Talk:List of lifestyles
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[edit] NPOV
Can this ever be NPOV? - Montréalais
[edit] Suggested move (done)
Shouldn't this be moved to List of lifestyles, as some of the lifestyles aren't alternative at all (e.g. Parenthood)? It would also make the list NPOV. Nikola 21:57, 9 Oct 2003 (UTC)
- Obviously it always depends on your own POV whether a particular lifestyle is an alternative or not. I seem to have missed the discussion about this page on VfD, but I think Nikola's suggestion is good. Judging from his question, this move would probably be supported by Montréalais. Comments? If not, I'll have coffee and cake and be back in an hour to do it. --KF 16:19, 16 Nov 2003 (UTC)
With filtering on, Google's only (unpunctuated) hits for "leather virginity" are pornos and this list. Does anyone know what it is? If anything? --Charles A. L. 15:17, Dec 2, 2003 (UTC)
[edit] Dispute/AFD
I added the dispute link. Most of the things listed here are not lifestyles. Also agree with the NPOV comment above.
Exploding Boy 03:08, Feb 7, 2004 (UTC)
- Come on! This is ridiculous. What "factual accuracy"? There isn't a single assertion in the "article" as it is just a list and does not even contain one complete sentence. What do you think should happen next? <KF> 03:23, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
- No assertions? Simply including something on a list of "(alternative) lifestyles" is an assertion. Some of the inclusions I challenge:
- Adoption. Adoption is a lifestyle? Or an alternative lifestyle?
- Bisexuality, heterosexuality. Lifestyles? Alternative lifestyles? This implies that (a) all bisexuals (heterosexuals) behave in the same way (b) bisexuality (heterosexuality) is a lifestyle alternative to the norm. Notice homosexuality is not on the list.
- Wealth?
- single parenting?
- This is nothing but a random list of things that have no connection. It's also wildly non-NPOV, and should probably be listed for deletion.
Exploding Boy 03:37, Feb 7, 2004 (UTC)
ETA: and I've just done so. Exploding Boy 03:45, Feb 7, 2004 (UTC)
[edit] Lifestyle article
- Our article on lifestyle is little more than a stub, but the basic idea at the beginning of the 21st century seems to be that if you are lucky (i e if you reside in a free country and if you do not live below the poverty line) you have a lot of choice these days. You can live your life any way you like unless you are a danger to others.
- The "article" (it's just a list really) seems to me like the result of a brainstorming session. Months ago it was me who objected to the label "alternative": Who is to judge what is the norm and what is deviant from it?
- As I see it, that's all there is to this list. It enumerates some/many of the options people have leading their lives. While "adoption" itself is not a lifestyle, adopting a child or children certainly is. The same is true of being a single parent, etc. etc.
- I don't really see how a list of options can ever be POV. <KF> 04:27, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
The lifestyle article says "A lifestyle is the way a person (or a group) lives. Having a specific "lifestyle" implies a conscious or unconscious choice between that group of characteristics and some other group of characteristics."
By that criteria, I can accept vegetarianism as a lifestyle, but adoption? Similarly, many people (frequently those opposed to gay rights) speak of a "gay lifestyle." Well, there's no such thing. Both of the following are lifestyles; which is gay?(Granted, homosexuality is not on the list, but it seems to have been an oversight. Humour me):
- Person A is married. He lives with his spouse. He wakes up at 7, has breakfast, takes the bus to work. On weekends and evenings he watches TV and spends time with his family. Once a year he vacations in France.
- Person B is single. He lives alone with his dog. He also wakes up at 7, but he rides a bike to work. On weekday evenings he relaxes at home, but on weekends he goes out to bars, goes to the movies, and spends time with friends.
Impossible to tell, right? I think that "lifestyle" is not the right word to use for many of the things on the list, (for example marriage, adoption, single parenting) while it works for others (vegetarianism, possibly Bah'ai, etc).
Exploding Boy 04:45, Feb 7, 2004 (UTC)
- Okay, let's see what others have to say. <KF> 04:50, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
I think this is already too vague to really be useful. I'm thinking maybe this should be broken apart into seperate sections--for example, list of religions already exists, and list of subcultures would be a useful list page. Otherwise, this is far too broad a topic for one list page. -Sean 10:38, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
[edit] What to include
I still have a problem with some of the supposed "lifestyles" included on this list, specifically:
- Alcoholism -- it's not a lifestyle, it's a disease.
- Bibliophilia -- would better be given as "bibliophilism," and loving books is not a lifestyle.
- Artist -- being an artist is not a lifestyle, it's a pursuit.
- Farming -- questionable. Again, it's a pursuit.
- Homelessness -- Homelessness means having no home. This is a lifestyle?
- Poverty -- this one is just silly. Poverty is a lifestyle? Lifestyle suggests something that one chooses. Do people choose poverty?
- Prostitution -- questionable.
- Vagrancy -- Vagrancy is essentially the state of being vagrant, which is basically the same as homelessness.
- Nicotinism -- Poisoning by nicotine is a lifestyle???
- Gay culture -- I strongly object to the characterization of homosexuality (or, for that matter, hetero- or bisexuality) as a lifestyle.
- Marriage -- again, a state rather than a lifestyle.
- Pedophilia -- this just goes too far. Paedophilia is a disease.
- Single parenting -- not a lifestyle.
- Surrogate parenting -- not a lifestyle.
- Yoga --???
- Traditional lifestyle -- what does this mean exactly?
No suitable definition of lifestyle has been provided, and the above fit no definition I can think of. Exploding Boy 08:41, Feb 12, 2004 (UTC)
[edit] Haiduk?
I doubt that there are haiduks anywhere after the fall of the Turkish Empire.
- Haiduks were active for quite some time after the fall. It is often rumoured that Karadzic or Mladic use haiduk system to hide today. Even if not, I don't see why former lifestyles shouldn't be mentioned. Nikola 05:49, 28 Jul 2004 (UTC)
-
- From the article:
- The following is a partial list of lifestyles that can be found in the 21st century.
- So 20th century or earlier don't qualify unless that introduction is changed. About Karadzic and Mladic's lifestyles, I don't really know, but in my understanding they should be robbing somebody in the 21st century to qualify as haiduks.
- From the article:
I'd like to renew my objections to this page. Most of the links posted here do not represent lifestyles in any meaningful way. Exploding Boy 21:58, May 21, 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Why is pedophilia listed?
How is pedophilia a "lifestyle"? // paroxysm (n) 18:35, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
[edit] List not useful
How are MOST of the things listed "lifestyles"? Exploding Boy 18:47, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
- Stuff like homelessness and farming are ways of life, i.e. lifestyles. Pedophilia, on the other hand, is merely an attraction, not a way to live.
// paroxysm (n)19:30, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
-
- How is that different than most of the section, "Sexual lifestyles"? Maybe that whole section should be removed. -Will Beback 23:34, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
Exactly what I've been trying to say for how many months now? Exploding Boy 00:49, 25 January 2006 (UTC)
- Then go ahead and remove the non-lifestyles already. Of course, sources would help, too.... -Will Beback 01:39, 25 January 2006 (UTC)
- I've added the {OriginalResearch} tag, since there are no sources listed and this list seems to be composed of whatever entries editors feel like adding. -Will Beback 22:39, 26 January 2006 (UTC)
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- Um, this is awful. It's not just original research, it's the sort of "research" done by high school kids who love to put everyone into groups and make bad, pointless articles like List of high school stereotypes. Second virginity? Feminism, Buddhism? Terrorist? This is a wide range of ideologies, preferences, environmental factors and other things that may affect the way someone lives, but it's so pointless to group them together as lifestyles as though that were useful at all. More importantly, most of the items on the list aren't discussed as a "lifestyle" in the article they refer to, making the list even more pointless. Why isn't it listed for deletion already? --The Famous Movie Director 12:12, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Move?
How about renaming this article to something like List of factors that contribute to social identity? There is a legitimate article on social identity, and most of the items on the list make more sense that way. You probably don't see parenting as your lifestyle, but being a parent certainly affects the way you perceive your social identity. --The Famous Movie Director 08:15, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
- Not actioned Paul foord 10:04, 7 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Merge List of subcultures here
- Oppose merger List of subcultures to here: lifestyle does not equal subculture, development and participation in a lifestyle not same as belonging to a subculture. There are problems with both lists being unclear, better to claerly differentiate each. Paul foord 10:30, 7 October 2006 (UTC)
- Absolutely oppose there is a huge difference between a 'lifestyle' and being part of a subculture. Any sociologist can testify to that. Wikipedia should not be held hostage to people's ignorance, or politically correct bias. The Crying Orc 21:08, 25 October 2006 (UTC)
Removed merge template Paul foord 05:28, 2 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Add Lifestyle
Shouldn't AB/DL be added to the list of lifestyles?
