia 01:18, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

Fair enough, but couldn't we expand each: the API and the OS, to independent articles. I realize I'm deviating, but just a thought. -- Inanup 04:17, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

We could, but that still may not be appropriate -- for example, compare Mac OS pre OS X and OS X, there are (if I remember correctly) seperate articles on each. What would be a good idea perhaps is to have a "timeline" type article, discussing both OSes briefly, and then linking to each article on each OS as a "main article". Dysprosia 04:20, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

Really? I thought we used the name that most people expect to find, accounting for things like ambiguity, and that what someone is "named" or chooses to call themselves is only a part of that calculation. Or maybe we should use the Wikipedia:Naming conventions (names and titles) page? How does "NeXTSTEP III, 17th Baronet NEXTSTEP" grab you? Ewlyahoocom 23:59, 9 May 2006 (UTC)

Yes, really. We use the name that something is called, and provide redirects as appropriate to mop up any ambiguity to previous naming. Dysprosia 00:04, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

Well, I guess one learns something new everyday. Hey, when you get a chance, could you move Marshall Applewhite to Do? Thanks. Ewlyahoocom 00:09, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

Ignoring the fact that we are not talking about Marshall Applewhite, and that Applewhite has nothing to do with NEXTSTEP at all, I don't know enough about Applewhite to know whether the suggestion that "Do" is a nickname as the Do article suggests or whether Applewhite was widely known as such to warrant a page move -- but seeing as you appear to be knowledgeable about naming matters, why don't you be bold and do that yourself? Dysprosia 00:42, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.