Talk:List of characters in the Chronicles of Amber

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You have new messages (last change).

Contents

[edit] == Misc comments ==

(Note: These were previously above the table of contents. Ladlergo 12:44, 10 August 2006 (UTC))

Should any mention be made that in the first book (Nine Princes in Amber) Random was stated to be Corwin's full brother and Eric was a half? Troyvarsity 20:01, 19 December 2006


What about Corwin's lawer friend from earth.

good point - he's now in (Bill Roth)

Also could someone list (with a spoiler warning) the two different three person factions that were going after the thrown. 131.247.44.177 16:13, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

See Sign of the Unicorn Percy Snoodle 15:35, 12 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Mandor == Random backwards

No, it isn't. That would be Modnar. Also, "More tellingly" of what? Percy Snoodle 20:03, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

OK - I'm removing those lines. Percy Snoodle 11:33, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
Mandor is an anagram for Random, though, which seems intentional. To take a Latin example, Vergil's Aeneid 4.1 has the line "At regina graui iamdudum saucia cura." Ovid, at Amores 2.1.7 has "atque aliquis iuvenum quo nunc ego saucius arcu." The similarity between both location of the lines and their content (both Dido and Ovid have been "wounded" by Cupid) is emphasized by the anagrammatic play on Vergil's "cura." (My information on these verses is from conversions with J.C. McKeown, who discusses them in his Amores : text, prolegomena, and commentary in four volumes, Vol. 3, 1998, Liverpool. He cites D.J. Califf's "Amores 2.1.7-8: A Programmatic Allusion by Anagram" in Classical Quarterly 47.2: 604-5, 1997.) Mike Nerdahl 21:24, 9 August 2006 (UTC)
Could you be a bit more specific in why it seems intentional? I can't follow you. Ladlergo 12:44, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
Ah, why indeed? My discussion above is more to argue that the name "Mandor" seems intentional and noticing that as such is significant. Wordplay and names seem important to the series, as (for example) the mirror city of Amber is called "Rebma." I have no obvious interpretation for the possible anagrammatical allusion between Mandor and Random, but perhaps << SPOILER ALERT !! >> it gives a hint to the ultimate ending of the series. Mandor tries to rule Chaos (becoming a mirror of Random ruling Amber) by compelling and secretly manipulating Merlin via the spikard. Whether or not this play on Random's name is intended is perhaps worthy of discussion, but - after all - may not be useful or solid enough for the main article. Mike Nerdahl 22:45, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Caine's provenance

Why Caine's mother is mentioned as unknown, while Zelazny's/Randall's "Visual Guide to Amber" tells that it was Rilga? I haven't checked lineages in Corwin's chronicles, but I suppose, there's no any discrepancy between these sources.

Actually there is a problem with Caine. In "The Hand of Oberon" Corwin says that Caine would be nect in succession (before Bleys). However in "Blood of Amber" Merlin refers to Caine as to full brother of Gerard and Julian (they were younger than Bleys). The Visual Guide takes Merlin's version. This website [1] explains this issue in the following way:

A7) What's the deal with Caine's parentage anyway?

 According to Corwin, Caine is just after him in the succession, yet
 Merlin says Caine, Julian, and Gerard are full brothers.  That should
 put Bleys and Brand ahead of Caine, unless Caine is illegitimate, but
 Corwin never mentions that.  An evaluation of the situation:

 a.) Both Corwin and Merlin are correct.
   i) Caine may be the illegitimate son of Rilga.  This may be the
   most popular explanation.  It's certainly the simplest.
   ii) Caine may be legitimate, and Oberon was involved in (yet
   another) bigamous marriage, knowingly or not, and/or some (more)
   strange timeflow problems.
   iii) Julian and Gerard should have been directly after Caine in
   the succession but have been delayed for unspecified reasons.
   (One might imagine Gerard accepting this without a fuss, but
   Julian would seem a different matter...)

 b.) Corwin is wrong but Merlin is correct.  It seems unlikely for
 Corwin to miss a small detail like who is right behind him in the
 succession (then again, at an earlier point, he thinks of himself
 and Random as full brothers).  This would imply Caine is somewhere
 else in the succession, perhaps immediately before Julian.

 c.) Merlin is wrong but Corwin is correct.  In this case, Caine is
 the son of an unnamed woman, whether legitimate or not, born sometime
 between Corwin and Fiona.  (The _Complete Amber Sourcebook_ takes the
 view that Caine is Corwin's full brother, born after him and before
 Deirdre, but hardly anyone else does.)

 d.) Both Corwin and Merlin are wrong.  Anything goes.  Make up your
 own thing.

Regards, Jasra 21:29, 4 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Ghostwheel

Does anyone else consider Ghostwheel to be a character who should be mentioned? I'd add it, but I'm not sure where it should go (under Merlin vs. new section including the Unicorn and the Serpent). Ladlergo 14:33, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

Yes, you can include Ghostwheel. Regards Jasra 21:35, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Random Punk?

It is written tha Random was regarded punk. In fact Random was a jazz musician and it was his som Martin who became punk. Jasra 21:35, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

That's also what my brain remembers. Didn't Martin have a mohawk at some point? Ladlergo 14:25, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
Mine remembers that, too, including the mohawk haircut. There's even a picture of him with this hairstyle in one of the Amber:DRPG books. --Bakabaka 20:43, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
You are correct. Note that he was called a 'punk', not regarded as punk, which in the era means something like a "snot nosed troublemaker".

[edit] Oberon's marriage to Cymnea

I do kind of remember either reading or hearing that Oberon declared his marriage with Cymnea null and void instead of just divorcing her. As a result, his three eldest sons (Benedict, Orsic and Finndo) would retroactively have been declared illegitimate and thus unable to succeed their father. Benedict didn't care, but Osric and Finndo either picked a fight with their dad or left. Does anyone remeber this as well? Can anyone verify whether this is in the canon? It might be something that my Amber:DRPG gamemaster made up and that got stuck in my mind as canon. --Bakabaka 20:54, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

True. It is also hinted that Benedict was the oldest.
I remember something like that. Benedict was the eldest (surviving, that they knew about) child of Oberon, and even though he was illegitimate (I don't remember why), all of his siblings would have stepped aside if he showed any interest in the throne (due to his military superiority, not birth order). Ladlergo 21:03, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
Ok, I'll be adding the gist of this to Benedict's description. -- Bakabaka 07:01, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
Talking about reference to anouncing the marriage with Cymnea void - you can find it in "Sign of Unicorn" when Corwin is explaining all the detais about succession to Ganelon. Jasra 22:27, 23 June 2006 (UTC)
I'm sorry, I read the chronicles in translation and thus can't make the proper reference. Can anyone? Thanks. --Bakabaka 11:11, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
If someone can give me a chapter or scene reference, I can look it up. Ladlergo 00:54, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Mandor == Latin Meaning

On another note about Mandor, "mando" in Latin is not "to trust" but "to command" (like "mandate") or "to entrust to," coming from the roots "manus" (hand) and "do" (to give). To trust is more along the lines of "credo," "fido," or "confido". Mike Nerdahl 21:25, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org../../../l/i/s/Talk%7EList_of_characters_in_the_Chronicles_of_Amber_91cc.html"