Talk:Marshallese language
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Okay I know this isn't even close to the usual Wikipedia language article format but when I saw the article completely empty I had to add something. This is basically the text from and article I wrote on everything2 some years ago. Please edit this article into shape. I hope I've kick-started it now. — Hippietrail 23:30, 6 Sep 2004 (UTC)
- Yokwe and io̧kwe are certainly the same word spelled differently—speculating, I'd guess the former may be an older or more Anglicized spelling; either that, or the language's spelling just isn't quite standardized yet. —Muke Tever 03:36, 13 Sep 2004 (UTC)
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- In 1998 the Marshall Islands issued a series of stamps, each with a letter of the alphabet and a picture of a word beginning with that letter. This suggests to me that they were celebrating a new official alphabet/orthography. Especially since the language manual and other sources are so different. I'm pretty sure the Marshallese dictionary also uses an older orthography but I haven't been able to find one to look at yet. Hehe - I've just realized I've already got a link to the alphabet stamps anyway! (-: — Hippietrail 06:41, 13 Sep 2004 (UTC)
[edit] Native name of the language
Back when I first became interested in Marshallese I heard that "Ebon" was the correct native name and thought I'd confirmed it - but can't remember any of my sources. A couple of years later I saw "Kajin M̧ajeļ" - but not in this correct up-to-date Unicode (nice!) - can we try to find out if they are both correct or one might need to go. Marshallese dictionary anyone? (: — Hippietrail 00:03, 16 Sep 2004 (UTC)
- Kajin M̧ajeļ is literally "tongue of Marshall" ("M̧ajeļ" being the closest you're going to get to "Marshall".) The Ethnologue lists Ebon as an alternate name, but it doesn't say who uses it—whether it's a native designation, an alternate English designation, or what. Incidentally, the 1911 encyclopedia refers to Ebon as the main name, with Marshall in parentheses (e.g. [1]).
- It looks like it was called Ebon after the Ebon atoll in the Marshall Islands—especially so as the two dialect names given are Ratak and Ralik, also geographical names (see Geography of the Marshall Islands)—apparently because Ebon was one of the first islands with European trade (according to History of the Marshall Islands). I'm guessing it got to be called "Marshall(ese)" proper after it was identified with the group as a whole being "The Marshall islands". Yesno? —Muke Tever 04:07, 16 Sep 2004 (UTC)
[edit] Ampersand
- I could have sworn I read that Marshallese used the ampersand ("&") as a vowel. Is this correct? Ampersand links here this reason --[jon] [talk] 17:09, 14 Mar 2005 (UTC)
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- Yes you did read that but it is wrong. There exist some simplistic teaching aids for the Marshallese language which were typed on machines which lacked the exotic Marshallese letters. Some people seem to have assumed that this is the correct orthography. Hardly surprising since information on Marshallese is so scarce. There is a dictionary in existence however, and it contains a brief description of the phonology and orthography. You won't find it in too many bookshops but university libraries should have a copy. — Hippietrail 11:12, 15 Mar 2005 (UTC)
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- This site (which unfortunately appears to be commercial), quotes from a book, (The Languages of the World, by Kenneth Katzer) that appears to indicate that Marshallese does use the ampersand to indicate "a vowel sound somewhere between e and i." I'm sure that I have seen a version of the quoted book somewhere at a library here. If I can find it I could get a page number. Miss Madeline | Talk to Madeline 22:23, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
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- Indeed, Katzner says so: The alphabet includes an ampersand (&) which represents a vowel sound somewhere between e and i, as well as seven special consonants:. I am unable to find Unicode equivalents for the seven consonants; they look like m,n,t with a vertical stroke on top (placed like an accent, but vertical instead of diagonal) and g,n,l,r with two of these vertical strokes. Katzner also gives a sample text that shows the ampersand (which seems to be frequent) and some of the special consonants; also, an apostrophe appears after the vowel i in some words. 88.73.5.184 22:52, 9 October 2006 (UTC)
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- The ampersand is found in Byron Bender’s “Phonetic Spelling” in the book Spoken Marshallese. Katzner took his example text from this book (pg. 61). I believe Katzner mistook the phonetic spelling for the practical orthography. The characters m̍ n̍ t̍ g̎ n̎ l̎ r̎ are all available in Unicode. The single vertical line accent is U+030D and the double vertical line accent is U+030E. Thus to type n̎, U+006E U+030E. Languagegeek 11:12, 1 November 2006 (UTC)
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[edit] re: orthography
i've heard that there is more than one orthography used to write Marshallese. the one chosen depends on religious affiliation. that's all i know. just noting it here because i wouldnt want to Wikipedia to offend some speakers. peace – ishwar (speak) 04:45, 25 October 2005 (UTC)
- I would if I knew them. Unfortunately, my greatest familiarity is with the modern official standard. I never became fluent in the language, and left the archipelago when I was a teenager, and only started studying it again lately. Resources online are pretty scarce... - Gilgamesh 08:15, 25 October 2005 (UTC)
- I haven't heard of differing orthographies by religious affiliation, but my primary association was with Protestant Christians. Catholics are a minority, and other religions are very small. Of course, indigenous religious practices creep in. But I don't know of any linguistic difference by religion.mssever (Talk | Blog) 01:12, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
- I might be wrong, but I think I read somewhere that South-African Muslims (or Muslim clericks) write/wrote Afrikaans with the Arabic alphabet. But whether they used it because of their religion, or they didn't have any knowledge about Latin letters, I don't know. Mulder1982 15:35, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
- I haven't heard of differing orthographies by religious affiliation, but my primary association was with Protestant Christians. Catholics are a minority, and other religions are very small. Of course, indigenous religious practices creep in. But I don't know of any linguistic difference by religion.mssever (Talk | Blog) 01:12, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
