Talk:Malapropism

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According to my dictionary (Webster's New Collegiate, 1961) ENORMITY has the following meaning:

"state or quality of being enormous; especially exceeding wickedness; also, an outrageous act or offense"

This seems to imply that enormousness is one of the meanings of enormity.

Also, BARBARIC is defined as:

"1. Uncivilized or having a primitive civilization; rude; as, barbaric empires. 2. Showing lack or restraint or refinement; wild, showy, or exuberant; as, barbaric magnificence."

This implies that barbaric sometimes means barbarous. In fact, one of the definitions of BARBAROUS is "barbaric".

I will change the main page unless I hear a good argument against it. Perhaps the original author(s) is making the point that the malapropisms have made their way into the language to the point of being acceptable. This is not clear in the article. --Samuel Wantman 06:31, 23 Oct 2004 (UTC)

You might want to look into British vs. American English usages regarding barbaric/barbarous but especially in enormity/enormousness. Cigarette 17:33, 5 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Ditto "fortuitous"[1] according to Merriam-Webster Online. " (the sense) has been influenced in meaning by fortunate. It has been in standard if not elevated use for some 70 years, but is still disdained by some critics." M-W's editors have similar comments regarding "enormity." --Exia 25 July 2005 6:57 (UTC)

Contents 1 Would this count as one? 2 Bush? 3 Ringo Starr 4 I, for one, oppose intravenous fertilization 5 I'm nauseous - er, nauseated - er, sick of this! 6 I.E. 7 Confusing 8 Hard Day's Night 9 Although many people couldn't care less... 10 removal of unattributed malapropisms 11 encyclopedia 12 "Better make like a tree and get outta here" (leaf) 13 My Malapropism 14 Unattributed 15 Quotefarm 16 Dogberryism 17 Damon Wayans 18 Medical malapropisms 19 More Removals 20 Removed Michael Richards bit 21 Lack of Explanation 22 Add 23 Common Malapropism Added

[edit] Would this count as one?

Hey Jack, you're late! (As in ejaculate)

No, that's a pun. --Heron 21:07, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Bush?

Umm, is the Bush reference necessary? Seems a tad NPOV (as in, HAHA THE PRESIDENT IS A DUMBASS HAHA). I'm just curious. --Thorns Among Our Leaves 29 June 2005 00:40 (UTC)

I dunno, looking at much of the rest of Wikipedia, it seems that HAHA THE PRESIDENT IS A DUMBASS HAHA is considered "neutral".

Much like global warning is no longer up for debate, the president being a dumbass has not been questionable for quite some time.

Well, most people (~95%) from out of the country would agree with you, but unfortunately, thirty percent of the good ol' U-S-of-A disagree, and thus Wikipedia has to be neutral. However, maybe a reference to teh internets might be worthy, or speculation about if our children is learning. WBHoenig 00:50, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

I'd say, based on that poll (sounds about right to me) that we only need to be 30% neutral in this case. For the sake of them poor 'Merkin dumbasses, dontcha know. +ILike2BeAnonymous 01:45, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Ringo Starr

This has been moved from the article:

"Ringo Starr was famous for his many malapropisms, some of which became Beatles songs, including:

• Tomorrow never knows
• It's been a hard days night
• Eight days a week"

I think an explanation is needed of what these phrases would have been if properly expressed, as is done with the preceding examples. It's not obvious how they are malapropisms or if, in fact, they really are.

I don't think any of those are malapropisms. "Eight days a week", for example, is just an exaggeration, like stupid coaches demand their players to give 110% (assuming you would drop dead if you gave 100%, 110% must require that your ghost put in some effort, as well). StuRat 23:27, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

"A hard day's night" sounds perfectly fine to me, using "day" to mean a 24 hour period, and "night" to mean the dark portion of that day. Thus, it means "the dark portion of a difficult 24 hour period". I'm sure they chose it for the apparent oxymoron, if "day" had been taken at it's other meaning, "the light portion of the 24 hour period", then you would get a meaning like "a difficult light portion's dark portion". I suppose even then you could interpret some meaning, though, like "a difficult eclipse". StuRat 23:27, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

"Tomorrow never knows" seems to be an example of anthropomorphization, where the possibility exist that a day can "know" anything, when we know that it can't. StuRat 23:27, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] I, for one, oppose intravenous fertilization

It isn't a moral opposition, or anything. I'm just pretty sure it's the wrong way to do it. Squidd 20:59, 27 July 2005 (UTC)

This might be a bit ectopic, but don't worry, no fertilization will occur, as long as the needle is sterile. :-) StuRat 23:10, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] I'm nauseous - er, nauseated - er, sick of this!

Merriam-Webster Online basically says it's now OK to feel nauseous - lookie here.

I think you mean "Merriam-Webser Online now acknowledges that people say they feel nauseous", because modern dictionaries observe usage, not dictate it — mendel ☎ 16:22, 19 September 2005 (UTC)

[edit] I.E.

I.E. stands for "in example", yet it is used to clarify the actual word that the malapropism replaced. Therefore the actual word is not an example, so all the "i.e."s should be removed.

No it doesn't. It stands for id est, which means 'that is'. --Heron 20:06, 25 October 2005 (UTC)

And this is on this talk page? *snorts*

I agree with Heron, i.e. does not mean "in example" no matter how widely that error is believed. Blue Dinosaur Jr 16:22, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

The level of ignorance around here is astounding. I.e. = "id est" = "that is"; what you're looking for is e.g., "exempli gratia" = "for example" (close enough for government work). +ILike2BeAnonymous 18:31, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Confusing

The introductory paragraph of the article gives two different etymologies...either the word is directly from the French or from the name, which is from the other English word, which is from the French. Not knowing which is true I won't edit it, but someone should.--Mobius Soul 19:33, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Hard Day's Night

The thing about the origins of "Hard Day's Night" is (slightly) interesting, but doesn't belong here, in my opinion. There are no real malopropisms involved. dbtfz^talk 03:23, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

I'm going to remove this anecdote, since it is related in more detail in a more appropriate place, namely, A Hard Day's Night (film). dbtfz^talk 03:29, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

This is not the first time "Hard Day's Night" has been removed from this page and probably won't be the last. Unfortunately, it seems from the article about the film that both John Lennon and Paul McCartney have both, wrongly, described this phrase as a malapropism. It clearly isn't but as a result no doubt people who have read the film article will continue to add this phrase to the "malapropism" page. With any luck, other vigilant editors will continue to remove it! Adrian Robson 18:44, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Although many people couldn't care less...

My dad and I got in a huge, hilarious fight about this. Is it "I could care less" or "I couldn't care less". I argued for the latter and my dad said I sounded like a dumbass.

"I could care less" to me implies that the person cares about the subject to some degree, because compared to the degree they currently care, it is potentially possible that they could care less in comparison. If a person does not care at all, they could make the statement "I couldn't care less". They do not care at all now, and so there is no possibility that they could ever care less than that. If you don't care about something, it seems more appropriate to say "I couldn't care less". Asa01 20:10, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

Yes, you are correct. Unfortunately, a good portion of the people say it the wrong way, including your dad. StuRat 23:01, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

The phrase I couldn't care less may be explained by this illustration.

I wish to go down further but I could not go down any further because there is no more further down to go. Therefore I couldn't go further down, even though I wanted to.

Similarly,

I would have cared less. I really want to care less but there is nothing less that I could care about it since I really don't care about it. Therefore, I couldn't care less, even though I wanted to care further less.

Similarly,

I couldn't be happier. Please come to my home for Rosh HaShanah. You won't be intruding because there is nothing that would make me happier. Therefore, I couldn't be happier because having your company for Rosh HaShanah is my ultimate joy.

Miamidot 03:33, 27 October 2006 (UTC)

I think it can work both ways, and it doesn't really matter these days, because both give people the same impression. To me, "I could care less" is like mocking the person, saying, "I'd be fine if I somehow cared less about this subject than I already do." In my opinion, you show even the slightest bit of care by acknowledging what the person said and responding with "I couldn't care less," so to me..."I couldn't care less" is more like an opinion that has to be held before stating while "I could care less" more appropriately exists as an opinion after having acknowledged that you'd be responding.

...Did I confuse anyone? Malumultimus 09:06, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Well, no, it can't work both ways. Unless you feel that language has no meaning. "I could care less" means, literally, that I care more about something than I conceivably could, which is the opposite of "I couldn't care less"; for a pungent simile for the latter, try "the instrument has yet to be invented which can measure my indifference towards ________". +ILike2BeAnonymous 19:46, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] removal of unattributed malapropisms

The following were removed with no reason given:

• "I'm going out for a breast of flesh air." (i.e. breath of fresh)
• "Scabway: Eat Flesh." (i.e. Subway: Eat Fresh)
• "It'll only take a mint" (i.e. minute)
• "Escalator!" (i.e. See you later!) - Also works with calculator, ovulater, emulator, A.C. Slater, Purolator, mashed potater, etc.
• "It'll be black in a bitch." (i.e. back in a bit)
• "Fangs and good knife." (i.e. Thanks and good night)
• "Twat? I cunt hear you. Tits okay. I must have an ear infucktion. Bare ass me again." (i.e. What? I can't hear you. It's okay. I must have an ear infection. Better ask me again.)

I noticed the majority of the examples on the main page are typically accidental malapropisms, and perhaps the above were seen as 'too contrived'. However, they are still perfectly good examples of malapropisms (i.e. "an incorrect usage of a word by substituting a similar-sounding word with different meaning, usually with comic effect").

I will add them back, and if anyone objects please state your view.

Thanks, nkife 06:36, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Firstly, these are not malapropism. They shouldn't be listed. They are either intentional phrases or they are misquoted phrases. However, in misquoting a phrase and yet understanding the actual meaning of the misquoted phrase is not malapropism.

e.g. Having heard Neil Sedaka's song wrongly and singing,

Oh Carol, I am bloody fool

instead of

Oh Carol, I am but a fool

is not malapropism because I understand what the wrong lyric that I am singing actually means.

To be malapropic, I would misunderstand pineapple of my career as having the meaning of peak of my career.

Secondly, malapropism not malapropisms. It is a collective noun. Equipment not equipments. Deer not deers. Data not datas - even though we have lots of data, it is still data not datas. Unless we are making a list of various types of a collection. e.g. The various soils where the pineapple could grow.

Miamidot 04:13, 27 October 2006 (UTC)

^Call me a pedant, but data is not a collective noun, it's the plural form of 'datum'. One datum, lots of data, it's just it's not very often we have just one datum. A Collective noun is moose - the word moose is both the singular and the plural. Data is simply a plural like Criteria - one criterion, many criteria - where the plural of the word is much more commonly used than the singular. --Elín 16:41, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

The association of the singular datum with data has faded in the English language. Datum has normally been used as an architectural or engineering term. A point or line of reference. In fact, in engineering and architectural language the plural for datum is datums not data. And to avoid further confusion, we call them datum lines or datum points. Data as an information technology term should be perceived as uncountable like water is. It should not be perceived as being able to be counted in any discrete singular quantity. Therefore, data as refered to in information technology is itself a collective noun without any practical association to its root word datum.

To quantify water we have to containerise it - a cup, a gallon, a litre. In engineering, to quantify data, we say a piece of data rather than a datum. Imagine, a programmer yelling, "That datum is missing." I don't think so. I believe she/he would rather yell, "That piece of data is missing."

Miamidot 07:30, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] encyclopedia

Why does this entry belong in an encyclopedia? It looks like a dictionary definition with lots of examples. I think this falls under what wikipedia is not... Pdbailey 21:21, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

A dictionary documents the meaning of a word.

An encyclopedia documents instances and situation of existence of that word.

Otherwise, there should be no encyclopedic entry for "Calculus" because it is a word that could be and should be found in a dictionary. However, an encyclopedic entry on "Calculus" would list the various fields of Calculus as well as dwelling on the subject in further detail.

One must differentiate the need for an encyclopedic entry from its need to be in a dictionary entry.

Clearly, a dictionary couldn't care less about giving all these interesting and educating examples of malapropism.

Miamidot 04:25, 27 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "Better make like a tree and get outta here" (leaf)

In this example, it seems that the intended word was a malapropism for "leave", but in it's final form it's really not a malapropism, right ? So, should it be removed from the article ? StuRat 23:06, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

I completely agree, and in fact I would say that even the intended word was a pun, "make like a tree and leaf" is a common pun in the English language. I went ahead and removed the phrase.Jaardon 09:11, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] My Malapropism

I don't know whether this example is appropriate for the entry, but I like it. I'm biased, of course.

"It's simple to be happy if you're happy to be single!"

You'd might have to know me or be a fixed-gear/single-speed junkie to get it. See www.sabertoothsalmon.com/stuff/malapropism.html.

[edit] Unattributed

the following "unattributed" are removed from article:

• "He missed that field goal by a microcosm." (i.e., micrometre)
• "You know I get ravishing when I play indoor cricket." (i.e. ravenous)
• "I feel like a social piranha." (i.e., pariah)
• "Don't talk about the baby; she had a misconception." (i.e., miscarriage)
• "It's been a pressure." (i.e. pleasure)
• "...tapered to suit your needs." (i.e. tailored)
• "Close but no guitar" (i.e. cigar)
• "I want everyone to conjugate over here." (i.e. congregate)
• "It'll only take a mint" (i.e. minute)
• "Spank you!" (i.e. Thank you)
• "Mute point" (i.e. Moot) Many people erroneously consider this to be a real phrase, implying the point is silent.
• "Moo point" (i.e. Moot) Some believe the phrase refers to the type of point a cow would make (i.e. ill-considered and irrelevant)

According to wikipedia rules, please provide references, to ensure notability. Wikipedia is not a place to collect anonymous nonnotable witticisms or sillicisms. `'mikka (t) 02:46, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Quotefarm

As an encyclopedia article, the body needs explanation of background, contextualizing in language & society... that sort of thing. A few examples (3-5?) are necessary for illustrations, but beyond that quotes should be at WikiQuote. ENeville 19:55, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Dogberryism

Is there anything established here (WP:NOR)? ENeville 19:58, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Damon Wayans

Several of his comedic characters have had a lot of fun with various malapropisms, to the point where it's become somewhat of a comic trademark. Probably worth a couple of citations. Black Max 10-30-06

[edit] Medical malapropisms

ChartFarts.com seems to have a pretty large collection on medical malapropisms. They claim to be authentic and either come from patients or their medical records. Funny name, too.

[edit] More Removals

The following two "examples" have been removed:

• "Come on down for a free canceltation (i.e. consultation) - Senor Cardgage
• "It's a world of madmen and uncertainty and potential mential losses." (i.e. missile launches) -- George W. Bush

As much as I like Homestar Runner and making fun of George Bush, neither canceltation nor mential are words. These are not malapropisms. Blue Dinosaur Jr 17:07, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Removed Michael Richards bit

Michael Richards, better known as Kramer from Seinfeld, didn't help matters during a Jerry Seinfeld-orchestrated apology on David Letterman's show, making repeated reference to "Afro-Americans" and becoming agitated when the audience tittered at his malapropisms.

I just watched the entire apology and there was only one thing that could be a malapropism: "I'll get to the force field of this hostility", and there is no audible audience reaction to that line. It might not even be a malapropism, more of a mangled metaphor. "Afro-American" certainly isn't a malapropism, and I don't know what else might be referred to here. - furrykef (Talk at me) 18:15, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Lack of Explanation

When I used define: malapropism, I found this:

Common malapropisms in modern English include use of: * Disinterested (impartial, unbiased) for uninterested ("A judge should be disinterested, but not uninterested")* Fortuitous (random, by chance) for fortunate* In the ascendancy for in the ascendant ("One has the ascendancy" vs "One is in the ascendant")* Barbaric for barbarous ("Barbaric" can be positive and is used of culture, "barbarous" is negative and used of behavior: "Barbaric splendor" vs "Barbarous cruelty")* Enormity (a heinous ...

This is an excellent way of explaining it- and explains the difference between the two words far more clearly. However, when I followed the link - that's not what I found at all. I can't find the above quoted in the article at all. Moreover, instead of having the format:

Fortuitous (random, by chance) for fortunate

This article would say something like:

Fortuitous for fortunate

Without actually explaining WHY they are not the same word, which is the whole POINT of a malapropism.

--Elín 16:51, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Add

I added Frank and Ernest to this page and am surprised no one else had yet! Anyone that can get a website, more useful comments please do so. --24.245.11.103 12:43, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Common Malapropism Added

I added a fictional reference from King of Queens, because in my opinion, it is actually common. 74.109.149.135 07:06, 17 March 2007 (UTC)