User talk:Lquilter/Archive 3

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Political artists cat.

Hey - I'd be interested in helping with it. I created a category for "Musical activists" myself a while ago, though it was deleted (and well should have been, with a name like that). I can add a few articles to the category whenever you'd like, in a few fields - visual arts, music, literature. Subcats can follow - I'd go with art atyles first, then go into politics from there, preferably keeping it fairly broad. Eg., anarchist musicians, fascist painters, socialist writers, libertarian poets, conservative interpretive dancers (ha!). Anyway, good luck. ~Switch t 16:49, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, I worry that the category is, currently, not well named. However, political art is a phenomena/genre that needs to be discussed, and it is a defining characteristic of some/many artists. The problem is that it's hard to define by the subcats of political belief -- see issues on Category talk:American liberals (discussed Wikipedia talk:Categorization of people#people by political belief and see Wikipedia talk:Overcategorization#Occupation by religion categories. I'm not sure what the solution is. I support categorizing for (a) important categories / genres of work; (b) potentially categorizing based on certain identities; and (c) not categorizing with unclear or controversial terms (like "liberal" or "conservative" in the US). Somewhere there's a sensible categorizing philosophy but I haven't been able to articulate it yet. ... In the meantime, yes, I think we should be populating these categories with people who are making specifically political art. --lquilter 16:58, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

SBA abortion views

Just to give you a heads up on the situation over at the Anthony page, the user James xeno and I have had issues in the past on exactly how SBA's view in respect to abortion should read in the article, with myself favoring historical context and Xeno pushing for a staunch anti-abortion position. I have laid out my feelings regarding a potential revision of the info per your suggestion on the talk page. Meanwhile, Xeno continues to stealthily edit in favor of his POV irrespective of any prior discussion, so keep an eye out for that. Cheers.--Jackbirdsong 04:41, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

  • Thanks for the update -- yes, I've added SBA to my watchlist. These stealth POV-ers are so annoying! --lquilter 18:30, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

Re:Category American liberals

Hi-I understand your position, and I agree that the category as defined is probably way, way too vague. I just thought that Zinn fit the category as it is currently defined (which currently is essentially everything on the left side of the political spectrum; perhaps a rename to Cateogry: American leftists or such is in order?) Anyway, it looks like it's about to become a non-issue soon anyway, because the category looks headed for defeat at CFD (and I can't say I'd be sad for it). Bduddy 05:46, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

  • Right, it is a sort of de facto "leftists" category (although even that term is a little problematic to some radicals). I agree that the category "as defined" included, probably, Zinn; the problem was that the definition didn't correspond to most notions of "liberal"; and "liberal" is a real political identity .... Conceptually, I think it's good to be able to categorize people by important identifiers like their politics. Hopefully the community will come up with some good guidelines on how to handle these issues -- something sensible & not as prone to abuse as the current cat structure. You'll participate, I hope, in discussions at Wikipedia talk:Categorization of people#people by political belief? --lquilter 18:35, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

LIS

Hi, would be interested in commenting at User talk:Pegship#LIS? Cheers, —Ruud 02:27, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

IP lawyer

Hey, me too! Maybe we should have our own subcat for Wikipedian IP Lawyers (there are others). bd2412 T 17:27, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

If you start it, I'll join it. Wikipedians can never be over-categorized! We should subdivide by types of pet, regions of the country, and favorite author, at least! I would be a cat-loving northeastern/pacific northwestern/ Le Guin public interest copyright lawyer. --lquilter 19:12, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

3RR

Please stop making misrepresentations as you just did on my talk page, when you insunuated that I had broken the three-revert rule, when you knew very well that I hadn't. Stop obsessively undoing every edit I make on the Nadine Gordimer page. You need to discuss things, not just delete. And stop making personal threats that you are going to have me blocked from Wikipedia, simply because I do not share your politics. Personal threats have a way of boomeranging back at their originators. 70.23.199.239 00:21, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

I gave you a warning that you had hit 3Rs on the same page. I have discussed things ad nauseum on the Talk:Nadine Gordimer page as the edit history attests. I have never made personal threats of having you blocked; I've given you warnings only after you repeatedly violated WP:CIVIL and engaged in edit warring. --lquilter 00:31, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Dealing with problem editors

I noticed that you posted this, then deleted it. It's a good question; I want to offer some thoughts.

I would also like outside commentary on & suggestions for my interactions with this editor. I am stressed by the ongoing inability to have a dialogue about the substance of issues, and keep getting sucked in by the pointless accusations the editor makes about other editors. I would prefer to disengage entirely, but what is my responsibility to deal with the issues? This is a community ...?

  • First, some editors simply don't respond to constructive comments. My standard is to give them one chance, then to basically ignore them. By basically ignore, I mean that once I've asked them to pleae follow (say) WP:CIVIL, it's not worth repeating.
  • Second, if a posting on a talk page is an egregious violation of WP:CIVIL or WP:NPA, it may be worth simply deleting the offending language and citing the policy violated, in the edit summary. I always also cite Wikipedia:Talk Page and WP:TPG, because those say what a talk page should be used for; if nothing else, incivlity and personal attacks violate those guidelines.
  • Third, you absolutely want to avoid going point-to-point with a disruptive editor when he/she attacks you or others; that just feeds the fire. Simply saying "I think the above comments are not in keeping with WP:AGF and I urge you and others to focus on discussing the article, per (cite talk page guidelines]] is a flat, factual statement. If an editor says "X is racist", don't argue that X is not; just say that the editor is off-topic and please observe (cite policy).
  • Fourth, at the risk of being redundant, you want to defend the process from getting bogged down in personalal/behavioral issues, if possible, not defend individual editors. Assume they have thick skins (something everyone should cultivate), and remember that this isn't the real world. Report blatant attacks (obscenities, shouting via caps, etc.) at WP:AN/I and otherwise restrict yourself to flat comments (above). If you are concerned about how other editors feel personally about attacks, put a note on their talk page saying that you think they're a constructive member of Wikipedia; that you're sorry that there are other editors who don't seem to want to work on improving the article; and that you hope they will continue to contribute and will largely ignore such attacks.

-- Hope that helps. If questions, just drop me a line. -- John Broughton | (♫♫) 00:06, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

Thanks John Broughton - this is helpful, especially the last point. --lquilter 00:14, 26 January 2007 (UTC)
You're welcome. (I added a couple of words that I mistakenly omitted on the first posting.) -- John Broughton (♫♫) 19:05, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

Categories on fauna in U.S. states

In the WP:CFD discussion, could you add additional comments specifying which states should be merged into which "U.S. region" category? I am not certain if I agree with the approach, but if other people prefer your suggestion, then having a more specific proposal would be helpful. Dr. Submillimeter 16:20, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

You mean that won't happen automatically with our brilliant admins? <g> okay, you're right, i'll try to be a bit more precise. --lquilter 16:41, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
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